J1 visa rule 212(e) 2 year home residency

[Britingermany 4]

in 2011 and 2012 I obtained short term J1 visa's to teach on a 3 week summer course on molecular biology.

I'm currently going through the K1 fiancé visa process and have my interview soon.

My visa has no stamp regarding if 212(e) applies (which is I must reside in my home country for 2 years afterwards).. I've lived in Germany, not the UK for the last year.

I'm trying to obtain the DS2019, but it was privately funded, not an exchange skill area, and I'm not a medic so I hope to god I'm not.

But would I have got this far if rule 212(e) does apply to me? Would USCIS or the NVC have detected this earlier in the process?

Edited February 6, 2014 by Britingermany

[Darnell 8,478]

USCIS doesn't care for this petition type.

NVC would have been mum.

your passport not contain any 'stay away for 2 years' wording/endorsements

so

what's the concern?

It's the IV unit that cares.

fwiw, it's not a 'stamp' that has this wording,

it's wording/encoding in the endorsement area of the VISA STAMP itself, not done at POE, but done by the IV unit after interview day. have another read of the VISAS in your passport, look at the endorsement areas.

Edited February 6, 2014 by Darnell

[Britingermany 4]

It says nothing.. where the section 212(e) is normally mentioned.. it's just blank...

A concern because I've spent $2500 on the worlds most incompetent shite of a lawyer, took a job in a country away from my home country when I could have almost satisfied the requirement by now... the concern for losing my job very soon and not have any job lined up due to impending relocation...

But has anyone had a visa in which the rule 212(e) did apply, but was not written on the visa. This was issued in the London US embassy, 2011 and 2012.

So basically if this whole process is to come crashing down its going to happen at or around my interview?

[liefie 1]

I have had a J1 visa which the rule did apply, its on the visa stamp itself.

Annotation

SUBJECT TO 212(E), TWO-YR RULE APPLIES

[Britingermany 4]

Yeah the problem is others have NOT SUBJECT TO 212(E), TWO-YR RULE DOES NOT APPLY

I just have a space. I'm tracking down my DS2019... the thief a lawyer said J1 short term scholars were not subject to this so it wasn't an issue, he was confusing it with the repeat J1 rule.. he also tried to send all the documents to the NVC and not the US embassy in my home country, said I couldn't enter the US after starting the process and I could, and he's billed us for sending documents back to me, they were only there because he incorrectly asked them to be sent.... day robbery... I'd be very wary about using so called expert immigration lawyers.

[Gee&Cee 41]

From my experience, nothing is very clear in the world of J1 2YRR. But I have a complicated case! Yours doesn't seem like that.

The best way to know for sure if you're required is by requesting an Advisory Opinion from the Department of State. But you won't have time for that before your interview: http://www.***removed***/j1-visa/home-residency-requirement/advisory-opinions.html

You may need to identify what office in the school was your sponsor for visa purposes. The admin person at your department may know. In my case, it was our "Office of International Education." You may want to contact them. They may have a copy of your DS2019. Even if they don't have it, they may have an advisor who's knowledgeable about J1 visas. That person will know what the empty annotation means (I don't think I had an empty annotation).

Who funded your exchange program? Was it the US (for example, a Fulbright scholarship?)? If yes, that usually means you're subject. I would bring the source of funding evidence to the interview, in case they ask.

Keep in mind, not all J1 visa holders are subject, and your country has all kinds of exemptions.

My best wishes! I'm following you on VJ, so please keep us posted.

[Britingermany 4]

Thanks, no it was funded by the Ellison medical foundation, but also by Woods Hole MBL who paid my wage, but technically all the money came from the Ellison Foundation, I was just employed by MBL. But both are private so I don't think I should not be subject to it.. but it seems it gets tagged on to some regardless....

I'm fairly sure I could get a waiver, well be eligible for one, they sound to get. Its just no time.

Had I known about this and not trusted someone you pay $$$$ to we would have been able to sort this by now...

Good luck in your visa processes too.. horrid stressful time.

We paid this guy so my fiancé wouldn't have the stress when she's going through med school and its been 10x worse because of him.

And yeah we have a international rep at Woods Hole who is helping, she thinks they will have the DS2019 but they are kept off site, so she's trying to locate it..

Edited February 6, 2014 by Britingermany

[Gee&Cee 41]

What I learned the hard way is that looks like only a handful of immigration lawyers knows how to handle the specificities of a J1 2YRR. I've been through all the imaginable hurdles: waiver based on non-objection, waiver based on hardship on a US citizen, and trying very unsuccessfully to find out if I'd already fulfilled part of the requirement (we contacted my embassy in the US , the diplomatic relation on my country, the Fulbright Commission, State Department, congresspeople, you name it!). I had a lawyer have us miss an I130 interview, because she didn't rescheduled it as we requested, and only told us the I130 had been denied after it was too late to do anything about it. That was in 2012! I didn't know about VJ or things would've probably be different.

Anyway, you don't even know if you have the requirement. It's possible you don't. If you can find out before the interview, great. If not, the best you can do is to try and antecipate questions they may ask and how to answer them. Don't get bugged down about that lawyer and the ordeal. Not right now. It's wasting your energy and focus. Later, you sue for malpractice, if that's the case.

If you don't have already, ask a letter from Woods Hole stating when you worked there, for how long and how long they paid you. It's helps you if it's not the US government that paid you. You may want to call your consulate/embassy in the US asking if they would make a statement to the effect you do not have any obligations to your country pertaining that stay abroad. In order words, they don't have any objections to you staying in the US.

And get ready for the interview. Focus on that. I'd go to the interview discussion group and ask them what questions you may be asked about this situation and how you can prepare yourself for the answers.

Best wishes

[Gee&Cee 41]

Have you tried this form? It should tell you if you're subject or not, from what I read. I don't remember if I filled one out.

https://j1visawaiverrecommendation.state.gov/accessController.asp?page=3&handler=true

[Britingermany 4]

Thanks, not yet, waiting for my DS2019.. worried about it somehow setting off a chain of events....

Have emailed for the letter...

[Britingermany 4]

Also I need my DS2019 for that according to the first page, hopefully get that tomorrow...

[Gee&Cee 41]

Also I need my DS2019 for that according to the first page, hopefully get that tomorrow...

Oh, bummer. I looked very briefly and didn't realize that. Well, hopefully, when the Ds2019 arrives you'll be able to check whether the requirement applies to you. I'm hoping it doesn't and you have this one less thing to worry about

[SofiaSkyLila 5]

From my experience, nothing is very clear in the world of J1 2YRR. But I have a complicated case! Yours doesn't seem like that.

The best way to know for sure if you're required is by requesting an Advisory Opinion from the Department of State. But you won't have time for that before your interview: http://www.***removed***/j1-visa/home-residency-requirement/advisory-opinions.html

You may need to identify what office in the school was your sponsor for visa purposes. The admin person at your department may know. In my case, it was our "Office of International Education." You may want to contact them. They may have a copy of your DS2019. Even if they don't have it, they may have an advisor who's knowledgeable about J1 visas. That person will know what the empty annotation means (I don't think I had an empty annotation).

Who funded your exchange program? Was it the US (for example, a Fulbright scholarship?)? If yes, that usually means you're subject. I would bring the source of funding evidence to the interview, in case they ask.

Keep in mind, not all J1 visa holders are subject, and your country has all kinds of exemptions.

My best wishes! I'm following you on VJ, so please keep us posted.

Was your beneficiary subject to the two year rule? Mine was and he just completed it Dec 2013 (Funded by Fulbright / Brazilian govt).

(The J-1 with two year rule is an evil visa!!)

What I learned the hard way is that looks like only a handful of immigration lawyers knows how to handle the specificities of a J1 2YRR. I've been through all the imaginable hurdles: waiver based on non-objection, waiver based on hardship on a US citizen, and trying very unsuccessfully to find out if I'd already fulfilled part of the requirement (we contacted my embassy in the US , the diplomatic relation on my country, the Fulbright Commission, State Department, congresspeople, you name it!). I had a lawyer have us miss an I130 interview, because she didn't rescheduled it as we requested, and only told us the I130 had been denied after it was too late to do anything about it. That was in 2012! I didn't know about VJ or things would've probably be different.

Anyway, you don't even know if you have the requirement. It's possible you don't. If you can find out before the interview, great. If not, the best you can do is to try and antecipate questions they may ask and how to answer them. Don't get bugged down about that lawyer and the ordeal. Not right now. It's wasting your energy and focus. Later, you sue for malpractice, if that's the case.

If you don't have already, ask a letter from Woods Hole stating when you worked there, for how long and how long they paid you. It's helps you if it's not the US government that paid you. You may want to call your consulate/embassy in the US asking if they would make a statement to the effect you do not have any obligations to your country pertaining that stay abroad. In order words, they don't have any objections to you staying in the US.

And get ready for the interview. Focus on that. I'd go to the interview discussion group and ask them what questions you may be asked about this situation and how you can prepare yourself for the answers.

Best wishes

Oh man.. just read this. Best of luck! We didn't bother with the waiver because we didn't want to be on the hook to pay back $200K USD to the Brazilian Govt. It has kept us apart on two different continents for about 2 1/2 years already.

How can one go about proving that the two year rule has been met? Translation of letters of employment?

Edited February 7, 2014 by SofiaSkyLila

[Gee&Cee 41]

Was your beneficiary subject to the two year rule? Mine was and he just completed it Dec 2013 (Funded by Fulbright / Brazilian govt).

(The J-1 with two year rule is an evil visa!!)

Oh man.. just read this. Best of luck! We didn't bother with the waiver because we didn't want to be on the hook to pay back $200K USD to the Brazilian Govt. It has kept us apart on two different continents for about 2 1/2 years already.

How can one go about proving that the two year rule has been met? Translation of letters of employment?

Indeed! An evil visa! I do understand, though, the intention behind the 2 years. When the Fulbright Program was first created there wasn't such a thing. And they noticed researchers ended up staying. So, in order to avoid a "brain drain" (they really say that), the 2YRR was created.

I'm the beneficiary, and in my case, the program was funded by the US. It's almost impossible to be granted a waiver, unless it's a request by a an interested agency and the risks to your/ an USC if going back. That's hard to prove.

In the case of Brazil... The major problem I see is not so much the going back for two years or paying back, but the lack of support when you go back. You come back, if it's a graduate degree, with very specialized knowledge that doesn't meet a structure to welcome that. Different, from example, from my Turkish colleagues: they could pay back their government money upon return, but they were all guaranteed a job at an university for a period of time.

You prove your stay with your passport (I asked the people at customs to stamp it for me- usually they don't for Brazilians; but it also shows if you were out of the country), pay stubs, bills in your name, and things like that. I haven't gone through that yet. I'm trying not to stress about it, but depending on when I have the interview I'm going to have to argue and prove that I was in two different programs during the J1, and for one of them I didn't have the 2YRR and, since the time "served" is cumulative, prove that I've already fulfilled it. Uff!

[SofiaSkyLila 5]

Indeed! An evil visa! I do understand, though, the intention behind the 2 years. When the Fulbright Program was first created there wasn't such a thing. And they noticed researchers ended up staying. So, in order to avoid a "brain drain" (they really say that), the 2YRR was created.

I'm the beneficiary, and in my case, the program was funded by the US. It's almost impossible to be granted a waiver, unless it's a request by a an interested agency and the risks to your/ an USC if going back. That's hard to prove.

In the case of Brazil... The major problem I see is not so much the going back for two years or paying back, but the lack of support when you go back. You come back, if it's a graduate degree, with very specialized knowledge that doesn't meet a structure to welcome that. Different, from example, from my Turkish colleagues: they could pay back their government money upon return, but they were all guaranteed a job at an university for a period of time.

You prove your stay with your passport (I asked the people at customs to stamp it for me- usually they don't for Brazilians; but it also shows if you were out of the country), pay stubs, bills in your name, and things like that. I haven't gone through that yet. I'm trying not to stress about it, but depending on when I have the interview I'm going to have to argue and prove that I was in two different programs during the J1, and for one of them I didn't have the 2YRR and, since the time "served" is cumulative, prove that I've already fulfilled it. Uff!

I have a theory on the real reason behind the J-1 and I doubt it's the "brain drain" because wouldn't you think the US wants to retain brain power? Apparently not. I've met many [brazilians, primarily women] who come here with J-1 visas to work as nannies or restaurants in a "visitor exchange program". These people aren't subject to the two year rule. Scholars and graduate students (fulbright, science without borders, post-docs, and different scholarships from other countries) are. I think that its in the government's best interest to try and retain the more uneducated people because they are more likely to buy into politician's lies and that is how they win votes. The "brainers" are more likely to question and see right through lies. (For example, on facebook, one of these J-1 nanny status adjusters was posting stuff like "yeah US! We kicked Bin Laden and Sadam Hussein's ###" on 9/11. This type of mentality is exactly what the politicians want in voters.)

I have met many international students who are Fulbrighters or funded by their government who want to stay and not return to their countries because like you said, there is a huge lack of support. Also, the PhD is not as valued there. So, since they cannot stay in the US, they are choosing to go to Canada or even Europe. (In particular, I also have a Turkish colleague who will be going to Canada upon graduation.) These students also told me that the two year rule can be served by going home to visit in increments. For instance, if you go home for 2 months during the summer or 1 month during the holidays, this counts towards the two years.

Good luck!