Couple of I-864 questions...

[UKHusband 1]

Just filling in my wife's I-864 ready for our interview next week and was hoping someone could clarify a couple of things for us!

Here is what we are doing:

Wife - I-864 (Petitioner)

Wife's Mother - I-864 (Co-sponsor)

Wife's Father - I-864A

Is that right? Or should both her parents fill in I-864A?

If so, on my wife's I-864 do we list her parents as part of the household in part 5 and include their incomes or not?

Also, we have savings both here in my name and in the US in my wife's name, it's not an insignificant amount but not enough to meet the whatever times poverty guideline (is it 3x for savings?) so is there any point in including it at all?

Edited October 16, 2013 by UKHusband

[Penguin_ie 5,993]

What you are doing is correct.

If the co-sponsors meet the poverty line for their household +you comfortably, no need to include assets.

[UKHusband 1]

Thanks - fairly comfortable we've done it right (famous last words lol).

Not sure we actually needed the I-864a off her dad in the end as her mother is making several times the poverty level on her own, but I suppose it can't do any harm to have it?

Looking at what her parents have supplied they have sent the forms (one I-864 and one I-864a), their tax transcripts for 2011 and a letter from each of their businesses of employment confirming terms and salary. Is this enough?

Left our savings off in the end, and as we've both currently left employment in readiness for the move (opportunity for voluntary redundancy was too good to turn down - gift horse, mouth etc) my wife's I-864 shows no income and no assets lol.

Thanks for the assist!

[mrss13 2]

I've been told on this forum that if the co-sponsor's income is enough, then you don't need an I-864a for their spouse, even if they file a joint return. You just have to have proof of the co-sponsor's sole income.

[Nich-Nick 3,354]

Thanks - fairly comfortable we've done it right (famous last words lol).

Not sure we actually needed the I-864a off her dad in the end as her mother is making several times the poverty level on her own, but I suppose it can't do any harm to have it?

Looking at what her parents have supplied they have sent the forms (one I-864 and one I-864a), their tax transcripts for 2011 and a letter from each of their businesses of employment confirming terms and salary. Is this enough?

Left our savings off in the end, and as we've both currently left employment in readiness for the move (opportunity for voluntary redundancy was too good to turn down - gift horse, mouth etc) my wife's I-864 shows no income and no assets lol.

Thanks for the assist!

You need their 2012 tax return or transcript as that is most recent. And don't forget proof that each are US citizens (or permanent residents)...photocopy of US birth certificate, US passport bio page, or greencard.

If Mom makes enough on her own, then her form I-864 would have been fine without adding Dad as her household member. With a joint tax return, she would have to clearly prove her separate income, which she did with the employer letter. Since you already have the forms, it's fine to go with including Dad. No need to do over.

[UKHusband 1]

You need their 2012 tax return or transcript as that is most recent. And don't forget proof that each are US citizens (or permanent residents)...photocopy of US birth certificate, US passport bio page, or greencard.

If Mom makes enough on her own, then her form I-864 would have been fine without adding Dad as her household member. With a joint tax return, she would have to clearly prove her separate income, which she did with the employer letter. Since you already have the forms, it's fine to go with including Dad. No need to do over.

Thanks for the advice - my wife's father said he didn't have 2012 at the time he provided this stuff, and they have completed the forms using 2009, 2010 & 2011 tax returns (as it turns out I actually had all three years of joint tax returns, not just the one).

I have copies of their passports, and WR2s (I think that's what they're called?) for 2011.

Their employment letters detail salary and are dated a month or so ago, and in the case of my wife's father he's actually the co-owner of the business... Is not having 2012 going to prove problematic?

[Nich-Nick 3,354]

Thanks for the advice - my wife's father said he didn't have 2012 at the time he provided this stuff, and they have completed the forms using 2009, 2010 & 2011 tax returns (as it turns out I actually had all three years of joint tax returns, not just the one).

I have copies of their passports, and WR2s (I think that's what they're called?) for 2011.

Their employment letters detail salary and are dated a month or so ago, and in the case of my wife's father he's actually the co-owner of the business... Is not having 2012 going to prove problematic?

Yes, I think not submitting 2012 tax return is contrary to the rules. The tax return deadline was six months ago. The form does 't ask for a tax return 18 months old (2011). Instructions p. 6--

7. Item Number 14. Federal Income Tax Information.

You must provide either an IRS transcript or a photocopy from your own records of your Federal individual income tax return for the most recent tax year. If you believe additional returns may help you to establish your ability to maintain sufficient income, you may submit transcripts or photocopies of your Federal individual income tax returns for the three most recent years.

You are not required to have the IRS certify the transcript or photocopy unless specifically instructed to do so by a Government official; a plain transcript or photocopy is acceptable. Telefile tax records are not acceptable proof of filing.

Do not submit copies of your State income tax returns. Do not submit any tax returns that you filed with any foreign government unless you claim that you were not required to file a Federal tax return with the United States government and you wish to rely on the foreign return solely to establish the amount of your income that is not subject to tax in the United States.

If you provide a photocopy of your tax return(s), you must include a copy of each and every Form W-2 and Form 1099 that relates to your return(s). Do not include copies of these Forms if you provide an IRS transcript of your return(s) rather than a photocopy.

If you checked Item Number 2. in Part 6.,(self-employed), you should have completed one of the following forms with your Federal income tax return: Schedule C (Profit or Loss from Business), Schedule D (Capital Gains), Schedule E (Supplemental Income or Loss) or Schedule F (Profit or Loss from Farming). You must include each and every Form 1040 Schedule, if any, that you filed with your Federal tax return.

If you were required to file a Federal income tax return during any of the previous three tax years but did not do so, you must file any and all late returns with IRS and attach an IRS-generated tax return transcript documenting your late filing before submitting the I-864 Affidavit of Support. If you were not required to file a Federal income tax return under U.S. tax law because your income was too low, attach a written explanation. If you were not required to file a Federal income tax return under U.S. tax law for any other reason, attach a written explanation including evidence of the exemption and how you are subject to it. Residence outside of the United States does not exempt U.S. citizens or lawful permanent residents from filing a U.S. Federal income tax return. See "Filing Requirements" in the IRS Form 1040 Filing Instructions to determine whether you were required to file.

For purposes of this affidavit, the line for gross (total) income on IRS Forms 1040 and 1040A will be considered when determining income. For persons filing IRS Form 1040 EZ, the line for adjusted gross income will be considered.

[Penguin_ie 5,993]

Yes, you will need 2012 returns.

[UKHusband 1]

Thanks guys, will get him to get on to his accountant today!

[UKHusband 1]

Have resolved this now and he is sending over 2012 tonight, however as it turns out he has only just filed 2012 as they received a 6 month extension for some reason, which is why he didn't have it at the time he sent the other stuff over.

Googling it, it seems yesterday was some kind of deadline for filing 2012 (http://www.forbes.com/sites/taxanalysts/2013/10/15/today-is-tax-filing-day-your-return-is-due-shutdown-or-not/) so I wonder whether we would have been okay without it in any case given the timeline? If our interview had been a couple of weeks earlier it wouldn't have been possible to take 2012 it seems...

Better safe than sorry though! Thanks guys!

[Nich-Nick 3,354]

Have resolved this now and he is sending over 2012 tonight, however as it turns out he has only just filed 2012 as they received a 6 month extension for some reason, which is why he didn't have it at the time he sent the other stuff over.

Googling it, it seems yesterday was some kind of deadline for filing 2012 (http://www.forbes.com/sites/taxanalysts/2013/10/15/today-is-tax-filing-day-your-return-is-due-shutdown-or-not/) so I wonder whether we would have been okay without it in any case given the timeline? If our interview had been a couple of weeks earlier it wouldn't have been possible to take 2012 it seems...

Better safe than sorry though! Thanks guys!

You need his and her 2012 W-2 to go with the full copy of the tax return. Hopefully he included that. Without a 2012 tax return, he does not qualify as a sponsor. It was due April 15. He got an extension, but he still missed the filing deadline. After April 15 the latest tax return is 2012 whether you actually filed or not. That is USCIS's expectation (they wrote the form).

Did you read what I posted from the instructions?

If you were required to file a Federal income tax return during any of the previous three tax years but did not do so, you must file any and all late returns with IRS and attach an IRS-generated tax return transcript documenting your late filing before submitting the I-864 Affidavit of Support.

Now I am wondering if Mom's I-864 is accurate because it used tax numbers for 2009, 2010, 2011. It should be

Part 6

13a 2012

13b 2011

13c 2010

Maybe they won't notice. London is fairly laid back, but there are certain requirements for an I-864 that must be met for documentation.

Edited October 16, 2013 by Nich-Nick

[UKHusband 1]

Yeah I did read it thanks, and sent it on to her father who went through it with his tax accountant.

They're redoing the I-864 with 2013 on it, and yes he's sending the W-2s apparently.

The US tax system is way out of my comfort zone to be honest, and I didn't ask why they got an extension - this process has been intrusive enough for them!

I certainly feel more comfortable having 2013 in hand though, so I'm siding with you on this one lol. Thanks.

[Nich-Nick 3,354]

Yeah I did read it thanks, and sent it on to her father who went through it with his tax accountant.

They're redoing the I-864 with 2013 on it, and yes he's sending the W-2s apparently.

The US tax system is way out of my comfort zone to be honest, and I didn't ask why they got an extension - this process has been intrusive enough for them!

I certainly feel more comfortable having 2013 in hand though, so I'm siding with you on this one lol. Thanks.

Some businesses or individuals with complicated returns involving a lot of accounting can't (or don't) get it all together between January and April 15. And their accountants can't fit everybody in the last day. Many file for an extension by April 15 as a way to push back the deadline for completing it. If any money is due the IRS, it has to be paid by April 15 or interest accrues on the unpaid amount....which without doing the return they don't really know exactly what they owe. I understand the awkward position you are in wanting to get your documentation correct, but yet you are asking a big favor from someone and can't be too pushy.

It's 2012 in hand. We don't finish tax year 2013 until Dec 31 and it is not considered the "latest" return until April 15 of next year. I think it was a typo that you put 2013.

[bellavita38 1]

Yes, I think not submitting 2012 tax return is contrary to the rules. The tax return deadline was six months ago. The form does 't ask for a tax return 18 months old (2011). Instructions p. 6--

7. Item Number 14. Federal Income Tax Information.

You must provide either an IRS transcript or a photocopy from your own records of your Federal individual income tax return for the most recent tax year. If you believe additional returns may help you to establish your ability to maintain sufficient income, you may submit transcripts or photocopies of your Federal individual income tax returns for the three most recent years.

You are not required to have the IRS certify the transcript or photocopy unless specifically instructed to do so by a Government official; a plain transcript or photocopy is acceptable. Telefile tax records are not acceptable proof of filing.

Do not submit copies of your State income tax returns. Do not submit any tax returns that you filed with any foreign government unless you claim that you were not required to file a Federal tax return with the United States government and you wish to rely on the foreign return solely to establish the amount of your income that is not subject to tax in the United States.

If you provide a photocopy of your tax return(s), you must include a copy of each and every Form W-2 and Form 1099 that relates to your return(s). Do not include copies of these Forms if you provide an IRS transcript of your return(s) rather than a photocopy.

If you checked Item Number 2. in Part 6.,(self-employed), you should have completed one of the following forms with your Federal income tax return: Schedule C (Profit or Loss from Business), Schedule D (Capital Gains), Schedule E (Supplemental Income or Loss) or Schedule F (Profit or Loss from Farming). You must include each and every Form 1040 Schedule, if any, that you filed with your Federal tax return.

If you were required to file a Federal income tax return during any of the previous three tax years but did not do so, you must file any and all late returns with IRS and attach an IRS-generated tax return transcript documenting your late filing before submitting the I-864 Affidavit of Support. If you were not required to file a Federal income tax return under U.S. tax law because your income was too low, attach a written explanation. If you were not required to file a Federal income tax return under U.S. tax law for any other reason, attach a written explanation including evidence of the exemption and how you are subject to it. Residence outside of the United States does not exempt U.S. citizens or lawful permanent residents from filing a U.S. Federal income tax return. See "Filing Requirements" in the IRS Form 1040 Filing Instructions to determine whether you were required to file.

For purposes of this affidavit, the line for gross (total) income on IRS Forms 1040 and 1040A will be considered when determining income. For persons filing IRS Form 1040 EZ, the line for adjusted gross income will be considered.

Extremely informative message thread! Thanks to all for such clear & concise answers.

One clarification: Above you typed:

" If you provide a photocopy of your tax return(s), you must include a copy of each and every Form W-2 and Form 1099 that relates to your return(s). Do not include copies of these Forms if you provide an IRS transcript of your return(s) rather than a photocopy."

Does this mean IF you send transcript ---> no need to send copy of tax return & all W-2 & Form 1099? And vice-versa, if you decide to submit copy of tax return, W-2 & Form 1099, then you do NOT submit also the transcript?

Just want to make sure as I am filling out as well.

Again, thank you for your responses to all. And I am in no way high-jacking the thread. just clafiying.

[Nich-Nick 3,354]

Extremely informative message thread! Thanks to all for such clear & concise answers.

One clarification: Above you typed:

" If you provide a photocopy of your tax return(s), you must include a copy of each and every Form W-2 and Form 1099 that relates to your return(s). Do not include copies of these Forms if you provide an IRS transcript of your return(s) rather than a photocopy."

Does this mean IF you send transcript ---> no need to send copy of tax return & all W-2 & Form 1099? And vice-versa, if you decide to submit copy of tax return, W-2 & Form 1099, then you do NOT submit also the transcript?

Just want to make sure as I am filling out as well.

Again, thank you for your responses to all. And I am in no way high-jacking the thread. just clafiying.

That inormation was copied straight from the I-864 instructions. I didn't write it.

You are interpreting that statement correctly.

Anybody could fill out a blank tax form and make up their wages earned. So...there needs to be a W2 or 1099 (from the employer or other independent source) that verifies earning they paid.

A transcript from the IRS is basically verifying what was filed. A transcript needs nothing else with it. It contains all the forms and schedules of the return in a summary format.

Edited October 27, 2013 by Nich-Nick