Concealed Carry in Illinois

[luckytxn 2,264]

I tried to keep this thread on topic despite your efforts to derail it. You still haven't admitted that what you posted about CC in IL was not correct, even though I have proved it many times over. Why the deflection? This wasn't a topic about opinion. CC was either legal in 2013 or it wasn't. We all know it wasn't despite you repeated insistence that it was. Now you waltz back in here all gung ho to discuss the crime rate? And won't even be a man and admit you were wrong, whether it was intentional or otherwise? Priceless.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

If you're going to argue with me, at least have the balls to respond to the post and bring it to my face.

Nah. He is too busy arguing with himself, as he further qualifies his prior misstatements.

[Penny Lane 8,159]

This thread is awesome.

[We Keep Receipts 9,238]

Nah. He is too busy arguing with himself, as he further qualifies his prior misstatements.

All spooky and anyone in this thread is asking for, is one link that says CC reduced crime in IL. Since it wasn't even implemented yet, a simple my bad would cover it. But it takes a bigger person to admit when you're wrong.

[Sousuke 1,214]

I'll say that it might help on the aft chance of a simple robbery, assault, home invasion, etc. If the average person is armed, it might be the difference between life and death. The only downside is, if you look at where people are being killed, it's the poorest areas of Chicago. Most of them folks can't afford to keep the lights on in their homes, or food on the table. So I don't know how they'll get the money to buy even the cheapest hand gun and ammo.

It's like when India designed that hand gun for women, but the price was over 2000 dollars. If I remember correctly, the annual capital for the average Indian person doesn't even break into the 1000 dollars range.

You can get a decent handgun for 200-300 dollars second hand right now.

[spookyturtle 9,465]

All spooky and anyone in this thread is asking for, is one link that says CC reduced crime in IL. Since it wasn't even implemented yet, a simple my bad would cover it. But it takes a bigger person to admit when you're wrong.

I knew there was no link to prove that CC was legal in 2013 months ago when the claim was first made. My intent was to provide the correct information to the community here. I had not intent of embarrassing Gary or making him look bad. Unfortunately he did that to himself with what he posted. I have given plenty of "outs" here to save face graciously. Someone can be mistaken, or have interpreted the information incorrectly, or even knowingly mislead the group as a source of amusement. Or it could be a blatant lie. Pick one or a combination, own up to it, and move on. In real life, the offending party apologizes, then we shake hands and move on. No grudges, no hard feelings. What's so hard about that? Why be in your face with people and demand answers and then expect to be treated with kid gloves when the shoe is on the other foot?

I have a post that I hope I can find to show something really great that Gary posted. It's where I gained a lot of respect for him a few years back. It was in response to our then resident America hating Australian, Booyah. It was a great post and I have it bookmarked somewhere on another drive. I'm sure Gary remembers it. You guys wouldn't believe it was made by the same person posting in this thread. And I say that as a compliment to Gary.

[We Keep Receipts 9,238]

You can get a decent handgun for 200-300 dollars second hand right now.

Yes, but the folks that live in those areas can't afford that. To highlight:

There's been times when I've come home and I hang around my friends from high school. We're all in our late 30's early 40's. Most of them have jobs, and do okay, but that kind of money isn't handy. We're talking about 50 dollars is a lot to them. And that money on the handgun is better spent on groceries or daycare.

[We Keep Receipts 9,238]

I knew there was no link to prove that CC was legal in 2013 months ago when the claim was first made. My intent was to provide the correct information to the community here. I had not intent of embarrassing Gary or making him look bad. Unfortunately he did that to himself with what he posted. I have given plenty of "outs" here to save face graciously. Someone can be mistaken, or have interpreted the information incorrectly, or even knowingly mislead the group as a source of amusement. Or it could be a blatant lie. Pick one or a combination, own up to it, and move on. In real life, the offending party apologizes, then we shake hands and move on. No grudges, no hard feelings. What's so hard about that? Why be in your face with people and demand answers and then expect to be treated with kid gloves when the shoe is on the other foot?

I have a post that I hope I can find to show something really great that Gary posted. It's where I gained a lot of respect for him a few years back. It was in response to our then resident America hating Australian, Booyah. It was a great post and I have it bookmarked somewhere on another drive. I'm sure Gary remembers it. You guys wouldn't believe it was made by the same person posting in this thread. And I say that as a compliment to Gary.

When I first came here, Gary and I got into a discussion about race. His response was well written and it make me think. I didn't respond because I felt he hit the nail on the head, and that was all that needed to be said. And I've seen threads in the RUB forum when he gives advice on how to proceed through the visa process that folks appreciate. So, I don't know what's the deal now.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

When I first came here, Gary and I got into a discussion about race. His response was well written and it make me think. I didn't respond because I felt he hit the nail on the head, and that was all that needed to be said. And I've seen threads in the RUB forum when he gives advice on how to proceed through the visa process that folks appreciate. So, I don't know what's the deal now.

Careful. We must not enter into personalities.

[We Keep Receipts 9,238]

Careful. We must not enter into personalities.

I was just piggybacking off Spooky that Gary can form a coherent thought if he chooses to.

[GandD 5,966]

I was just piggybacking off Spooky that Gary can form a coherent thought if he chooses to.

I posted it some time back. Gary wrote one of the best threads detailing many aspects of the Vermont service center. It was very well done and very helpful for people trying to understand the process. Edited February 10, 2014 by GandD

[spookyturtle 9,465]

I was just piggybacking off Spooky that Gary can form a coherent thought if he chooses to.

I posted it some time back. Gary wrote one of the best threads detailing many aspects of the Vermont service center. It was very well done and very helpful for people trying to understand the process.

Gary has made many good points here at VJ. This IL CC was not one of them. He should take responsibility for that and admit it.

[GandD 5,966]

Gary has made many good points here at VJ. This IL CC was not one of them. He should take responsibility for that and admit it.

Yes. It's nice to be human every so often.

[spookyturtle 9,465]

Back to topic. What factors do you think led to the decrease in crime for 2013? Will crime drop even more in 2014 now that CC is being implemented? Education is key, IMO. Revitalizing bad areas, getting the kids off the streets and into some productive activities. Drugs are a problem almost everywhere.

[We Keep Receipts 9,238]

Back to topic. What factors do you think led to the decrease in crime for 2013? Will crime drop even more in 2014 now that CC is being implemented? Education is key, IMO. Revitalizing bad areas, getting the kids off the streets and into some productive activities. Drugs are a problem almost everywhere.

The highlighted area is what needs to be addressed first. Once this is taken care of, I believe CC will work more effectively. What I'm about to say is my opinion, based on what I've seen.

If you look at any commercial or advertisement that comes to gun rights, you always have some middle/upper class person talking about their rights. They talk about protecting their families and themselves, which is fine. But, here's my point. When you look at all the children and folks killed in poor areas, you never see those folks talking about getting guns. Mothers and Fathers that lose their sons and daughters in gun violence NEVER talk about having more guns, they want illegal guns off the street, they want the gangs gone, they want their kids safe going to school, being at home, etc. Even the folks that lost loved ones in mass shootings are not campaigning for CC or more guns, they want tighter gun control, they want extensive background checks, they don't want some dude getting 6000 rounds on the internet and then go shooting up a school, theatre, or mall.

Any place that's a war zone doesn't benefit from adding more guns. Once you fix the problems already killing the community, CC will help with the other issues.