Detained by law enforcement

[Harpa Timsah 13,258]

Random but slightly related question... back in 2012 I was travelling through Texas on a road trip of the US with some fellow road trip buddies I'd made (all foreign- German, Irish, Japanese, Danish etc) and we were stopped by border patrol and ordered out of the vehicle and told to show our ID's. Obviously we complied, one of the border police even had his hand ready to draw his weapon! We were asked where we were headed and how long we were going to stay in the US. Had we done something similar to the OP would we have been in deep s**t or were we within our rights to do what the OP did?

I believe police can set up road blocks as long as their checking is not discriminatory. More info here: http://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/police-set-up-roadblocks.html

Not sure what would happen if you refused to comply.

Edit: Texas at it again with illegal police work: http://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/Fort-Worth-Police-Chief-Apologizes-for-Roadblocks-232766331.html

Edited February 23, 2014 by Harpa Timsah

[Ryan H 3,834]

***One post removed for TOS violations. Any future post of a similar nature will result in Administrative Action.***

Edited February 23, 2014 by Ryan H

[Removed030114 48]

Random but slightly related question... back in 2012 I was travelling through Texas on a road trip of the US with some fellow road trip buddies I'd made (all foreign- German, Irish, Japanese, Danish etc) and we were stopped by border patrol and ordered out of the vehicle and told to show our ID's. Obviously we complied, one of the border police even had his hand ready to draw his weapon! We were asked where we were headed and how long we were going to stay in the US. Had we done something similar to the OP would we have been in deep s**t or were we within our rights to do what the OP did?

The OP handled himself perfectly, but in your case you should read and know your rights so that you can handle yourself legally and appropriately when stopped or questioned by law enforcement. Always ask if you are free to leave. Do it often and not in a provocative way. You DO NOT have to answer any questions and best practice is to kindly refuse. Ask if their requests are orders and whether you are being detained. Don't let the police intimidate you. Know your rights.

[Boiler 46,130]

Deep .

[Removed030114 48]

Random but slightly related question... back in 2012 I was travelling through Texas on a road trip of the US with some fellow road trip buddies I'd made (all foreign- German, Irish, Japanese, Danish etc) and we were stopped by border patrol and ordered out of the vehicle and told to show our ID's. Obviously we complied, one of the border police even had his hand ready to draw his weapon! We were asked where we were headed and how long we were going to stay in the US. Had we done something similar to the OP would we have been in deep s**t or were we within our rights to do what the OP did?

You didn't mention why they stopped you. Did you bother to ask them for cause?

[Hotter Otter 1,211]

You didn't mention why they stopped you. Did you bother to ask them for cause?

It looked like they were looking for illegals as they had a checkpoint and they were stopping lots of people plus it was close to the border. Obviously as foreign tourists we did as asked and didn't want to create any problems for ourselves but I'm going to do plenty of research before I move to the US so I know the best way to react if I find myself in a situation like the OP.

[Removed030114 48]

It looked like they were looking for illegals as they had a checkpoint and they were stopping lots of people plus it was close to the border. Obviously as foreign tourists we did as asked and didn't want to create any problems for ourselves but I'm going to do plenty of research before I move to the US so I know the best way to react if I find myself in a situation like the OP.

Border Patrol

■ Legal search – Agents may legally search anything without warrant

○ Drugs (It’s a Trap!)

■ The Supreme Court ruled random checkpoints for finding drugs are unconstitutional.

● “We cannot sanction stops justified only by the generalized and ever-present possibility that interrogation and inspection may reveal that any given motorist has committed some crime.”

● “Drug Checkpoint in 1 Mile” [sign] is a police trap, do NOT exit.

○ (visual of the sign near an exit cops/dogs are at exit, not 1 mile down)

○ Pull people over for:

■ Illegal U-Turns

■ Littering

■ Suspiciously exiting

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/01/border-patrol-checkpoints_n_2789592.html

http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/news/2014/01/16/aclu-arizona-border-patrol-checkpoints-routinely-violate-rights-us-citizens/

[Removed030114 48]

[Boiler 46,130]

Did they get pulled over a mile down the road for a defective light?

[ManCharsey 254]

I keep saying and will continue to say that America is a police state. With gun toting policemen who won't miss the opportunity to intimidate you at the slightest cause. I find it quite interesting that the US keeps preaching to the rest of the world human rights when it is practiced the least here. Most places around the world don't even have armed policemen and only effect armed arrests when intelligence proves the culprit is armed and dangerous. The American system has been designed to teach that it is better here in America than everywhere else - human rights and all - when in fact it is the contrary. Trust me but I do really feel more free and secure outside the borders of the US than here (at least I know no cop will shoot me for thinking I am armed). The American government is screaming at Ukraine for human rights abuse but trust me and everyone here in the US knows that same protest had occurred here, the body count would have been 20x worse. Too much hypocrisy going on here.

But I beg to differ though because the failure of amendment has ruined it all. Cops have to resort to the use of deadly force and are edgy all the time due to the fact that there are too many guns on the streets of America. You never know who you stop for a traffic violation might just shoot you for no reason so better to use force to allay all fears. Smh!

[TBoneTX 46,151]

***One post removed for TOS violations. Any future post of a similar nature will result in Administrative Action.***

(Moderator hat on) It should be added that people should quit stereotyping Texas or Texas law-enforcement officers. Abuse of constitutional power by LEOs can (and does) happen anywhere.

[TBoneTX 46,151]

Random but slightly related question... back in 2012 I was travelling through Texas on a road trip of the US with some fellow road trip buddies I'd made (all foreign- German, Irish, Japanese, Danish etc) and we were stopped by border patrol and ordered out of the vehicle and told to show our ID's. Obviously we complied, one of the border police even had his hand ready to draw his weapon! We were asked where we were headed and how long we were going to stay in the US. Had we done something similar to the OP would we have been in deep s**t or were we within our rights to do what the OP did?

(Regular-member hat on)

For the record, CBP (Federal agents) don't have "police" rights (the status or authority of a certified Peace Officer) in Texas.

This according to information that I received from an attorney (confirm it with your own attorney):

At inland checkpoints, the CBP agents have fewer rights than at border POEs: they are only to request citizenship status. They are not supposed to ask "Where are you going?" or similar. If they do, one possible response (light-heartedly) is, "Why, anywhere I want to, Agent ___ -- isn't that the greatest thing about our country?" A better response is, "I haven't decided yet. What's the next town up the road, and do they have a good ____ [state your favorite flavor] restaurant there?"

The agents at the checkpoint north of Laredo are highly professional and ask for immigration status only. The agents at the checkpoint south of Alpine are either very poorly trained, or they ignore their training in very wanton fashion.

---

Returning to the original topic (and f&c can confirm or massage these), some good replies are:

"I wish to leave now, Officer (Trooper, Constable, Deputy) -- am I free to go?"

"As a long-standing policy, I never answer personal questions. Am I free to go?"

Apparently, the longest time that a LEO can prevent you from going is about 20 minutes before a detention becomes illegal; however, the "clock" doesn't start ticking until you say that you wish to leave.

When asked "May I search your vehicle?":

"What would you be searching for, Officer (Trooper, Constable, Deputy)?"

"Well, drugs or guns."

"Why didn't you first ask me if I had any in the car?"

It's apparently also an exceptionally wise idea, if there's a sniff-drugging dog, to state that you forbid the handler from touching your vehicle. Some LEOs keep a small amount of marijuana in their pocket; they touch it, then touch your car; the dog alerts, and the LEO has probable cause to search your vehicle and worse.

Edited February 24, 2014 by TBoneTX

[rolemodel29 17]

I AM A BIT CURIOUS what is the color of you skin hun? Maybe the answer lie there. I find Americans to be quite curious at times even to the point of being annoying. I ignore them.

[Hypnos 6,578]

Any whiter and I'd be mistaken for milk.

[William33 110]

_{I do not hail from Texas, but currently live here. At the end of the day, all Law Enforcement personnel are people, with every level of quality (good and bad), just like everyone else. Slow day, bad attitude, name your reason for the hassle factor. I suggest that you could be hassled anywhere on the planet, from marginal law enforcement people. Having lived in 7 US states, I haven't noticed or heard about specific areas that are exempt.}

_{Regret to hear that you were hassled for simply jogging, but something did raise the "probable cause" flag, which is a requirement for a stop on a pedestrian or motorist. On the other hand and if you can prove it, a stop without probable cause is grounds for a winnable lawsuit.}

Edited February 24, 2014 by William33