Issues you may need to discuss with your MENA SO

[mercy 1]

If Green-eyed girl considers herself Palestinian, who is anyone here to contradict that? Who here knows her family history, what ties they keep with Palestine, how often they visit, if they still have family there, etc. I'm willing to be no one.

I'm of mixed European descent, like many North Americans, but I consider myself solely Canadian. I actually get sort of annoyed when people ask me where I'm from/what I am. That's just me though, doesn't mean everyone has to do it. For my family, we don't maintain any kind of ties with our European heritage, we don't even know if we have any family over there, so it wouldn't really make sense to say "I'm German" or whatever. I grew up in a small town that is almost predominantly Portuguese. The kids I went to school with were mostly 1st and 2nd generation Canadians, but all of them considered themselves Portuguese first, even though none of them had ever been there. If a family immigrates, but holds close the ties to the country they left, it's easy to see how even generations later could consider themselves to be from that country. Particularly if they were forced out of said country.

If my husband and I stay in the US and have children here, by right of my citizenship they will also be Canadian citizens. They will be able to have a Canadian passport, and even if they never live there, I would hope they hold Canada close to them. The same would go for if we moved to Canada, they would be US citizens by right of my husband being a USC. No matter what, our kids will be citizens of both countries and will be raised to think of themselves that way.

[Kez/JWolf 6]

All this ####### about I am 5th generation whatever is just hot air.... if you were not born there and dont live there then you dont come from there....

Kez

then how did they get here if they didn't come from there?

Who said I was FROM Palestine anyway? My great grandfather and grandfather were. I said I'm Palestinian, and I am. Keep your voluntary immigrant stories out of this. We didn't leave voluntarily, we were pushed out. There's a difference. Think of it as if China finally gave up Tibet so the Dali Lama could go home. Much more like that than Europeans escaping Europe on their own. Lots of you went to Palestine, btw.

You are no more Palestinian than I am Greman.... My Great Grandfather was driven out of Gremany so dont start your ###### on me... you are american of palestinian desent... that is all nothing more...

And as far as I am aware there is nothing stopping you moving to Palestine at this time if you feel so close to that culture.... then you will be an American in Palestine... wont that be fun.

Kez

i've looked and i can't find a gremany on the map.

It was a test to see how well you were reading my posts....

Kez

it really threw me when you said greman. for some reason, i first thought it said gremlin.

Oh.... there a good Idea... I could apply for a Gremlin passport then I could move to a bit of land and put up a fence and call it Gremlinstine.... Just think there could then be people 100 years from now that will live in America and claim to be Gremlins.....

Kez

[Sofiyya 1,687]

If Green-eyed girl considers herself Palestinian, who is anyone here to contradict that? Who here knows her family history, what ties they keep with Palestine, how often they visit, if they still have family there, etc. I'm willing to be no one.

I'm of mixed European descent, like many North Americans, but I consider myself solely Canadian. I actually get sort of annoyed when people ask me where I'm from/what I am. That's just me though, doesn't mean everyone has to do it. For my family, we don't maintain any kind of ties with our European heritage, we don't even know if we have any family over there, so it wouldn't really make sense to say "I'm German" or whatever. I grew up in a small town that is almost predominantly Portuguese. The kids I went to school with were mostly 1st and 2nd generation Canadians, but all of them considered themselves Portuguese first, even though none of them had ever been there. If a family immigrates, but holds close the ties to the country they left, it's easy to see how even generations later could consider themselves to be from that country. Particularly if they were forced out of said country.

If my husband and I stay in the US and have children here, by right of my citizenship they will also be Canadian citizens. They will be able to have a Canadian passport, and even if they never live there, I would hope they hold Canada close to them. The same would go for if we moved to Canada, they would be US citizens by right of my husband being a USC. No matter what, our kids will be citizens of both countries and will be raised to think of themselves that way.

Thank you!

All this ####### about I am 5th generation whatever is just hot air.... if you were not born there and dont live there then you dont come from there....

Kez

then how did they get here if they didn't come from there?

Who said I was FROM Palestine anyway? My great grandfather and grandfather were. I said I'm Palestinian, and I am. Keep your voluntary immigrant stories out of this. We didn't leave voluntarily, we were pushed out. There's a difference. Think of it as if China finally gave up Tibet so the Dali Lama could go home. Much more like that than Europeans escaping Europe on their own. Lots of you went to Palestine, btw.

You are no more Palestinian than I am Greman.... My Great Grandfather was driven out of Gremany so dont start your ###### on me... you are american of palestinian desent... that is all nothing more...

And as far as I am aware there is nothing stopping you moving to Palestine at this time if you feel so close to that culture.... then you will be an American in Palestine... wont that be fun.

Kez

i've looked and i can't find a gremany on the map.

It was a test to see how well you were reading my posts....

Kez

it really threw me when you said greman. for some reason, i first thought it said gremlin.

Oh.... there a good Idea... I could apply for a Gremlin passport then I could move to a bit of land and put up a fence and call it Gremlinstine.... Just think there could then be people 100 years from now that will live in America and claim to be Gremlins.....

Kez

You're too late. Thousands of Gremlins imigrated to the US in the 1970s from the AMC.

[Reynaldo 0]

Oh.... there a good Idea... I could apply for a Gremlin passport then I could move to a bit of land and put up a fence and call it Gremlinstine.... Just think there could then be people 100 years from now that will live in America and claim to be Gremlins.....

Kez

Just... stay... away... from... water....

Pleeeeease!

[Jenn! 918]

Next, you initiate a very insulting "who's more Palestinian than who" game – a game which you subsequently have the nerve to blame me for starting. But it was actually you, with this remark:

I AM Palestinian, as is my family; I'm not just married to one. I don't need a lecture on how it is there or the atrocities that have and do go on or who gets along with whom. Why you think I do is not because of anything I actually said. I'm not interested in a "who's more offended by the Israeli government than who. No one has to agree here, but I would GREATLY appreciate it if emotion doesn't overtake reading comprehension, opening the door for negative assumptions.

When I responded that my husband and all his family ARE born-and-raised Palestinians, and that they agree with what I'd written about their attitudes about Jews and Israel, you became quite upset, and began to accuse me of starting some kind of “ranking” game. You can’t even admit that it was you yourself who started it, in an attempt to dismiss my responses. If it’s such a terrible argument to make, why in the world did you say it in the first place ?

I answered you that being of a certain heritage does not turn you into a person who lives in that country, and I used my own family to make a point. You either didn't get it at all, or consciously chose to be offended about things I never said or even insinuated.

Let me break it down more simply for you: one's heritage (just like one's marriage) does not turn one an "instant expert" in anything. Babies are not born knowing history and politics and culture. They have to learn it. But attaining this knowledge is not dependant on one’s ethnicity -- it's possible for anyone to be come an expert on any subject in the world. One does not need to be a 4th generation American-born Palestinian to have credible or even extensive knowledge of the Palestinian-Israeli conflict. And "not" being Palestinian oneself does not preclude one from attaining that knowledge. In fact, many experts on the Palestinian-Israeli conflict are not Palestinian (or Israeli) at all.

It's really too bad that everyone seems to have skipped over your excellent post and completely missed the beginning of what prompted all of the current posts regarding nationality.

I am of Italian descent, for example. I would never claim to be an authority on Italian culture or poltics simply because of where my ancestors came from. And neither would I try to discount someone else's well-informed opinion on Italy simply because they were not of Italian descent.

[UmmSqueakster 54]

Next, you initiate a very insulting "who's more Palestinian than who" game – a game which you subsequently have the nerve to blame me for starting. But it was actually you, with this remark:

I AM Palestinian, as is my family; I'm not just married to one. I don't need a lecture on how it is there or the atrocities that have and do go on or who gets along with whom. Why you think I do is not because of anything I actually said. I'm not interested in a "who's more offended by the Israeli government than who. No one has to agree here, but I would GREATLY appreciate it if emotion doesn't overtake reading comprehension, opening the door for negative assumptions.

When I responded that my husband and all his family ARE born-and-raised Palestinians, and that they agree with what I'd written about their attitudes about Jews and Israel, you became quite upset, and began to accuse me of starting some kind of “ranking” game. You can’t even admit that it was you yourself who started it, in an attempt to dismiss my responses. If it’s such a terrible argument to make, why in the world did you say it in the first place ?

I answered you that being of a certain heritage does not turn you into a person who lives in that country, and I used my own family to make a point. You either didn't get it at all, or consciously chose to be offended about things I never said or even insinuated.

Let me break it down more simply for you: one's heritage (just like one's marriage) does not turn one an "instant expert" in anything. Babies are not born knowing history and politics and culture. They have to learn it. But attaining this knowledge is not dependant on one’s ethnicity -- it's possible for anyone to be come an expert on any subject in the world. One does not need to be a 4th generation American-born Palestinian to have credible or even extensive knowledge of the Palestinian-Israeli conflict. And "not" being Palestinian oneself does not preclude one from attaining that knowledge. In fact, many experts on the Palestinian-Israeli conflict are not Palestinian (or Israeli) at all.

It's really too bad that everyone seems to have skipped over your excellent post and completely missed the beginning of what prompted all of the current posts regarding nationality.

I am of Italian descent, for example. I would never claim to be an authority on Italian culture or poltics simply because of where my ancestors came from. And neither would I try to discount someone else's well-informed opinion on Italy simply because they were not of Italian descent.

[~Jackie~ 30]

Back on topic "Issues you may need to discuss with your MENA SO'.............

How many years til you want a return visit to your country?

Will you be filing for any of your family to come over after you get citizenship?

Do you soak your rice for 30 minutes before cooking?

What kind of empolyment will you seek upon receiving your EAD?

Do you want to live in a city or the country?

Anybody else have issues that should have been discussed?

Jackie

[chri'stina 190]

All this ####### about I am 5th generation whatever is just hot air.... if you were not born there and dont live there then you dont come from there....

Kez

then how did they get here if they didn't come from there?

Who said I was FROM Palestine anyway? My great grandfather and grandfather were. I said I'm Palestinian, and I am. Keep your voluntary immigrant stories out of this. We didn't leave voluntarily, we were pushed out. There's a difference. Think of it as if China finally gave up Tibet so the Dali Lama could go home. Much more like that than Europeans escaping Europe on their own. Lots of you went to Palestine, btw.

You are no more Palestinian than I am Greman.... My Great Grandfather was driven out of Gremany so dont start your ###### on me... you are american of palestinian desent... that is all nothing more...

And as far as I am aware there is nothing stopping you moving to Palestine at this time if you feel so close to that culture.... then you will be an American in Palestine... wont that be fun.

Kez

There was a debate/discussion on this in off topic awhile ago. Many Americans, including myself, want to know where our families originated from. And it is important to us. Just because I was born in America does not mean I should be ignorant of my family's heritage. I am many different nationalities combined, while being a USC born in the US. It seemed in the discussion in off topic that British people seemed to have the most annoyance with us Americans who like to say what nationalities we are. Well that's just how some of us are, and you can't tell us we aren't allowed to say, for instance..I'm Italian, Czech, Ukranian, Scottish, English, etc yes I am a lot of things. lol.

My future children will be half Indian. Just because they are going to be born in the US are they supposed to pretend they aren't Indian since they weren't born there? No. So you can argue your side as much as you want, many of us Americans will not ignore our ancestry. America is a newer country, we all came from somewhere (unless you are 100% native american) and it's important to know where.

ETA: Of course I am no expert of any of the nationalities that I am, because it's all so mixed and some info is lost to the past.

Edited January 8, 2007 by stina&suj

[Sofiyya 1,687]

I missed nothing, I was there. If someone doesn't want rank pulled on them, they shouldn't try to pull rank on others. If I do it, I can take it and it is sooo over with yesterday's news. Nothing gained by raising a rotting corpse, although there will always be those who try. If this is the comeback strategy, it's lame.

[UmmSqueakster 54]

Back on topic "Issues you may need to discuss with your MENA SO'.............

How many years til you want a return visit to your country?

Also how often would you like to visit? For how long? Can I come with?

Will you be filing for any of your family to come over after you get citizenship?

Would you like them to visit? Which family members would you like to come over for a visit? How often? How long? If it's the parents, how will we pay for health insurance for them?

Do you soak your rice for 30 minutes before cooking?

Any food cooking peculularities? Like rubbing flour on chicken, then letting it sit with pepper and salt to remove the chicken smell?

Definately roll with the punches when it comes to cooking. Even if something seems illogical, if it makes him feel better, I do it.

Do you want to live in a city or the country?

Even more in depth, what kind of neighborhood? We live in a fairly large city (especially for a small town girl like myself), but we live in a more residential area. Tamer really really really misses seeing people walking outside, so we're hopefully going to move to a busier part of town, or another city that is busy like Chicago.

[Jenn! 918]

If someone doesn't want rank pulled on them, they shouldn't try to pull rank on others.

Absolutely.

[ya falaha! 0]

I agree, Christina.

Your children may even consider themselves more Indian because their father is a new immigrant. He'll be able to teach them more about his heritage, language and perhaps they'll be able to spend some time in India. I'm from a mixed heritage (Beligian, German, and Irish). I barely know anything of these countries/cultures. My sons have learned tons from their father. They can speak the language and have visited his native country a couple times (once for a 7 month stretch). They're very proud of their heritage. That's why they consider themselves Yemeni first and foremost.

Sorry, Jackie, I'm trying to think of some possible questions so we can get back on topic.

Edited January 8, 2007 by moody

[Sofiyya 1,687]

If someone doesn't want rank pulled on them, they shouldn't try to pull rank on others.

Absolutely.

You conveniently left out the part where I said if I do it, I can take the blowback. I also don't need myhusband to show up to defend me. That, I can do myself.

Been wondering how long it would take the WOMBUDS to gather.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

I agree, Christina.

Your children may even consider themselves more Indian because their father is a new immigrant. He'll be able to teach them more about his heritage, language and perhaps they'll be able to spend some time in India. I'm from a mixed heritage (Beligian, German, and Irish). I barely know anything of these countries/cultures. My sons have learned tons from their father. They can speak the language and have visited his native country a couple times (once for a 7 month stretch). They're very proud of their heritage. That's why they consider themselves Yemeni first and foremost.

Sorry, Jackie, I'm trying to think of some possible questions so we can get back on topic.

This is not unusual. My father was the first born here. My mom is an immigrant too. The "old country" is too close to home to forget.

[Reynaldo 0]

You conveniently left out the part where I said if I do it, I can take the blowback. I also don't need myhusband to show up to defend me. That, I can do myself.

Been wondering how long it would take the WOMBUDS to gather.

Not only defend you, but also put to shame the other woman...

To be honest, I don't know what WOM was talking about, but the shame and the arabic part was ridiculous....

ETA: I don't know what she was talking about because it was in arabic.

Edited January 8, 2007 by Reynaldo