Concealed Carry in Illinois

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

We switched from CC and began talking about crime rates in IL and other states that have liberal gun laws. I have some good statistics that I would like to post comparing the crime rates in the states with easy CC laws. I would like to keep this discussion open. I am asking for off topic posts to be removed once again. I don't want anyone thread banned or censored.

Ok sorry spooks I will refrain from my foolishness

[GandD 5,966]

2013, there were no concealed carry permits issued for Illinois residents. No out of state CC permits were allowed before/after the supreme court decision and no out of state CC will be allowed in Illinois under the new laws created in Illinois. Only Hawaii and Illinois residents are able to apply for an Illinois CC permit.

[elmcitymaven 9,712]

2013, there were no concealed carry permits issued for Illinois residents. No out of state CC permits were allowed before/after the supreme court decision and no out of state CC will be allowed in Illinois under the new laws created in Illinois. Only Hawaii and Illinois residents are able to apply for an Illinois CC permit.

That's what I understand. Also, your earlier comments about how the stay has functioned appear to be correct.

And I'm sorry for the off topic comments, spooky.

[spookyturtle 9,465]

That's what I understand. Also, your earlier comments about how the stay has functioned appear to be correct.

And I'm sorry for the off topic comments, spooky.

You're a lawyer, so I'm sure you know what a 180 day stay means. In this case it was to prevent utter chaos.

[elmcitymaven 9,712]

You're a lawyer, so I'm sure you know what a 180 day stay means. In this case it was to prevent utter chaos.

It makes sense to stay it until the state can implement it correctly to everyone's benefit. If Illinois were moving to a VT or AK model, perhaps the case for a 180-day stay wouldn't have been as strong.

[spookyturtle 9,465]

It makes sense to stay it until the state can implement it correctly to everyone's benefit. If Illinois were moving to a VT or AK model, perhaps the case for a 180-day stay wouldn't have been as strong.

The 7th Court wanted to allow enough time to get something passed, but not allow too much time that would allow the IL Legislature to drag its feet on complying with the ruling. Plus IL was granted a 30 day extension on top of that. Later I plan on posting some crime statistics, or at least the murder rate in some states that have lenient CC laws. Arizona, Alaska, Vermont, Utah, Kentucky, Wyoming, Kansas maybe Alabama.

[spookyturtle 9,465]

Just a quick tidbit. I live in MA, one of the strictest states for CC and guns in general, and only a small percentage of the population owns guns. The murder rate here in 2012 was 1.8 per 100,000. Utah, which has very liberal gun laws had the same murder rate. Wyoming, which has the highest percentage of gun owners in the US and lenient gun laws had a murder rate of 2.4. Alaska, with almost no gun control laws had a rate of 4.1. Now I'm no genius, but it's looking to me like there is more to the murder rate than just liberal CC laws as has been claimed repeatedly by some. Hmmmmmmm just because everyone MAY be carrying didn't lead to a lower murder rate everywhere that people can carry. I'm not suggesting that CC has no effect on the crime rate, but it sure as hell isn't the only factor or even the major factor. To be continued...........................................

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/murder-rates-nationally-and-state#MRalpha

http://www.gunsandammo.com/2013/03/14/ga-ranks-the-best-states-for-gun-owners-in-2013/

[spookyturtle 9,465]

Stick to the topic at hand. You know they're dying to close this thread. I asked to have the off topic posts removed in order to keep things under control but it ain't happened yet. The mods must have the night off.

[GandD 5,966]

2013, there were no concealed carry permits issued for Illinois residents. No out of state CC permits were allowed before/after the supreme court decision and no out of state CC will be allowed in Illinois under the new laws created in Illinois. Only Hawaii and Illinois residents are able to apply for an Illinois CC permit.

[TBoneTX 45,267]

Several off-topic posts removed in a sincere attempt to keep the thread on-topic, per OP's stated wish. Acceptable portion of one post returned below:

Knowing your issues puts you miles ahead of those who do not know them

This is bizarre. I think the fact that CC was not allowed in Chicago in 2013 was proved in the first post ?

Yes no CC permits.

Folks, words can't describe how close this thread is to being closed. The OP is worthy of your respect. Please stay on the topic, as he's requested repeatedly.

Edited February 11, 2014 by TBoneTX

[spookyturtle 9,465]

Just so the group knows, I asked to have the off topic posts removed. Nothing personal against anyone and I believe you all know that. Moderation has done what I have requested. I hope we can continue the discussion, especially pertaining to crime and murder rates in lenient CC states vs the stricter states. The information is interesting and worthy of discussion.

[spookyturtle 9,465]

For 2012, the US violent crime rate was 386.9 per 100K and the murder rate was 4.7 per 100K.

Arizona, which lead the list as the most gun friendly state with very lenient CC laws had a violent crime rate of 428.9 and a murder rate of 5.5. Alaska, another very liberal state where CC carry and guns are concerned had a violent crime rate of 603.2 and a murder rate of 4.1.

Yet Vermont, with the same liberal CC and gun laws had a violent crime rate of only 142.2 and a murder rate of 1.3.

How is this possible since all have CC laws where everyone can carry? It has been claimed here that CC is soley responsible for a low crime rate, and that demographics, minorities etc have nothing to do with it. Next maybe we should take a look at the demographics, socio-economic conditions etc in the few examples. What do you guys think. Again, I ask to please stay on topic as this thread is under extremely close scrutiny for some strange reason. Please remain respectful and non inflammatory.

Oh, the link for my statistics. The FBI, hopefully the information will be considered credible.

http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2012/crime-in-the-u.s.-2012/tables/4tabledatadecoverviewpdf/table_4_crime_in_the_united_states_by_region_geographic_division_and_state_2011-2012.xls

[We Keep Receipts 9,238]

For 2012, the US violent crime rate was 386.9 per 100K and the murder rate was 4.7 per 100K.

Arizona, which lead the list as the most gun friendly state with very lenient CC laws had a violent crime rate of 428.9 and a murder rate of 5.5. Alaska, another very liberal state where CC carry and guns are concerned had a violent crime rate of 603.2 and a murder rate of 4.1.

Yet Vermont, with the same liberal CC and gun laws had a violent crime rate of only 142.2 and a murder rate of 1.3.

How is this possible since all have CC laws where everyone can carry? It has been claimed here that CC is soley responsible for a low crime rate, and that demographics, minorities etc have nothing to do with it. Next maybe we should take a look at the demographics, socio-economic conditions etc in the few examples. What do you guys think. Again, I ask to please stay on topic as this thread is under extremely close scrutiny for some strange reason. Please remain respectful and non inflammatory.

Oh, the link for my statistics. The FBI, hopefully the information will be considered credible.

http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2012/crime-in-the-u.s.-2012/tables/4tabledatadecoverviewpdf/table_4_crime_in_the_united_states_by_region_geographic_division_and_state_2011-2012.xls

The bold part has much to do with it. Not race or color per SE, but living conditions, unemployment, and other factors play into this.

[Penny Lane 8,159]

The bold part has much to do with it. Not race or color per SE, but living conditions, unemployment, and other factors play into this.

Most people understand that.

[spookyturtle 9,465]

I'd like someone else here to give me their take on the following. This is the demographics for Arizona:

http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/04000.html

And here is Vermont's:

http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/50000.html

Both states have very lenient CC laws, yet differ widely in violent crime and murder rate. They also have vastly different demographics.

Now if we add Alaska to the mix, it becomes even more confusing.

http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/02000.html