Egypt Declares State of Emergency as Security Forces Evict Morsi Supporters; Dozens Dead, Hundreds I

[Sarah Elle-Même 660]

http://world.time.com/2013/08/14/live-blog-egypt-declares-state-of-emergency-as-security-forces-evict-morsi-supporters-dozens-dead-hundreds-injured/

OMG you guys, it's, like, so obvs that secular people don't commit or encourage violence. They are for pacifism and democracy ya hear!

In my experience, hobbyist liberals are way too smug to admit when they are wrong.

Edited August 14, 2013 by Sarah and Adnan

[Dr. A ♥ O 203]

http://world.time.com/2013/08/14/live-blog-egypt-declares-state-of-emergency-as-security-forces-evict-morsi-supporters-dozens-dead-hundreds-injured/

OMG you guys, it's, like, so obvs that secular people don't commit or encourage violence. They are for pacifism and democracy ya hear!

In my experience, hobbyist liberals are way too smug to admit when they are wrong.

You might want to start your own thread for what happened in Egypt while America was sleeping last night. This has nothing to do with the terrorist attacks going on in Sinai.

[Ban Hammer 13,429]

topic split from another thread

[Dr. A ♥ O 203]

Yes, the US Embassy in Cairo is closed again.

If you're just waking up this morning then you're seeing that Egypt erupted in violence last night while America was sleeping. This **** hit the fan! So what happened and what does that mean?

The President of Egypt said the Nationwide State of Emergency is to commence at 4pm and to last for at least a month following the on-going violence.

Under the law, police powers were extended, constitutional rights suspended and censorship was legalized. The law sharply circumscribed any non-governmental political activity: street demonstrations, non-approved political organizations, and unregistered financial donations were formally banned. Some 17,000 people were detained under the law, and estimates of political prisoners run as high as 30,000.

Health Ministry has updated casualties: 149 Killed and 1400 wounded.

Egypt's acting VP has resigned.

Death toll from Fayoum Clashes has risen to 35.

Police have seized control of second camp of Morsi supporters in Cairo. Source

If you check facebook hashtags #Egypt and #Alexandria you're going to see lots of dead bodies in pictures and videos. Warning it's GRAPHIC! We're talking charred bodies in burned tents, brains blown out, bloodied corpses lined in rows with zip ties around their heads to keep their mouths closed.

All the roads are blocked.

1.Autostrad road : from nasr city to airport is totally closed

2.Bahr Aazam street in Giza is totally closed

3.el gamaa bridge in Giza
is totally closed

4. 6th October bridge is totally closed

5. 15th May
bridge is totally closed

6. Kasr el Nile bridge is totally closed

7. Salah Salem st. Is totally closed in Heliopolis area

8. Marghani st. & 7
omarat st. Is closed

9. NA road : fifth settlement , nasr city is
closed.

10. Gam3et El Dwal and el Batal street, Mohandessin is a land of war.

The banks are shut down, the egyptian stock exchange is shut down, the giza pyramids, the cairo museum and several other heritage sites all closed.

Also you'll see Ikhwan aka Muslim Brotherhood have lost their minds. Such as using children as human shields choking on tear gas, 30 different christian churches set on fire across the country, government buildings and the library of Alexandria attacked. Flipping army vehicles off of bridges, gun battles, ect. They're by no means perfect and peacefully protesting when they have extremists militants and thugs among them participating in battles with security forces. This was a deadly crack down no doubt but they were warned, given peaceful exits at the time of the event and found to be combative. Which is what the MB declared they would be if it came down to it, they would die for their cause, and so they are shooting guns, lighting things on fire, killing too.

Pushing a vehicle off October Bridge. Watch around :40.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6l7XeYdELNA

MB supporters firing on security forces.

Attacking another army vehicle they later light on fire.

cont'd

[sandinista! 1,816]

Why was this moved into a separate thread? A totally legitimate argument exists for the two issues being interconnected, Ken Silverstein said as much in the article I posted in the other thread.

You cannot preach about democracy then accept the outcome only if your side triumphs. In 2006, Hamas won a devastating victory in legislative elections in the Palestinian Authority. The following year, Palestinian president Mahmoud Abbas dissolved a Hamas-led unity government and swore in an emergency cabinet, leading the Obama Administration to reinstate aid that had been suspended under Hamas rule. This type of hypocrisy heightens anti-Americanism, sends the message that elections are meaningless, and encourages terrorism.[3]

[3] For instance, radical Islamic terrorism in the Sinai appears to have surged since Morsi was deposed.

But hey, two totally separate issues. It's just ridiculous and crazy to think massacres like last night's, where tents children were sleeping in were set on fire, could possibly inspire any kind of blowback...

[Dr. A ♥ O 203]

16:25 GMT: Egyptian police forces have seized full control of the second camp of Morsi supporters in Cairo, according to state TV. It was reported that pro-Morsi loyalists were allowed safe passage out of the camp. Source

They also found weapons and ammunition in the camps by the wagon load. It's on video in several of the news reports. There were armed Islamists inside and outside the camps.

More militants with automatic weapons shooting on security.

More gun battles with MB supporters.

Snippers on rooftops

Preliminary list of Coptic churches and properties that were attacked by the Muslim Brotherhood:

قائمة مبدأية بالكنائس والممتلكات الكنسية او القبطية التي تم الاعتداء عليها حتي الآن

1-كنيسة العذراء والانبا ابرام - دلجا - مركز دير مواس - المنيا

1- St.Mary and Anba Abraam church, Delga, Deir Mawas, El Minia

2-كنيسة مارمينا - حى ابو هلال - بندر المنيا

2- St. George Church, Abu Hilal district, El Minia

3-كنيسة مارجرس - ارض المطرانيه - سوهاج...

3- St George Church, Souhag

4-كنيسة العذراء - قرية النازله - مركز يوسف الصديق - الفيوم

4-St Mary church, El Nazla village, Fayoum

5-الكنيسه المعمدانيه - بنى مزار المنيا

5- The Baptist church, Beni Mazar, El Minia

6- اعتداءات على محلات الاقباط فى شارع الجمهوريه - باسيوط

6-Coptic owned shops and properties in El Gomohoria street, Asuit

7-قام أنصار الرئيس المعزول بالسويس باقتحام مدرسة ”الفرنسيسكان“ وحرق عدد من السيارات أمام كنيسة الراعى الصالح.

7- Raiding the " Franciscan" school in Suez and setting several cars on fire in front of " The Good Shepherd church"

8 - مطرانية دير مواس المنيا

8- St Mark's church, Deir Mawas, El Minia

9- مدرسة الراهبات بني سويف

7- The catholic school in Beni Suif

10- جمعية أصدقاء الكتاب المقدس الفيوم !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

10- Bible study center in Fayoum

And there's a diplomatic **it storm that has ensued from this. The Egyptian VP has resigned. The rest of the world is condemning the escalation of violence.

Edited August 14, 2013 by ॐ

[Dr. A ♥ O 203]

topic split from another thread

Oops I started one too. Please merge my thread http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/448160-state-of-emergency-declared-in-egypt/ with this one.

[Sarah Elle-Même 660]

You might want to start your own thread for what happened in Egypt while America was sleeping last night. This has nothing to do with the terrorist attacks going on in Sinai.

If you really think the two events have nothing to do with each other, all I can think in my mind is lost cause.

Nevermind the fact that the thread you started had already incorporated several events that are, in fact, interconnected. At least I didn't add in callous sound effects.

Blowback. It's already happening and will most definitely continue to happen. It will be very, very ugly.

[Ontarkie 14,304]

~~~~Duplicate threads merged~~~~

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

Since Mursi was toppled, the security forces had twice before killed scores of protesters in attempts to drive Mursi's followers off the streets. But they had held back from a full-scale assault on the tented camp where followers and their families have lived behind makeshift barricades.

After the assault on the camp began, desperate residents recited Koranic verse and screamed "God help us! God help us!" while helicopters hovered overhead and armored bulldozers ploughed over their makeshift defenses.

Reuters journalists on the scene saw masked police in dark uniforms pour out of police vans with sticks and tear gas bombs. They tore down tents and set them ablaze.

"They smashed through our walls. Police and soldiers, they fired tear gas at children," said Saleh Abdulaziz, 39, a secondary school teacher clutching a bleeding wound on his head.

...

At another location in Cairo, a Reuters reporter was in a crowd of Mursi supporters when he heard bullets whizzing past and hitting walls. The crowd dived to the ground for cover. A man was killed by a bullet to the head.

The government insists people in the camp were armed. Several television stations, all controlled by the state or its sympathizers, ran footage of what appeared to be pro-Mursi protesters firing rifles at soldiers from behind sandbag barricades.

However Reuters journalists and other Western media have not witnessed such incidents. Crowds appeared to be armed mainly with sticks, stones and slabs of concrete against rifle-wielding police and troops.

...

At a makeshift morgue at the camp field hospital, a Reuters reporter counted 29 bodies, with others still arriving. Most had died of gunshot wounds to the head.

A 12-year-old boy, bare-chested with tracksuit trousers, lay out in the corridor, a bullet wound through his neck. His mother was bent over him, rocking back and forth and silently kissing his chest. One of the nurses was sobbing on her hands and knees as she tried to mop up the blood with a roll of tissue.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/08/14/us-egypt-protests-idUSBRE97C09A20130814

This was a massacre.

[Dr. A ♥ O 203]

If you really think the two events have nothing to do with each other, all I can think in my mind is lost cause.

Nevermind the fact that the thread you started had already incorporated several events that are, in fact, interconnected. At least I didn't add in callous sound effects.

Blowback. It's already happening and will most definitely continue to happen. It will be very, very ugly.

Would you guys make up your minds please? Either you're arguing that they're all terrorists or that they're not. You guys can't have it both ways.

The death toll is up to 280 and that's including security forces which is around 1/3 of that. This is a two way battle though that fact seems to largely be under reported because of the civilians deaths.

The protesters had a two day warning in the media to clear out. Nevermind that they had a months warning that it was coming. The MB leaders encouraged supporters and announced for them to remain at the protests and become martyrs despite the warnings to clear out. Then the MB leaders sat in their mosques while they put the women and children in front lines as human shields. What exactly have the Christian minority done to have their churches burned today and be prosecuted under Morsi? Are the Interior Ministry bases in the churches or something? I'd take the other guy over the MB if all those things were happening to me too. There is some pretty gruesome Youtube videos right now of executions of military and security forces by the MB. What about those crimes? What about the inciting of mob violence and the continued themes of ransacking cultural heritage sites such as the library in Alexandria? Why do they hate Egypt and everything about it so much that they want to destroy it? They could have gone towards a path of peace and reconciliation and admitted that they really screwed up during the Presidency by trying to make everyone live according to their way of life but they wouldn't do it, and now look at this mess. Egypt is burning and warring. It seems Egypt is hopelessly lost.

This affects us on a personal note today too. We just received bad news from our family. One of our cousins died in these clashes today. He came to our wedding in Cairo a few years ago.

[Heather&Ramy 22]

I'm so sorry for your loss.

I'm sorry for all of Egypt today.

Thanks to everybody for sharing the videos and articles.

I saw this interview on the news yesterday, and I believe this is the ONLY guy in the American media who has any idea of what's going on.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ebjxrsDHiEM

He did another interview today on the same show, I will try to find it online. Today he addressed the escalation towards Christians and innocent non-MB civilians by the MB. "Are they just collateral damage or are they being specifically targeted?" They are being specifically targeted. It's not as if the tiny 10% of Christians in Egypt are single-handedly responsible for ousting Morsi and their ancient churches are basecamp for the military.

[Heather&Ramy 22]

Can't edit my previous post, not sure why,

but here is the clip from today:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=chtGonznBDE

Again, I can't edit it for some reason, but I wanted to include a quote from the above link in case you're not sure if you want to watch it.

He says,

“We need to get over our narcissism and realize what’s going on in Egypt isn’t about us, it’s about the people in Egypt and other peoples throughout the Middle East struggling against fundamentalist extremists who are our enemies too—people struggling to build modern, decent, tolerant societies.”

“We cannot determine Egypt’s future, the Egyptian people have to determine that… but we should try to play constructively and not automatically assume—ooh, military: bad— peaceful protesters who happen to be thugs : good. I’m appalled at hearing so many Westerner commentators condemning the military and seemingly siding with the Brotherhood…. The Egyptian people want a little bit of freedom, and the Brotherhood came to power and tried to take that little bit of hard-won freedom away, and now you’re seeing the reaction. Again, I don’t like military coups, but the real coup was what Morsi and the Muslim Brotherhood did to the fledgling Egyptian democracy. We need to get our priorities straight, and our priorities should be on the side of modernity, tolerance, progress, economic growth, and decency. Not on the side of bigoted, medieval, primitive, hate-filled religion directed against peaceful Muslims above all, because we should remember that the victims of radical, fanatical Islam have overwhelmingly been decent everyday Muslims.”

and today( in the second link) he says,

regarding the President's repeated portrayal of the MB as "peaceful protesters"

"peaceful protesters don't kill policemen, they don't burn churches and attack and kill Christians, they don't kidnap secularists and imprison them in mosques and torture them."

He gets politically controversial after that, talking about if Obama's admin would react differently if it was Christians killing Muslims, and so you can take that or leave it, but at least SOMEBODY in the US is covering the violence from the MB!!!!! They are not innocent, peaceful, democratically-minded protesters!

Edited August 15, 2013 by Heather&Ramy

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

There has been absolutely no evidence presented that any of the murdered protestors from the camp were involved in any church burnings, or attacks on Christians, or kidnappings, or any of these other claims.

Attempts to cite heinous acts committed in various places by who knows who as some kind of justification for the mass murder of political opponents and protesters is completely outrageous.

[sandinista! 1,816]

There has been absolutely no evidence presented that any of the murdered protestors from the camp were involved in any church burnings, or attacks on Christians, or kidnappings, or any of these other claims.

Attempts to cite heinous acts committed in various places by who knows who as some kind of justification for the mass murder of political opponents and protesters is completely outrageous.

Yep.

Massacre Of Islamists By Egyptian Military Likely Strategic Post by HAROON MOGHUL

Its hard to get a handle on whats happening in Egypt, but my sense is that all of this is deeply political in nature and intent. This is more than just a massacre, its a strategic massacre.

By cracking down so violently and indiscriminately on the Muslim Brotherhood and its supporters, the military well knows it will initiate a cycle of retaliatory violence on the part of supporters, sympathizers, and opportunistic elements in the Sinai and elsewhere, who get blamed for being the Brotherhood even though theres absolutely no evidence that they are.

My proof is both current and preemptive. First, the military has not, as journalist @SarahCarr pointed out, tried to protect Christian churches, which historically get attacked in periods of crisis. The military surely knew there would be reprisals against Christians whove been perceived to be in support of the coup (which disempowered a class of people long brutalized by the army.) Either the military didn't care what happened to Copts, which based on the Maspero massacre is quite probable, or (maybe "and") they wanted Copts to be attacked. Which is to say, they used them as bait.

http://www.religiondispatches.org/dispatches/haroonmoghul/7252/massacre_of_islamists_by_egyptian_military_likely_strategic/#.UgzaKMslclw.twitter