Inheritence---islamic or not?

[Henia 11]

Life insurance: Thou Insurance has become an essential part of business throughout the world, in Islam any type of insurance (life, home, auto, etc) is haraam. Insurance inevitably involves an element of gharar, “uncertainty” which means for the everyday person...the sale of an “undefined” or unspecified product.

Wills: Many Muslims (Salafis) may refuse to accept wills (if there any direct descendants-sons and duaghters) but looking at: (2:180) "It has been enjoined upon you that when you approach death and you are leaving behind your personal property, make a testament according to law for your parents and others close to you. This has been enjoined upon Muttaqeen as a duty from Allah. (The distribution of left-over property shall take place after the provisions of the 'will' have been fulfilled (4:11)."

One may see that the Quran leaves wills and inhertiance as something very important for a Muslim (anyone really) to ponder before death.

The following verses of Surah Al-Maaidah (5th Chapter of the Quran) invite some more though:

(5:106-108) "O you who believe! When death approaches any of you, take witnesses amongst yourselves while making testament; two just men of your own (brethren); or others from outside, if you are journeying through the land and your own men are not available and the chance of death befalls you

Witnesses(2) are needed, of course and judges shall detain them (in the masjid) after prayers (since masjids are the court-rooms). The judges, imems or respected elders shall have them them both swear by Allah. Rough translations:

We wish not to take in this any worldly gains, even if the beneficiary be our near relative; we shall not hide evidence before Allah; if we do, we shall become censurable.

The distribution of the assets of the deceased (in all cases) shall take place after the fulfillment of the will and the payment of debts against the deceased. If the will does not cover the deceased assets or the deceased has not left a will, the distribution of the assets shall done,then their spouse comes first, cos of their mutual relationship is through matrimony and not by lineage.Then come the children and other family members.

If the deceased left no will or something has been left after the processing of the will, the distribution of this surplus property shall be according to verses (4:11-12).

. Allah Himself (Who knows all) has fixed their shares. It means that although the deceased had the knowledge as to whoever was more deserving (the reason, leaving a testament was made incumbent); but since the person could not leave a will or the will does not cover the all the assets, Allah, instead of leaving the matter to you, has Himself determined the shares.

Thes structure of inheritance amoung one's children is addressed in the chapter called Nisa (4th chapter of the Qurán) :"

As regards your children's (inheritance), to each boy a share equal to that of two girls, i.e. one girl = 1/3 and one boy = 2/3.

Scholars have agrued that is cos a male is responsible for the maintenance of the family, not the female. So the male is more need then the female to inherit. To each their own, to agrue this ....

In chapter 4 of the Quran, it further explains when a person has died leaving no dependents:

(4:12). "O Rasool! You are being asked to give further details. Tell them that Allah ordains:

If a person dies leaving no parents or children as heirs, the distribution of his property (wealth) shall be as follows:

o If the deceased is a male and has only one sister, her portion shall be half of his bequest;

o If there are two sisters (or more), their (combined) share shall be 2/3 (also see 4/11 for share in case of more than two sisters);

o If both the inheritors are brothers and sisters, the entire left-over property shall be theirs. The principle of "share of two females equal to share of one male" shall apply (4/11);

o If the deceased is a woman, the heir of her left-over property shall be her brother.

In the end, we all have to remember these are the limits laid down by Allah(swt) with which an Islamic State shall frame its by-laws remaining within these hints. "Limits" means the framework within which an Islamic State is legally authorised to make by-laws. These limits are abiding but the by-laws framed within these limits shall be tranfroming according to the constraints of our changing times.

And as far as what Peezy asked about owning property (or rather inhertining it) from your spouse in their native country.... I have talked about this quite abit with my husband. Since we both have inherited propertys from our parents. (mine not in a Muslims, no none of the Islamic laws were observed) We both have had difficulties due to not having a will in place to distrubute the assets. I was lucky more luckier then my husband, who had went throu a terrible 4 year court battle to gain all of his inhertience. In the end, of cos he lost the case... having to give up half of his inheritence, due to the fact his father never set up a will and his mother was left widowed and penniless. A very sorry plight for widowed women (in many countries including MENA where women have no voice) I am not really worried about inheriting anything from my husband, since I have my own and also have a profession where I could support myself and my children. Even so we have decided, due to our experiences and common sense that we will be having a last testament.

[frndly1 1]

My husband had a hard time discussing that topic also. I think most people do.

I am not sure why because there are only 2 things (that I know of) that are certain you are born and you die.

I have had 2 co workers families that have been confronted with a member of their family will leave them (die, due to cancer) in less than a year and their family member can no longer work. I makes you stop and think.

Shortly after Mohammed came to America, I lost a co-worker in a car accident. I asked Mohammed that IF that had happened to him where would he want to be buried. He said 'Jordan of course'. He said to leave those details to his male relatives here. And, no, it was not a subject he wanted to discuss any further.

Jackie

[frndly1 1]

Henia, Thanks for the information. I greatly appreciate it.

Edited January 10, 2007 by frndly1

[Bosco 1]

How don't they? I don't mean this to sound challenging (cannot convey tone), but I am curious what you mean.

From my understanding they dont believe in life insurance or create wills. I do understand that those that can buy property and it gets passed on (not equally).

Can you give me some examples of how Islamic protect their families for the future?

I am trying to gain knowledge. I can only go by what someone tells me or what I may have read in passing.

I know some Americans dont plan for the future.

I think people define wills differently. 2/3 of a Muslim's estate is supposed to be dispensed according to Islamic inheritance laws. The other 1/3 is up to their choosing. Sunni thought is usually that it can only go to someone not already inheriting. Shia allow for this 1/3 to go to a person/people already inheriting. Or, they can let the entire estate be divided up according to Islamic inheritance laws. So a will in the sense that they are choosing what goes where, no. But there is this 1/3 to account for and that is often done in a will. In the United States, if a Muslim wants to follow Islamic inheritance laws, a will is absolutely necessary, because otherwise it will follow state laws, and this will obviously be different.

Women do inherit less according ot Islamic law, but male relatives are expected to take care of women. Now, in an imperfect world where this does not always happen, it does seem unfair that a woman's share is less.

There are different opinions on life insurance. Obviously, life insurance did not exist in the time of the Prophet, so these are ONLY opinions based on interpretation. Islamonline has something on the different views http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/Satelli...d=1119503543412 Recently I have been reading more and more about Islamic insurance that is becoming more commmonly available, including life insurance. The islamic insurances are usually referred to as "takaful".

Edited January 10, 2007 by Bosco

[frndly1 1]

Thanks for the link.

Now I have a questions from the link?

"These two conditions rule out regular fixed return life insurance because the value of the policy is the outcome of investment premiums at a compounded rate of interest, (while variable - return life is permissible if the funds are invested in the Shari'ah approved stocks or mutual funds). "

What are Shari'ah approved stocks and mutual funds? I thought interest/dividens are forbidden.

I think people define wills differently. 2/3 of a Muslim's estate is supposed to be dispensed according to Islamic inheritance laws. The other 1/3 is up to their choosing. Sunni thought is usually that it can only go to someone not already inheriting. Shia allow for this 1/3 to go to a person/people already inheriting. Or, they can let the entire estate be divided up according to Islamic inheritance laws. So a will in the sense that they are choosing what goes where, no. But there is this 1/3 to account for and that is often done in a will. In the United States, if a Muslim wants to follow Islamic inheritance laws, a will is absolutely necessary, because otherwise it will follow state laws, and this will obviously be different.

Women do inherit less according ot Islamic law, but male relatives are expected to take care of women. Now, in an imperfect world where this does not always happen, it does seem unfair that a woman's share is less.

There are different opinions on life insurance. Obviously, life insurance did not exist in the time of the Prophet, so these are ONLY opinions based on interpretation. Islamonline has something on the different views http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/Satelli...d=1119503543412 Recently I have been reading more and more about Islamic insurance that is becoming more commmonly available, including life insurance. The islamic insurances are usually referred to as "takaful".

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Something that didn't seem to come up, so far. Under Islamic law, a Muslim cannot inherit from a non-Muslim and a non-Muslim cannot inherit from a Muslim, nt even if they're married to each other. So in Muslim countries, this may be a consideration for mixed couples to reseach.

[frndly1 1]

Do you have reference material for us to read that talks about that? Interesting.

Something that didn't seem to come up, so far. Under Islamic law, a Muslim cannot inherit from a non-Muslim and a non-Muslim cannot inherit from a Muslim, nt even if they're married to each other. So in Muslim countries, this may be a consideration for mixed couples to reseach.

[melly 0]

My fiance and I have discussed some of these issues but until we're married there's not so much to do about it except talk.

I did have a concern, as someone pointed out, that women don't get as much as men, and seeing as how I don't have any men to "take care of me" if my husband should die, it doesn't make sense for me to get less money. I will be the only one to support myself unless someone else from his family wants to "take me in" and we're living in Egypt at the time.

He agreed it didn't seem fair but pointed out that he could leave me money or property or whatever he wanted to specify in a will, and that it would be handled before the rest of the inheritance is handed out. (I hope I got that right, it's been a while since we talked about it)

I've also read about a Muslim inheriting from a non-Muslim and vice-versa. I was curious because my parents are not Muslim and yet their estate will be split between my brother and I. From what I read, and of course this could be wrong, you can take gifts from non-Muslims when they die. I don't know the exact rules in the difference between being in a will or some other way to make it okay, but if I have no Muslims in my family except for on my husbands side, it seems only fitting that I should have a chance to inherit some money since if/when my husband dies some of his money will go to his parents etc.

We don't have things finalized of course but we will take care of it when it becomes applicable.

[Donna A 4]

my husband has a house in syria. his family can have it if he dies. what good will it do me anyway? we have already descussed that. if he has life insurance and stuff here then it will be mine...what good would it do his family there?

What good will it do his family there? You mean if he dies, has $1million policy, has a will that says you get 1/4 and the rest goes to his parents, you're telling me $750,000 won't do them any good there?

first of all my husband doesnt have a million dollar policy and i can assure u he never will unless i pay for it because he is too cheap to pay for a policy. he has now a $10,000 policy thru work and i have another $5,000 that i buy for him thru my work. that is his only assets in the united states to date. if he were to die today then some of that money would be used to send his dead body back to syria for burial.

secondly he has more assests in syria then he does here. so trust me im sure his family would not send me a penny of it if he died. the value of his house and his life insurance over there (10,000) would go to them.

as i see it i would not even get a 1/4.

anyway im not muslim so i guess we would not be doing it the islamic way anyway.

Edited January 10, 2007 by donnaal

[doodlebug 3]

I"m so confused and will go to bed after posting this.

So am I understanding right that when my parents die, even though I'm the designated administrator, I won't get a dime 'cause now I'm muslim??? I don't think that's right. Maybe if we were living in Egypt or something but in the US I don't think any of these laws apply, right?

[MHandMB 0]

As far as flying the body back to the home country- I am totally confused on this, but Amed seems to think that the Algerian government would take care of the costs of this. I'm skeptical of this. Does anyone know how that works in ME/NA countries? I'm sure each country is different, but I've never heard of the home country flying back the body for burial free of charge.

[melly 0]

I"m so confused and will go to bed after posting this.

So am I understanding right that when my parents die, even though I'm the designated administrator, I won't get a dime 'cause now I'm muslim??? I don't think that's right. Maybe if we were living in Egypt or something but in the US I don't think any of these laws apply, right?

Well, you're still Muslim but since your parents aren't and you haven't told them of how it works, I *guess* it would be up to you to refuse the money if that's what you were supposed to do. I don't think it matters where you live. You're just as Muslim in the US as you are in Egypt.

Like I stated in my post, I *think* you can take money if it's done in a certain way, however I'm not certain about that.

[Jenn! 918]

Melly,

From what you know, does that apply to *any* gift from a non-muslim, or strictly inheritance?

[melly 0]

Melly,

From what you know, does that apply to *any* gift from a non-muslim, or strictly inheritance?

I really am not sure. I have a friend who is a very "strict" Muslim and she will accept gifts from others (like Christmas or birthday or whatever) but will only give gifts to people at Eid.

As far as I'm aware it's okay to take gifts from people, but maybe someone more knowledgeable can answer for sure.

[mybackpages 0]

I"m so confused and will go to bed after posting this.

So am I understanding right that when my parents die, even though I'm the designated administrator, I won't get a dime 'cause now I'm muslim??? I don't think that's right. Maybe if we were living in Egypt or something but in the US I don't think any of these laws apply, right?

I am not an expert on the inheritance laws by any stretch of the immagination, but Islam provides a total way of life. All the pieces have to fit together right? So how can the inheritance laws tell you as a converted Muslim not to touch the inhertiance of your parents simply because they never converted? If marriage is allowed between Muslims and people of the book, then how does this inconsistence work?

What I have noticed in studying the evolution of fiqh (law) is that some later scholars seem to stress the clear separation between muslim and non-muslims perferring to keep people of the book closer to non-muslims than muslims. It never made sense to me. A non-muslim spouse or a muslim convert still has a family and can never discount this family. The muslim spouse must also embrace this family.

sign- its too early to arge this. hope it made sense