The who should be Mod and Mod Issues Thread

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

(Posts crossing over)

Everyone reads threads for context, as far as I honestly know.

"Very serious issues" are often a matter of degree; this fits with the perception of removing odd posts here and there.

As far as letting people be rude, it's arguably OK for an inside crowd, but it creates and perpetuates a very negative view of VJ for outsiders. Some is or is meant to be in good fun, we know, but do outsiders, devoid of the history and context, know this? I'd bet not. In addition, some extremely intelligent, deep-thinking, literate, elegantly expressive posters have added completely unnecessary personal digs at people -- comments completely unnecessary to support the eloquent points that otherwise stand on their own. What a crying shame it is when these elegant posters diminish their own material by adding unnecessary rude remarks.

What a crying shame it is that VJ moderation allows people to post content that advances bigotry and choose only to take action against the people who say it is bigoted. As I said, do you think it is reasonable that someone has posted a thread that suggests that Sweden is now hell on earth because Muslim immigrants are raping all the women? You seriously don't see a problem with that vs the TOS?

We had the guy who posted the image against Muslims being responsible for Benghazi and then insisted it was factually correct. What kind of message are you trying to say here - it's ok to post vile content so long as you do it in the right way?

As I said, let people get on with it, personal or not. You put a warning page on the off topic forums (a disclaimer that appears when they click into the forum) to let new users know what to expect and who they can contact should they have problems. That's your only obligation anyway.

Edited July 20, 2014 by Hail Ming!

[TBoneTX 45,005]

Truly sorry to hear that it hurt you as it did. If there's one totally true yet hardest-to-believe truth in the VJ Moderation program, it's that there is zero personal or intentional bias toward any member. Before anyone reacts sharply in disbelief, please repeat the foregoing aloud to yourself several times, and think hard about it.

Having to apply Moderation decisions often hurts the moderator personally. A very recent one, very likely referred to above, is a poignant example.

"Tempering justice with mercy," which can appear to be a game, is an art -- something else to ruminate upon.

The idea about the warning page makes sense and should be considered, I think. I'll make sure that it's brought up.

Must go to bed here, but keep the constructive ideas coming.

Edited July 20, 2014 by TBoneTX

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Fair enough, but it probably doesn't need to be said that there's a big difference between words and actions. And it's actions that are the problem.

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

Others at higher pay-grades would be involved, so I'm merely seizing the opportunity to ask the question while it's fresh: What system would you recommend as a replacement for the current one? Various technical and operational variables come into in play, so the more comprehensive the ideas, the better.

I wonder, too, whether the question and proposal belong in this thread/forum or in Site Discussion, which also gets a lot of views and input. If you posed the issue and your solutions there, the thread would be obvious to all, and the issue wouldn't get buried within a many-page thread in a forum that other members eschew. On the other hand, this thread might still be going straight to the eyes of Captain Ewok. What do you think?

I think,save one or two isolated incidents, things have been going fairly well the past month or two. If it ain't broke don't fix it

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

(Posts crossing over)

Everyone reads threads for context, as far as I honestly know.

"Very serious issues" are often a matter of degree; this fits with the perception of removing odd posts here and there.

As far as letting people be rude, it's arguably OK for an inside crowd, but it creates and perpetuates a very negative view of VJ for outsiders. Some is or is meant to be in good fun, we know, but do outsiders, devoid of the history and context, know this? I'd bet not. In addition, some extremely intelligent, deep-thinking, literate, elegantly expressive posters have added completely unnecessary personal digs at people -- comments completely unnecessary to support the eloquent points that otherwise stand on their own. What a crying shame it is when these elegant posters diminish their own material by adding unnecessary rude remarks.

That's why making this forum accessible by permission only would be a good thing. Most of us here, even if we don't agree, get along, albeit a few barbs here and there. I consider these people like family, even the Caba chicks and anti-gun commies like Teddy and MBD. LOL. Seriously I would welcome any of them in my home. As i said, I think what you guys have been doing the past couple of months, save one or two minor incidents,that are not really a big deal, is working fine.

I think you may want to consider that the users that scream the most, also might be causing the most problems .

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

As I said I want to know why you can get away with posting a thread about Muslims raping sweden to ruin but me posting an article from The Independent about a Israeli woman wanting to hand her passport in is considered baiting, despite numerous other threads posted by others on the same topic.

I think there is a degree personal bias at work in that decision, and numerous queries with various mods haven't shed light on it. That's fishy IMO.

I am not 'screaming' about it. I just think it's reasonable to get an answer for the question that was asked.

If the moderation team were to treat people like adults, you wouldn't get this sort of thing. As I said, as it stands reporting TOS violations is a game and the moderation team are essentially complicit in ruining the enjoyment of the message board for others by making selective, inconsistent decisions based on isolated reports without actually bothering to read the entirety of the thread.

If that weren't the case, then the thread Marc posted last week (http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/505359-a-simple-observation/) would have been closed right away, rather than what actually happened, which was a personal attack was removed and the thread left open until another mod decided that it was in fact a bait thread.

Consistency and transparency, that's not too much to ask. Is it?

Edited July 20, 2014 by Hail Ming!

[DavenRoxy 1,073]

(Posts crossing over)

Everyone reads threads for context, as far as I honestly know.

"Very serious issues" are often a matter of degree; this fits with the perception of removing odd posts here and there.

As far as letting people be rude, it's arguably OK for an inside crowd, but it creates and perpetuates a very negative view of VJ for outsiders. Some is or is meant to be in good fun, we know, but do outsiders, devoid of the history and context, know this? I'd bet not. In addition, some extremely intelligent, deep-thinking, literate, elegantly expressive posters have added completely unnecessary personal digs at people -- comments completely unnecessary to support the eloquent points that otherwise stand on their own. What a crying shame it is when these elegant posters diminish their own material by adding unnecessary rude remarks.

You prolly missed it, but I have suggested more than once that this sub forum be closed, ad in by application only. Current residents get in, of course, but new persons of interest should have to request access, and be granted only after reading two separate disclaimer clauses. Or something similar (which I would be happy to draft and let you mods edit).

That way, the general populace would not be subjected to any of our sordid discussions.

Perhaps an attempt at verifying age, too, though that is real tough nowadays.

[JohnR! 5,495]

You prolly missed it, but I have suggested more than once that this sub forum be closed, ad in by application only. Current residents get in, of course, but new persons of interest should have to request access, and be granted only after reading two separate disclaimer clauses. Or something similar (which I would be happy to draft and let you mods edit).

That way, the general populace would not be subjected to any of our sordid discussions.

Perhaps an attempt at verifying age, too, though that is real tough nowadays.

Why not simply create a page on Facebook or another social media site instead? It remains anonymous, access by invitation only and not subject to any moderation. That would be a true winner and would ensure anything goes.

Edited July 20, 2014 by JohnR!

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

Why not simply create a page on Facebook or another social media site instead? It remains anonymous, access by invitation only and not subject to any moderation. That would be a true winner and would ensure anything goes.

Because I don't want to revel my true identity. Being somewhat anonymous gives me a little bit more latitude to have more fun in here , being somewhat well known nationally, participating in here, if everyone knew who I really was would be too much exposure . What I love about the place is it's, relatively unknown outside immigration circles nd there is really no way to dig past my pseudo identity to figure out who i am .

[Karee 4,190]

Because I don't want to revel my true identity. Being somewhat anonymous gives me a little bit more latitude to have more fun in here , being somewhat well known nationally, participating in here, if everyone knew who I really was would be too much exposure . What I love about the place is it's, relatively unknown outside immigration circles nd there is really no way to dig past my pseudo identity to figure out who i am .

I already have your name, SS#, and a platinum amex card in your name just from information I've learned here on VJ. Hitting the strip club later this afternoon. Thanks!!

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

I already have your name, SS#, and a platinum amex card in your name just from information I've learned here on VJ. Hitting the strip club later this afternoon. Thanks!!

What time. I have to sneak out. My submissive Asian wife would beat me to death if she caught me going to a strip club. P.S. If you have a platinum AMEX, it probably belongs to one of the Liburls. Those guys are always loaded.

[JohnR! 5,495]

Because I don't want to revel my true identity. Being somewhat anonymous gives me a little bit more latitude to have more fun in here , being somewhat well known nationally, participating in here, if everyone knew who I really was would be too much exposure . What I love about the place is it's, relatively unknown outside immigration circles nd there is really no way to dig past my pseudo identity to figure out who i am .

You could just as well create a FB page using the same avatar you use here and you could invite only those whom you wanted and discuss any and all topics with no filter or moderation.

The idea of having a separate forum inside the forum is akin to immigrating to another country and expecting the local government to create a special set of rules to suit your needs because you don't want to interact with the locals or because you can't be bothered to abide by their rules.

Edited July 20, 2014 by JohnR!

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

You could just as well create a FB page using the same avatar you use here and you could invite only those whom you wanted and discuss any and all topics with no filter or moderation.

The idea of having a separate forum inside the forum is akin to immigrating to another country and expecting the local government to create a special set of rules to suit your needs because you don't want to interact with the locals or because you can't be bothered to abide by their rules.

Yes that idea is insane isn't it

[JohnR! 5,495]

Yes that idea is insane isn't it

Thanks for making my point.

QED.

Edited July 20, 2014 by JohnR!

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

There's no need to create a different venue, the current one is fine. Just make it clear to newbies that discussions do get heated and aren't always civil. You can still appeal to moderation, if needed, but petty personal squabbles shouldn't be the reason for posts being deleted or threads closed. Obviously the parts of the TOS that prohibit racism and pornographic content would still apply but you wouldn't have the constant babysitting that goes on. Just seems like a massive waste of energy.

Moderation should be solely concerned with the upper forums which are the primary reason people use the site. That content is what needs curating, not political discussion threads.

Edited July 20, 2014 by Hail Ming!