Double Standard in Immigration Status and Military Service

[sparkofcreation 0]

It's a disgusting double standard, and when you add to that there is no franchise for immigrants to voice their opinion on war/conflict, it is even more disgusting.

I think the selective service as a whole is sickening.

This the exact reason why the US needs to play catch up with the rest of Europe and implement a modern immigration and citizenship test. Where someone has to understand and ultimately accept the law of the country they are migrating too.

Or, this is exactly why the selective service must be abolished, among other things.

So are you suggesting non US citizens should be allowed to sit back in the US while everyone else fights for it in a time of war?

I'm saying the selective service, for whomever, is bul!######. We have a volunteer military. That is how it should be.

Name one of the "everyone else" who is fighting in the war now? NONE.

The United Kingdom.

[peezey 0]

No we have a volunteer military only for US Citizens and LPR only. Undocumented aliens are part of the Drafted Military as they cannot willfully join the military but must register for the conscription.

All men in this country 18-26 must register regardless of their immigration status, which is ridiculous in this day and age.

I'm saying the selective service, for whomever, is bul!######. We have a volunteer military. That is how it should be.

Name one of the "everyone else" who is fighting in the war now? NONE.

So if a major war broke out you would rather the country be destroyed rather than conscripted.. Living in a country is not a right but a privilege.. Something a lot of self centered people have forgotten..

It's a right for me.

When a war is believed to be just, the people will enlist. My grandpa still talks proudly about the day he signed up to be a pilot in WWII.

Infidel, please have some faith in Americans, because I like to believe we have a conscience.

If the government is representing the will of the people in going to war, they will not need a draft. If they don't represent our will, then what the he!! are they doing going to war anyway?

I like the idea of conscription. Even as a semester right after high school. It teachers kids pride and confidence as well as getting along with people from all stratas of life. Rich / Poor. Black / Asian etc.. Teachers Americans to become brother and sister rather than the state of internal hatred the country currently has.

Someone once told me the US will not be destroyed by a foreign power but will crumble from within. To be honest after living here for nearly a year and seeing the level of hatred and lack of loyalty for this country so many have, I am starting to believe it.

It would be really interesting to see how many liberals in comparison to conservatives are actually enlisted in the army..

You dont' own the definition of loyalty, you only have your own definition of loyalty. Some people think questioning what is just and right = loyalty to the republic and the democracy we hold dear.

[peezey 0]

It's a disgusting double standard, and when you add to that there is no franchise for immigrants to voice their opinion on war/conflict, it is even more disgusting.

I think the selective service as a whole is sickening.

This the exact reason why the US needs to play catch up with the rest of Europe and implement a modern immigration and citizenship test. Where someone has to understand and ultimately accept the law of the country they are migrating too.

Or, this is exactly why the selective service must be abolished, among other things.

So are you suggesting non US citizens should be allowed to sit back in the US while everyone else fights for it in a time of war?

I'm saying the selective service, for whomever, is bul!######. We have a volunteer military. That is how it should be.

Name one of the "everyone else" who is fighting in the war now? NONE.

The United Kingdom.

We're talking about US conscription of it's own citizens, LPRs and undocumented people.

[edsperfect 25]

When a war is believed to be just, the people will enlist. My grandpa still talks proudly about the day he signed up to be a pilot in WWII.

Infidel, please have some faith in Americans, because I like to believe we have a conscience.

If the government is representing the will of the people in going to war, they will not need a draft. If they don't represent our will, then what the he!! are they doing going to war anyway?

I like the idea of conscription. Even as a semester right after high school. It teachers kids pride and confidence as well as getting along with people from all stratas of life. Rich / Poor. Black / Asian etc.. Teachers Americans to become brother and sister rather than the state of internal hatred the country currently has.

Someone once told me the US will not be destroyed by a foreign power but will crumble from within. To be honest after living here for nearly a year and seeing the level of hatred and lack of loyalty for this country so many have, I am starting to believe it.

It would be really interesting to see how many liberals in comparison to conservatives are actually enlisted in the army..

Yes a big mistake getting rid of the draft. Every great civilization startede its downfall and ultimate demise when they start to concentrate their defense on the use of mrcaneries and other than citizen soldiers.

How ever many aliens join the US military because it assures them of entry into the US and a quicker way to citizenship. They make better citizens then the americans that are always whining and upset over what a terribl country this is and how abused they are by the government

[Heracles 417]

We're talking about US conscription of it's own citizens, LPRs and undocumented people.

Can LPR and undocumented people conveniently leave during a draft to avoid it? yes or no

[Ban Hammer 13,928]

No we have a volunteer military only for US Citizens and LPR only. Undocumented aliens are part of the Drafted Military as they cannot willfully join the military but must register for the conscription.

All men in this country 18-26 must register regardless of their immigration status, which is ridiculous in this day and age.

why is it rediculous in this day and age?

[Ban Hammer 13,928]

We're talking about US conscription of it's own citizens, LPRs and undocumented people.

Can LPR and undocumented people conveniently leave during a draft to avoid it? yes or no

what is to stop them?

[sparkofcreation 0]

It's a disgusting double standard, and when you add to that there is no franchise for immigrants to voice their opinion on war/conflict, it is even more disgusting.

I think the selective service as a whole is sickening.

This the exact reason why the US needs to play catch up with the rest of Europe and implement a modern immigration and citizenship test. Where someone has to understand and ultimately accept the law of the country they are migrating too.

Or, this is exactly why the selective service must be abolished, among other things.

So are you suggesting non US citizens should be allowed to sit back in the US while everyone else fights for it in a time of war?

I'm saying the selective service, for whomever, is bul!######. We have a volunteer military. That is how it should be.

Name one of the "everyone else" who is fighting in the war now? NONE.

The United Kingdom.

We're talking about US conscription of it's own citizens, LPRs and undocumented people.

Infidel said something about "sitting back in the US while everyone else fights for it in a time of war." And you said that there is no 'everyone else' fighting in the war. (Actually, you said "Name one of the 'everyone else' who is fighting in the war now? NONE.")

I figured that you couldn't possibly mean that there are no US citizens (vs. immigrants) fighting in the war, because that's idiotic and asinine and obviously untrue. So I assumed you must have meant that there are no other countries (vs. the US) fighting for the US. Which, while also totally untrue, at least would be understandable to some extent because some other countries have pulled out of the war.

So you honestly believe that there are no Americans fighting in the war now? Because I know a few.

[peezey 0]

It's a disgusting double standard, and when you add to that there is no franchise for immigrants to voice their opinion on war/conflict, it is even more disgusting.

I think the selective service as a whole is sickening.

This the exact reason why the US needs to play catch up with the rest of Europe and implement a modern immigration and citizenship test. Where someone has to understand and ultimately accept the law of the country they are migrating too.

Or, this is exactly why the selective service must be abolished, among other things.

So are you suggesting non US citizens should be allowed to sit back in the US while everyone else fights for it in a time of war?

I'm saying the selective service, for whomever, is bul!######. We have a volunteer military. That is how it should be.

Name one of the "everyone else" who is fighting in the war now? NONE.

The United Kingdom.

We're talking about US conscription of it's own citizens, LPRs and undocumented people.

Infidel said something about "sitting back in the US while everyone else fights for it in a time of war." And you said that there is no 'everyone else' fighting in the war. (Actually, you said "Name one of the 'everyone else' who is fighting in the war now? NONE.")

I figured that you couldn't possibly mean that there are no US citizens (vs. immigrants) fighting in the war, because that's idiotic and asinine and obviously untrue. So I assumed you must have meant that there are no other countries (vs. the US) fighting for the US. Which, while also totally untrue, at least would be understandable to some extent because some other countries have pulled out of the war.

So you honestly believe that there are no Americans fighting in the war now? Because I know a few.

His "everyone else" meant the LPRs and undocumented people which is the topic of the OP. We are discussing the conscription of LPRs and undocumented people-----they must sign up for selective service but cannot vote, etc. This is the topic of the post, however idiotic and asinine you find me.

[Artegal 1]

I am not debating the loyalty of Americans, nor the pros and cons of using a Draft (Conscripted) military vs an all Volunteer military. The topic of my original post was that there is a double standard for US Citizens vs LPR vs Undocumented (out-of-status) aliens. Only US Citizens can vote. US Citizens and LPRs can willfully join the Volunteer military--but Illegal/Undocumented (out-of-status) aliens cannot join the volunteer military. However all Males between 18 and 25 whether US Citizen, Dual Citizen, LPR, or Undocumented aliens must register for the Selective Service and face the possibility of being conscripted. I guess historically the US Government has used conscription against those considered non-citizens since the revolutionary war--with Native American and Slaves being conscripted into military service.

[pedroh 21]

is it a draft? i thought it was just a registration.. which i think it's completely different.. anway, as any other k1'er who has to sign for selective service, i had to do it if i wanted to stay lol, so nothing i can do

[peezey 0]

is it a draft? i thought it was just a registration.. which i think it's completely different.. anway, as any other k1'er who has to sign for selective service, i had to do it if i wanted to stay lol, so nothing i can do

It is registration for the draft should the draft ever be reinstated.

Edited December 24, 2006 by peezey

[matako 0]

Registration to the selective service does not apply to ALL.

It only applies if you are in an immigrant status. If say you are an F1 student, you do not have to register, but if you are undocumented, you have to register.

Summary, selective service applies to males 18-25 who were citizens, LPRs or undocumented or out of status.

see: http://www.sss.gov/PDFs/instructions.pdf

If you did not register and were supposed to, I guess the best thing is to just go to Asia and get a s*x change, come here as a woman, get citizenship then go back and change into a man again. Otherwise you will never get citizenship.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

It would be really interesting to see how many liberals in comparison to conservatives are actually enlisted in the army..

Why are you so obsessed with "liberals" and "conservatives"?

[clloyd 0]

It would be really interesting to see how many liberals in comparison to conservatives are actually enlisted in the army..

Why are you so obsessed with "liberals" and "conservatives"?

Yeah, what did that have to do with anything?