Canadian Citizen removed with 5 year ban - unique situation

[Avery Cates 1,141]

cold pop tarts and a can of coke.

My favorite breakfast.

You must know someone to have received the VIP treatment.

[webman 5]

That's a good question. Do I want to visit the US again is something I will have to ask myself and think about after being treated like a criminal. I was placed in handcuffs for a short time and cavity searched! (I might of had a rolled up IT certificate somewhere out of sight)!

I will help my friend as much as I can from Canada, and I will ship him the IT certificates to put in the store if I get them back from CBP.

If I do end up deciding to visit the US, I'll have to do a lot of reading and research into US immigration law and make sure I have the proper documents, visas etc needed for my reason to visit in the US. This will be all well prepared in advance.

A formal complaint will be given in writing and delivered to my local US consulate along with a copy of my RCMP security clearance in Canada. As well, I will bring a signed affidavit from the police chief in North Carolina regarding my character and intent. Yes, I have made some very good friends on both sides of the border!

After all this, maybe the US department that receives my information might just look at my situation again and actually believe that although I broke their laws, my intent was never to hurt, take away or harm an opportunity for employment from a US citizen, but instead to help my friend open his business and become successful enough to hire some US citizens as employees (not the many... many illegal Mexicans seeking work in NC).

So what is your plan now?

[webman 5]

entrapment

• In criminal law, entrapment is a practice whereby a law enforcement agent induces a person to commit a criminal offense that the person would have otherwise been unlikely to commit. It is a type of conduct that is generally frowned upon, and thus in many jurisdictions is a possible defense against criminal liability.

You sought entry as a tourist?

You said you worked illegally, entrapment would be to get you to work illegally.

[Avery Cates 1,141]

entrapment

• In criminal law, entrapment is a practice whereby a law enforcement agent induces a person to commit a criminal offense that the person would have otherwise been unlikely to commit. It is a type of conduct that is generally frowned upon, and thus in many jurisdictions is a possible defense against criminal liability.

You were prodded to admit to having done a criminal act. You weren't coerced into doing one an offense. You did that all on your own.

[owlboxes 10]

I'm certainly learning a lot by reading this thread. However, I am Canadian and familiar with Canadian laws, not US laws. In Canada if someone comes up here from the US to help someone without being paid, there isn't a penalty for it. I personally know many people who have helped friends and family do renovations etc from England, USA and other countries and they can still come back to Canada.

My friend in the US wasn't aware of this law either, and he should have done some research and informed me from what I'm gathering here.

Nonetheless there's nothing I can do. I can file a 212 waiver, but from what I researched it's like basically making a $585 donation because getting the waive is next to impossible and even with the waiver they can deny me entry without a valid reason.

It seems that no one can make a mistake and everyone from other countries needs to know US law before visiting the US. And you have no rights in the US if you aren't a permanent resident or US citizen.

Actually, the law is the same in Canada. If someone from a foreign country comes here and does any sort of work, even if it's not paid, they can get in trouble for it if customs finds out. There was a case where a man came over from England to help their friend, a Canadian citizen, remodel their basement. and upon admitting to it, was refused entry and sent back home.

Edited June 12, 2014 by owlboxes

[Harpa Timsah 13,258]

No need to kick the OP when he is down. I don't think illegal volunteer work is a criminal act. Relax.

[BBCC 16]

Are you aware how easy it is to obtain a TN work permit under NAFTA for software development work?

Not sure you qualify for one with the ban. I would DEFINATELY hire an immigration attorney who specializes in this specific type of case and demand a review and then a court hearing over this.

You have that right.

Do NOT roll over on this no matter what the CBP officer threatened you with. If you were coerced into signing the statement, and it is very clear that you were, stand up and fight it.

The ranks of the CBP are often nothing more than a job corps for the most obese, mentally retarded people. You have to expect this kind of criminal misconduct on their part but you don't have to take it. It will take time to resolve.

[Jawaree 718]

Dude its considered as work even though there was no pay, U took

it as food & lodging also U took USC jobs( not me but US govt speaking)

but all that work U did saved him a lot of money, once the company

is registered & get off the ground he can retain a company atty to file H1b

visa for U even with a ban, then after interview U file for wavier....

missrep is almost hard to overcomebut with a 5 yr ban since it seem in

a grey area an atty can try and work around U stating and never got

money for these jobs....did not read the other posts so I am just responding

to the first.

[ricnally 259]

I also forgot to mention that the CBP did not return my IT certificates and frames to me when I left. I had to call them after checking my suitcases when I stopped at a hotel for the night to find out they weren't given back to me. Hopefully they will send them back to me.

Remember, the CBP officers lied to me, my fiancé and my friend in the US. But, I guess that's ok as long as they got me deported for breaking a law I wasn't aware of. In Canada that's called entrapment when a law enforcement officer lies to you to get a confession out of you or admission to doing a wrongful act.

Don't think for one minute that we don't have entrapment in Canada. Happens all the time.

[Amy and Michael 21]

I am not so sure why everyone is being so tough on the OP. It's not like he was trying to skip the waiting line of getting the right visa, or avoid doing something the right way. I've been reading on this site for 5 years now, and married a citizen of another country. I get upset when people knowingly break our country's rules, but this isn't your standard case. I've visited many different countries, and when I first visited the UK to meet my now husband was shocked at the questioning I received. I went as a tourist to meet him. They assumed I wasn't coming home. After over an hour of questioning and being left to sit in a corner when they questioned my friend (at the time we weren't dating, just about to meet), I was terrified. Finally an upcoming paid trip to Florida finally made them realize I was going home; I wasn't lying about coming over to meet him and see some sights and then going home.

My main point is - does everyone on this site expect everyone to be a legal expert of the ins and outs of the law of every foreign country they intend to visit before visiting? Or, like the OP said, wouldn't it have been nice for CBP to explain that even though he wasn't paid - he was still working. I mean, fine, give him the ban - but isn't there a more respectful way of doing it? He didn't lie or mis-represent what he was doing. He simply didn't understand the finer details that even though he wasn't getting paid, he was still breaking the law.

Just curious...

[JE57 239]

To the OP, You made a mistake by working (free or not) in the USA. Now you are suggesting that you will continue to do work in the USA by continuing to help your friend from your abode in Canada. You're in IT so you have the ability to do work from abroad. BUT... before you get your friend's new business in trouble be sure that the businesses that hire him as a contractor for which you will render services from abroad are not going to get in trouble for doing so. I don't know the laws in this area but it would pay for your friend to do some research. Perhaps even people here know if you rendering services as part of a contract agreement between a US company and your USC friend would be allowed. And by rendering services I mean rather you get paid for it or not. What is the point of displaying your certificates in his store if you a citizen from Canada can not legally provide services. My point, you claim ignorance of the law which got you into this situation in the first place.. CBP has your name and your friend's name and knows your intent.. Don't allow yourself to fall afoul future laws that would embroil your friend's new business.

[Karam and Jamie 44]

Wow, I really hope you come to Canada and break a rule you didn't know about at the border. Then, be told about it and sent on your way being treated with dignity and respect the Canadian way!!!

I sat on a concrete slab for 9.5 hours and not given anything to eat or drink until I was 7 hours into the process in which I received cold pop tarts and a can of coke. I informed the CBP officers I had not eaten anything and was hungry and even willing to pay for food delivery!!! Sitting on a cold concrete slab certainly didn't help my enlarged prostate and made me have to go to the bathroom every half hour at which time I needed to ask permission to do so! I wasn't in a holding cell. I was in the lobby of the CBP office!

If I don't know the laws of your country since I am not from your country, then how am I supposed to know what they are unless someone informs me? No, not every office has IT certificates on the wall! I'm an honest person. If I truly wanted to intentionally enter the US for work and lie about it, I wouldn't of brought my original IT certifications in their original frames!!! I would have either not bring them at all or shipped them separately!!!

Your CBP officers have a job to do to protect their country and citizens from people entering the country to do harm to the country. I was not doing that! I was going to help a friend get his business set up so he would be able to open the doors sooner and help the US economy. All the while I was doing this for free and heading back to Canada after 3 weeks!!! wow, I guess I should of been executed in front of a firing squad instead right?

I don't agree with how they treated you. Of course it is great we have border patrol but some people abuse their positions, as we all know.

[Caryh 5,206]

Thank you for the kind words. I never had any malicious intent or intended on taking anything away from a US citizen. However, I was guilty before I even went to the border crossing since I was intending on helping my friend set up his business for a few days without being paid for it. I guess my morals are screwed up because I was going there to help him with good intentions, and in the eyes of the law it's wrong. Unless I paid the fee to get a work visa to help my friend for free, that would have been ok. So it's about money. It's always about money. Free or not someone has to be paid!

I wasn't helping him to hopefully one day have a job there. If it happened then great. I would have gotten a work visa if that happened. I was helping him because he's my friend and I've known him a long time.

There are numerous reasons those laws have been put into effect. The first is protectionism. Workers and unions are afraid the work market will get flooded if stringent laws are not in place. There is also the problem with businesses taking advantage of would be immigrants. Holding out hope for a work visa and making them work for nothing. Plus you run into the whole minimum wage issue. A business can't be bringing in people to work for nothing in the hopes of maybe getting a job later. Again a matter of protecting workers from unscrupulous business owners. Its sad they came down so heavily on you, but there's nothing you can really do about it.

[lonelywithouthim1 36]

Thanks for your reply. I didn't know that working for free would be considered working in the US? I have not found any resource on the internet that says that.

I also wasn't the only one helping! There were 2 other people (also friends) that are US citizens who were also helping for free. People still do that you know!

So, because I'm Canadian and was helping my friend for free it's a criminal act. But if other US citizens help him for free it's ok? So he can only accept free help from a US citizen! This makes no sense.

I agree, it doesn't make sense but when does any law make sense. I have to say, I would have made the same mistake but look at it from their point of view. People do and have done a lot of things to get into the U.S. and we also have U.S. citizens hiring illegals for less. To me, this could appear to be a business agreement between you two. Where you would assist in the establishment of the business and later you would be hired, the fact that your certificate would be used for the business makes my assumption even stronger. It could also appear that the U.S. citizen is taking advantage of a foreigner to avoid paying more for the skill and also avoid paying taxes , which is taking away from legal residents of the U.S.

How much would you have charged in Canada for the services you provided? and how much more for the business to use your certificate? or better yet, how much did your friend save by using you? You don't need to answer but I hope you can see how it's taking away from the legal residents here.

You could have done this as a good friend but unfortunately it's illegal. I've learned it's always best to follow the law of the land. Good Luck to you and hope you will get a chance to work here in the future legally :-)

[Mark88 184]

After all this, maybe the US department that receives my information might just look at my situation again and actually believe that although I broke their laws, my intent was never to hurt, take away or harm an opportunity for employment from a US citize

This will change nothing to your sitiuation. You admitted in breaking a law. Even if they write you something about how sorry they are, the letter will end with a big BUT. DOS won't care, you signed something. Either lawyer up, or accept your ban.