Americans split on prisoner swap of Taliban for U.S. soldier

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

IMO, a dangerous precedent has been set. And with the Taliban no less. Good thing we didn't take bin Laden alive, Obama probably would have included him in the deal too.

and I am seeing reports we knew his location for many months, why not go get him.

[spookyturtle 9,465]

and I am seeing reports we knew his location for many months, why not go get him.

Why go get him without giving up important Taliban prisoners?

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

Why go get him without giving up important Taliban prisoners?

Is that a rhetorical question. ? How about other Americans being held ?

[spookyturtle 9,465]

Is that a rhetorical question. ? How about other Americans being held ?

It was sarcasm.

[Pooky 3,784]

and I am seeing reports we knew his location for many months, why not go get him.

Why go get him without giving up important Taliban prisoners?

Reports say that the decision not to go and get him was taken, in part, because of the lives lost in the immediate aftermath of his disappearance and because, with the information they had, it was considered likely that he had deserted and was not captured in battle. Edited June 8, 2014 by Pooky

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

It was sarcasm.

This is a personal attack.. reported

[Karee 4,190]

Reports say that the decision not to go and get him was taken, in part, because of the lives lost in the immediate aftermath of his disappearance and because, with the information they had, it was considered likely that he had deserted and was not captured in battle.

I suspect they'll start playing up the alleged health problems as the reason for the sudden about face.

[Leatherneck 693]

I suspect they'll start playing up the alleged health problems as the reason for the sudden about face.

They've thrown another reason at the wall, hoping it'll stick.

Now, it's the Taliban threaten to kill Bergdahl if details of the agreement were leaked.

[UncleBeer 244]

Now, it's the Taliban threaten to kill Bergdahl if details of the agreement were leaked.

Which of course translates to: the preznit felt he couldn't trust Congress to keep his little secret. (which filters down to: he was afraid if asked, they'd say "no"). Just once, mr. preznit: try to do things the right way.

[Khev 5]

A two line paragraph starting with a premise that the last sentence outright negates. Classic. This is all about partisan politics.

The questions around the serviceman's conduct should be investigated and answered. But we don't leave the man behind as a prisoner of war on a mere suspicion that he may have deserted or conducted himself less than honorably. Last I checked, in this country the presumption of innocence still prevails - desires of the far right to put away with that presumption of innocence for anyone not aligned with them notwithstanding.

Now, if you want to talk precedent, then you're decades too late. Prisoner swaps happened prior to 2014 and prior to Obama. In fact, there isn't an administration in recent memory that hasn't done them. And yes, these are always done with our enemies. No exception.

I have said this before and I will say it again.

You can't leave behind someone who left you already.

He is a deserter in a time of war, he should be punished as such, but we should have never traded 5 high level commanders for a PFC. People died looking for him, He needs to be punished to the maximum extent under UCMJ.

[Karee 4,190]

You can't leave behind someone who left you already.

Pretty simple really.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Of course they have, but negotiating prisoner swaps with terrorists, not exactly. The more serious question and the biggest problem rational folks have with this, why release those particular five terrorist? I agree with not leaving Bergdahl behind, if for no other reason, so he can answer why he left the outpost. Now, if only the far left could bring themselves to admit Obama broke the law and releasing those particular five was a bad idea.

Putting aside the issues regarding Bergdahl going AWOL, It's not that hard to see that releasing those five terrorists is problematic, for U.S. national security and for the people of Afghanistan. However, a lack of plain ole common sense, blind support of Obama and his actions, or both would cause some to see things differently or not see at all.

So much emotion, so little fact. Obama has not negotiated a prisoner swap with any terrorist organization. Obama negotiated with the same Taliban that George W Bush negotiated with during his terms in office both prior to and after invading Afghanistan. The same Taliban that grew out of the Mujahideen that Reagan welcomed the the White House. This really goes back decades. A precedent this is not - not by any stretch of the imagination.

Now, the only foreign organization with the name "Taliban" in it is Tehrik-e Taliban Pakistan (TTP). That is not who the administration dealt and negotiated with. As fas as the US government is concerned, the Afghan Taliban is not a foreign terrorist organization. It wasn't one under Clinton, not under Bush and not now. Don't believe me? Take a look at the link to the State Department List of Foreign Terrorist Organization. Good Luck finding the Afghan Taliban in there.

Foreign Terrorist Organizations

Noteworthy, too, that there are former Bush administration officials on record confirming that the previous administration would have made the same decision, taking advantage of the opportunity to bring the serviceman home. And we all know just what the Republican theater would have been had Bergdahl been killed by the Taliban. They would have jumped up and down insisting that the Obama administration did not do enough to bring him home.

Releasing those five detainees? Not ideal. But what we're talking about here are five detainees that we had locked up in Gitmo for more than a decade and that we have - for all that time - been unable to build and case against. I mean seriously, at some point they would have been released anyway just like the rest of those that we could not bring charges against. Hundreds of them. If we can't think of any charges that we can make stick on these five over the last 12/13 years, what are the odds of building those cases over the next several years. More none than slim, I would say.

But none of that will matter. Right wingers will continue to be outraged. They would be outraged with any outcome of this POW affair. Bottom line is, they're still outraged that can't win a national election anymore and that they can hold on to statehouses and the US House only by gerrymandering the hell out this country. I'm not impressed with any of that. And I'm not falling for any of their whiny bullshite either.

I have said this before and I will say it again.

You can't leave behind someone who left you already.

He is a deserter in a time of war, he should be punished as such, but we should have never traded 5 high level commanders for a PFC. People died looking for him, He needs to be punished to the maximum extent under UCMJ.

He is? Who determined that? You?

Gotta ask: Who died and made you king?

More seriously, though, since you seem to have the inside track on this - does the US Army habitually promote deserters? Must be since Bergdahl was promoted not once but twice while in captivity. Had he not been brought home, he would have had his next promotion to Staff Sergeant later this month. Pretty good for a deserter, don't you think?

Edited June 8, 2014 by Mr. Big Dog

[Karee 4,190]

So much emotion, so little fact. Obama has not negotiated a prisoner swap with any terrorist organization. Obama negotiated with the same Taliban that George W Bush negotiated with during his terms in office both prior to and after invading Afghanistan. The same Taliban that grew out of the Mujahideen that Reagan welcomed the the White House. This really goes back decades. A precedent this is not - not by any stretch of the imagination.

Now, the only foreign organization with the name "Taliban" in it is Tehrik-e Taliban Pakistan (TTP). That is not who the administration dealt and negotiated with. As fas as the US government is concerned, the Afghan Taliban is not a foreign terrorist organization. It wasn't one under Clinton, not under Bush and not now. Don't believe me? Take a look at the link to the State Department List of Foreign Terrorist Organization. Good Luck finding the Afghan Taliban in there.

Foreign Terrorist Organizations

Noteworthy, too, that there are former Bush administration officials on record confirming that the previous administration would have made the same decision, taking advantage of the opportunity to bring the serviceman home. And we all know just what the Republican theater would have been had Bergdahl been killed by the Taliban. They would have jumped up and down insisting that the Obama administration did not do enough to bring him home.

Releasing those five detainees? Not ideal. But what we're talking about here are five detainees that we had locked up in Gitmo for more than a decade and that we have - for all that time - been unable to build and case against. I mean seriously, at some point they would have been released anyway just like the rest of those that we could not bring charges against. Hundreds of them. If we can't think of any charges that we can make stick on these five over the last 12/13 years, what are the odds of building those cases over the next several years. More none than slim, I would say.

But none of that will matter. Right wingers will continue to be outraged. They would be outraged with any outcome of this POW affair. Bottom line is, they're still outraged that can't win a national election anymore and that they can hold on to statehouses and the US House only by gerrymandering the hell out this country. I'm not impressed with any of that. And I'm not falling for any of their whiny bullshite either.

He is? Who determined that? You?

Gotta ask: Who died and made you king?

More logic fail from you. Not surprising really. So since former GWB administration officials (no source for your assertion BTW) allegedly would have made the same deal, that makes this deal ok? Pretty funny.

Aren't you the one that constantly rails against GWB and the 8 years he was in office? Now that you're defending your man in the white house, it's perfectly fine to cite former Bush administration officials to make your case. I'd also bet that if the GWB administration made this same deal, you would be screaming bloody murder about it.

You hyper-partisanship is showing again. As usual.

Edited June 8, 2014 by Karee

[Khev 5]

So much emotion, so little fact. Obama has not negotiated a prisoner swap with any terrorist organization. Obama negotiated with the same Taliban that George W Bush negotiated with during his terms in office both prior to and after invading Afghanistan. The same Taliban that grew out of the Mujahideen that Reagan welcomed the the White House. This really goes back decades. A precedent this is not - not by any stretch of the imagination.

Now, the only foreign organization with the name "Taliban" in it is Tehrik-e Taliban Pakistan (TTP). That is not who the administration dealt and negotiated with. As fas as the US government is concerned, the Afghan Taliban is not a foreign terrorist organization. It wasn't one under Clinton, not under Bush and not now. Don't believe me? Take a look at the link to the State Department List of Foreign Terrorist Organization. Good Luck finding the Afghan Taliban in there.

Foreign Terrorist Organizations

Noteworthy, too, that there are former Bush administration officials on record confirming that the previous administration would have made the same decision, taking advantage of the opportunity to bring the serviceman home. And we all know just what the Republican theater would have been had Bergdahl been killed by the Taliban. They would have jumped up and down insisting that the Obama administration did not do enough to bring him home.

Releasing those five detainees? Not ideal. But what we're talking about here are five detainees that we had locked up in Gitmo for more than a decade and that we have - for all that time - been unable to build and case against. I mean seriously, at some point they would have been released anyway just like the rest of those that we could not bring charges against. Hundreds of them. If we can't think of any charges that we can make stick on these five over the last 12/13 years, what are the odds of building those cases over the next several years. More none than slim, I would say.

But none of that will matter. Right wingers will continue to be outraged. They would be outraged with any outcome of this POW affair. Bottom line is, they're still outraged that can't win a national election anymore and that they can hold on to statehouses and the US House only by gerrymandering the hell out this country. I'm not impressed with any of that. And I'm not falling for any of their whiny bullshite either.

He is? Who determined that? You?

Gotta ask: Who died and made you king?

Let's not try to confuse facts like you are doing. Stop building your straw man. You are right, the Taliban are not on the State Department list of Foreign Terrorist Organizations. However, that is meaningless in this case as the Haqqani Network is who we negotiated the release with as they are the ones who had Bergdahl. The Haqqani network was listed in June of 2012 buy this administration. Never let the facts get in the way of a good partisan rant.

I will take the word of my fellow soldiers who served with him and truly know him. They served with honor and distinction, Bergdahl did not.

let me guess you believe the story that he fell behind on a patrol?

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

So much emotion, so little fact. Obama has not negotiated a prisoner swap with any terrorist organization. Obama negotiated with the same Taliban that George W Bush negotiated with during his terms in office both prior to and after invading Afghanistan. The same Taliban that grew out of the Mujahideen that Reagan welcomed the the White House. This really goes back decades. A precedent this is not - not by any stretch of the imagination.

Now, the only foreign organization with the name "Taliban" in it is Tehrik-e Taliban Pakistan (TTP). That is not who the administration dealt and negotiated with. As fas as the US government is concerned, the Afghan Taliban is not a foreign terrorist organization. It wasn't one under Clinton, not under Bush and not now. Don't believe me? Take a look at the link to the State Department List of Foreign Terrorist Organization. Good Luck finding the Afghan Taliban in there.

Foreign Terrorist Organizations

Noteworthy, too, that there are former Bush administration officials on record confirming that the previous administration would have made the same decision, taking advantage of the opportunity to bring the serviceman home. And we all know just what the Republican theater would have been had Bergdahl been killed by the Taliban. They would have jumped up and down insisting that the Obama administration did not do enough to bring him home.

Releasing those five detainees? Not ideal. But what we're talking about here are five detainees that we had locked up in Gitmo for more than a decade and that we have - for all that time - been unable to build and case against. I mean seriously, at some point they would have been released anyway just like the rest of those that we could not bring charges against. Hundreds of them. If we can't think of any charges that we can make stick on these five over the last 12/13 years, what are the odds of building those cases over the next several years. More none than slim, I would say.

But none of that will matter. Right wingers will continue to be outraged. They would be outraged with any outcome of this POW affair. Bottom line is, they're still outraged that can't win a national election anymore and that they can hold on to statehouses and the US House only by gerrymandering the hell out this country. I'm not impressed with any of that. And I'm not falling for any of their whiny bullshite either.

He is? Who determined that? You?

Gotta ask: Who died and made you king?

More seriously, though, since you seem to have the inside track on this - does the US Army habitually promote deserters? Must be since Bergdahl was promoted not once but twice while in captivity. Had he not been brought home, he would have had his next promotion to Staff Sergeant later this month. Pretty good for a deserter, don't you think?

A. Bush's fault . can also be "conjure up any conservative in history that even remotely did anything similar to what is going on today. It makes it ok.