2 in custody for shooting of 5 at Tulsa event

[Janelle2002 3,865]

5 people in a home invasion.... Perhaps you could have invited them for a cup of tea.

hahahahahahahaha

Naw this was two separate times. After the first one, I moved and that's when the 24 year olds came. Something about a nice looking woman living by herself that makes guys want to rob her instead of asking her out on a date.

[Danno 1,228]

I know what you are referring to, but everyone does not live by those rules just because they are black. I have had prosecutors to prosecute 2 young boys, 16 and 17 and three 24 year olds for breaking into my house.

So, I show no mercy for people breaking the law.

Now Janelle, I hardly think you pressing charges against those who broke in YOUR house, does much to dispel the Culture of "no snitching" in some communities.

This typically refers to the pervasive attitude where no one gets involved.... unless it effects you personally.

When you go to sh_ty neighborhoods, it goes beyond no-snitching.

These areas are lousy because no one is involved in their community. Few people pick up trash, or shovel their neighbors walk, Few people report crime or look after each others kids. FEw people volunteer in the community.

I worked with a lady once who went on one of those Neighbors helping neighbors programs.

These are basically White folks volunteering to spend a Saturday helping out in a "distressed Neighborhood".

Well anyway, she was painting a ladies back porch, while the "neighbors" were stealing stuff out of the backseat of her car.

She was a little miffed because the ladies son was watching TV while she worked.

(Shrug)

[Janelle2002 3,865]

Now Janelle, I hardly think you pressing charges against those who broke in YOUR house, does much to dispel the Culture of "no snitching" in some communities.

This typically refers to the pervasive attitude where no one gets involved.... unless it effects you personally.

When you go to sh_ty neighborhoods, it goes beyond no-snitching.

These areas are lousy because no one is involved in their community. Few people pick up trash, or shovel their neighbors walk, Few people report crime or look after each others kids. FEw people volunteer in the community.

I worked with a lady once who went on one of those Neighbors helping neighbors programs.

These are basically White folks volunteering to spend a Saturday helping out in a "distressed Neighborhood".

Well anyway, she was painting a ladies back porch, while the "neighbors" were stealing stuff out of the backseat of her car.

She was a little miffed because the ladies son was watching TV while she worked.

(Shrug)

Actually, the first go around, there was a girl who a friend of my little's cousins who came over to my house. I told her I was going to tell the police she broke into my house if she didn't tell me who did it since I knew she was in my house. And I snitched, I'm black. So what if it happened to be my own house.

[Protocol417 161]

Now don't get me wrong, I completely understand how getting everyone else to pitch in.... for your Doc bills is much more preferable,

in fact it plays right along with the expectation of every one of these popular programs.

We will pay less into it than we get out of it.

I pay FAR more in than I get back. And I would gladly continue to do so... if that was the best option available. But it clearly isn't. People from all points in the political spectrum agree that our current system is bad, wrong, needs to be fixed desperately, costs way too much for way too little, and pushes people towards more costly "solutions", to the detriment of the individual and society.

I will continue to go based off of the "expectations" that I have from my own experiences, as well as the financial comparisons and statistical analysis by people far smarter than I am, and compare them to what we're getting right now.

It isn't about "getting everyone else to pitch in" to my personal health care costs, because frankly? I don't have many health care costs. I rarely go to the doctor. So if this was really about having other people pay for my stuff, I would be advocating for the whole mortgage/rent thing you were talking about before

[Danno 1,228]

I pay FAR more in than I get back. And I would gladly continue to do so... if that was the best option available. But it clearly isn't. People from all points in the political spectrum agree that our current system is bad, wrong, needs to be fixed desperately, costs way too much for way too little, and pushes people towards more costly "solutions", to the detriment of the individual and society.

I will continue to go based off of the "expectations" that I have from my own experiences, as well as the financial comparisons and statistical analysis by people far smarter than I am, and compare them to what we're getting right now.

Let me get this right.... you say the price of Healthcare is too high and

you expect the Gov't will give you better care at a cheaper price?

SO let me ask you, did you look at the track record of the Gov's foray into healthcare so far?

Would you say the V.A. has provided low cost quality care?

Did you consider the very segment of society which spends its life on Gov't managed care (The poor) is also the same groups which is rated to have the worst health and to be the least satisfied.

From where do you get your confidence?

Edited October 15, 2013 by Danno

[We Keep Receipts 9,238]

Now Janelle, I hardly think you pressing charges against those who broke in YOUR house, does much to dispel the Culture of "no snitching" in some communities.

This typically refers to the pervasive attitude where no one gets involved.... unless it effects you personally.

When you go to sh_ty neighborhoods, it goes beyond no-snitching.

These areas are lousy because no one is involved in their community. Few people pick up trash, or shovel their neighbors walk, Few people report crime or look after each others kids. FEw people volunteer in the community.

I worked with a lady once who went on one of those Neighbors helping neighbors programs.

These are basically White folks volunteering to spend a Saturday helping out in a "distressed Neighborhood".

Well anyway, she was painting a ladies back porch, while the "neighbors" were stealing stuff out of the backseat of her car.

She was a little miffed because the ladies son was watching TV while she worked.

(Shrug)

I have a question Danno, why are you obsessed with all things black?

[Janelle2002 3,865]

I have a question Danno, why are you obsessed with all things black?

If Danno is obsessed and fascinated with black people let him be.

[We Keep Receipts 9,238]

If Danno is obsessed and fascinated with black people let him be.

I guess my point is why is something that is rooted in black culture being brought up in a case that has nothing to do with black culture.

[Janelle2002 3,865]

I guess my point is why is something that is rooted in black culture being brought up in a case that has nothing to do with black culture.

Because he loves us.

I'm sorry if you are looking for a logical explanation. But I just have to joke about his intense nature of trying to discover who black people are but he is looking down all of the wrong avenues. Although we keep trying to help him out, he just won't listen.

[Protocol417 161]

Let me get this right.... you say the price of Healthcare is too high and

you expect the Gov't will give you better care at a cheaper price?

SO let me ask you, did you look at the track record of the Gov's foray into healthcare so far?

Would you say the V.A. has provided low cost quality care?

Did you consider the very segment of society which spends its life on Gov't managed care (The poor) is also the same groups which is rated to have the worst health and to be the least satisfied.

From where do you get your confidence?

From looking at how other countries handle their healthcare and from my own personal experience.

All other first-world countries have a single-payer system, and are, with few exceptions in each category, able to give their citizens a higher concentration of primary care doctors per capita, more hospital bed availability, longer hospital stays which result in lower readmission rates, lower infant mortality rates, and longer life expectancy for those who make it to 65 than we do. All for, on average, half the cost, and despite a population that smokes (again, on average) more than we do.

I myself have experience with the British NHS, as does my fiance, his family, our mutual friends, etc. My experience, and theirs, has been more attentive and easier-to-access primary care with less expense (comparable or lower expense in taxes there versus taxes here + insurance premiums [depending on if you calculate "insurance premium" as what the individual pays or individual + employer contributions], but with far lower co-pays and out-of-pocket expenses at point of use). Except for elective procedures, the whole "wait time" thing has been, so far, pretty much completely untrue, but the actual care received was, IMO, much better.

I also was part of "the poor" for many years of my life. Not everyone who is "poor" qualifies for Medicaid. Many people don't, and I was one of them. My employers (yes, multiple) didn't offer health insurance, I couldn't afford to go to the doctor, so when I was sick, I would wait until I couldn't do so any longer to see if it went away on its own, and when it didn't, I ended up in the emergency room. So I'd be interested to see where you get your statistics on "the poor" and how much of that had to do with access rather than a government program they may or may not have qualified for. Your statement was a little vague in that regard.

I have no experience with the VA myself, and have done little research on it. However, after a quick Google search, I found the following.

Fortune says of the VA that it is the "most wired and cost-effective health system in the land" and though they "used to be a byword for second-rate care or worse", now "they're national leaders in efficiency and quality". Time agrees, stating: "For the sixth year in a row, VA hospitals last year scored higher than private facilities on the University of Michigan's American Customer Satisfaction Index... Males 65 years and older receiving VA care had about a 40% lower risk of death than those enrolled in Medicare Advantage, whose care is provided through private health plans or HMOs." The Rand Corporation's study published in the Annals of Internal Medicine resulted in a blog by them which states: "By almost every measure, the VA is recognized as delivering consistently high-quality care to its patients" and "RAND's study, led by Dr. Steven Asch, found that the VA system delivered higher-quality care than the national sample of private hospitals on all measures except acute care (on which the two samples performed comparably). In nearly every other respect, VA patients received consistently better care across the board, including screening, diagnosis, treatment, and access to follow-up." They go on and on for several paragraphs, with the only negative thing being more-recent strains on the system by an aging population and an influx of Afghan and Iraq war veterans (Fortune mentions something similar, and also adds that after the improvements they also experienced an influx of veterans "voting with their feet" by coming back into the VA system from private care).

Oddly, reading through the first couple page of hits in the google search only finds similar praise (I googled "VA hospital cost and quality" if you're wondering.) I wasn't able to find anything to contradict this without adding more partisan words into my search.

[We Keep Receipts 9,238]

Because he loves us.

I'm sorry if you are looking for a logical explanation. But I just have to joke about his intense nature of trying to discover who black people are but he is looking down all of the wrong avenues. Although we keep trying to help him out, he just won't listen.

That was my point. It's this whole obsession with anything that's negative towards black people I have a problem with. I know you're doing what you can with it, and I thank you for that.

[Protocol417 161]

I just realized that we completely hijacked this thread. Holy Off Topic, Batman. Sorry!

[Danno 1,228]

Because he loves us.

I'm sorry if you are looking for a logical explanation. But I just have to joke about his intense nature of trying to discover who black people are but he is looking down all of the wrong avenues. Although we keep trying to help him out, he just won't listen.

Actually I do like you and Marvin but I also like stirring the pot a bit.

''''''Not that I do it maliciously or insincerely.

[Janelle2002 3,865]

I just realized that we completely hijacked this thread. Holy Off Topic, Batman. Sorry!

No problem. Danno always make every thread about black people if he can. I guess he thinks we are influencing immigrants to shoot eachother. Yeap, welcome to Dannoland.

And the VA does have good benefits. If we could all ave the same insurance it would insure equal medical treatment. Just saying

Edited October 15, 2013 by Janelle2002

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

From looking at how other countries handle their healthcare and from my own personal experience.

All other first-world countries have a single-payer system, and are, with few exceptions in each category, able to give their citizens a higher concentration of primary care doctors per capita, more hospital bed availability, longer hospital stays which result in lower readmission rates, lower infant mortality rates, and longer life expectancy for those who make it to 65 than we do. All for, on average, half the cost, and despite a population that smokes (again, on average) more than we do.

I myself have experience with the British NHS, as does my fiance, his family, our mutual friends, etc. My experience, and theirs, has been more attentive and easier-to-access primary care with less expense (comparable or lower expense in taxes there versus taxes here + insurance premiums [depending on if you calculate "insurance premium" as what the individual pays or individual + employer contributions], but with far lower co-pays and out-of-pocket expenses at point of use). Except for elective procedures, the whole "wait time" thing has been, so far, pretty much completely untrue, but the actual care received was, IMO, much better.

I also was part of "the poor" for many years of my life. Not everyone who is "poor" qualifies for Medicaid. Many people don't, and I was one of them. My employers (yes, multiple) didn't offer health insurance, I couldn't afford to go to the doctor, so when I was sick, I would wait until I couldn't do so any longer to see if it went away on its own, and when it didn't, I ended up in the emergency room. So I'd be interested to see where you get your statistics on "the poor" and how much of that had to do with access rather than a government program they may or may not have qualified for. Your statement was a little vague in that regard.

I have no experience with the VA myself, and have done little research on it. However, after a quick Google search, I found the following.

Fortune says of the VA that it is the "most wired and cost-effective health system in the land" and though they "used to be a byword for second-rate care or worse", now "they're national leaders in efficiency and quality". Time agrees, stating: "For the sixth year in a row, VA hospitals last year scored higher than private facilities on the University of Michigan's American Customer Satisfaction Index... Males 65 years and older receiving VA care had about a 40% lower risk of death than those enrolled in Medicare Advantage, whose care is provided through private health plans or HMOs." The Rand Corporation's study published in the Annals of Internal Medicine resulted in a blog by them which states: "By almost every measure, the VA is recognized as delivering consistently high-quality care to its patients" and "RAND's study, led by Dr. Steven Asch, found that the VA system delivered higher-quality care than the national sample of private hospitals on all measures except acute care (on which the two samples performed comparably). In nearly every other respect, VA patients received consistently better care across the board, including screening, diagnosis, treatment, and access to follow-up." They go on and on for several paragraphs, with the only negative thing being more-recent strains on the system by an aging population and an influx of Afghan and Iraq war veterans (Fortune mentions something similar, and also adds that after the improvements they also experienced an influx of veterans "voting with their feet" by coming back into the VA system from private care).

Oddly, reading through the first couple page of hits in the google search only finds similar praise (I googled "VA hospital cost and quality" if you're wondering.) I wasn't able to find anything to contradict this without adding more partisan words into my search.

I'll take a guess that Danno totally lost interest in this discussion now. Why did you have to bury him with facts that are destructive to his argument? It's not fair.