Driver says he did all he could during Florida school bus beating

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Her cuts and bruises / injuries can't possibly have been bad enough to justify interfering with the god-given civil right of poor, oppressed, profiled black urban youth to hand out a beat-down (oh and rob the girl too by the way)

http://seattletimes.com/html/localnews/2012062962_tunnel09m.html

Several males with the defendant could be seen on the video grabbing Steward-Baker's phone, purse and iPod. When video of the attack surfaced, the security company, as well as King County Metro Transit, the King County Sheriff's Office and Seattle police received harsh criticism for not doing more to prevent or intervene in the attack.

If you're going to quote my post, try and stay on the point of the argument. The OP is about the bus driving not doing enough to stop the attack. It's been suggested that the bus driver didn't do enough because he's black as were the attackers. I then made the point that as school employee, he is required to follow a crisis protocol established by his employer. So the real argument is whether or not he followed protocol and if he did, and people feel that wasn't enough, then criticise the policy of the school, not him.

[Dan and Judy 614]

Wait. You think an employee of the school should actually fight underage students without any legal repercussions? And the bus driver no less - who is responsible for the safety of all the kids on the bus? That's ridiculous. It's one thing to break up a fight, it's another to actually strike a student, no matter the situation. Schools have or should have crisis protocols for things like fights. The questions should be focused on whether that bus driver followed the protocol or not. If there was no protocol then the criticism should be aimed at school for not preparing for inevitable situations.

If you have a couple of 10 year olds fighting in a mutual combat you can pick them up by the scruff of the neck and hold them apart until they settle down.

This was not a mutually agreed to wrestling match. This was 3 older kids beating the ####### out of one younger kid.

the bus driver politely asked them to stop, they didn't so their respect for authority is limited at best. Possibly they are deaf and he should have tried sign language.

regardless of school policy there is a moral obligation to intervene if you can do so without getting your own butt kicked.

I guess it is logical that someone who thinks Zimmerman was whupping down on Trayvon would think this 64 year old could physically restrain 3 15 year olds.

The two questions I see are #1 did he have the power to stop it ?

#2 If so should he?

My answer to #2 is yes

I respect his answer to #1 in this case which was no

If the answer to both of those is yes then he should use necessary force. which in this case would include using the same amount of force they were using against the victim

If you come home from work and find a couple of 15 year olds raping your wife. Naturally your first response is to request that they cease. "Excuse me sir, That's my wife you're boning. I was wondering if you could uh maybe go bone someone else's wife. You appear to be minors so of course I'm not going to

hit you but I would really appreciate it if you did not actual cum in there. When they failed to comply all you could do would be to throw yourself in between

them and your wife. Still they fail to stop. Suddenly you realize your pants are down around your ankles. UMMMMF OMG that hurts. At least at first. The boys being satisfied put on their clothes and leave. The worst part is your wife is mad at you because you didn't let her finish.

Edited August 7, 2013 by Dan and Judy

[GandD 5,966]

You're an odd guy

[decocker 7,198]

classy wife.

[Jacque67 7,328]

Very strange story. Freaky.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

If you have a couple of 10 year olds fighting in a mutual combat you can pick them up by the scruff of the neck and hold them apart until they settle down.

This was not a mutually agreed to wrestling match. This was 3 older kids beating the ####### out of one younger kid.

the bus driver politely asked them to stop, they didn't so their respect for authority is limited at best. Possibly they are deaf and he should have tried sign language.

regardless of school policy there is a moral obligation to intervene if you can do so without getting your own butt kicked.

I guess it is logical that someone who thinks Zimmerman was whupping down on Trayvon would think this 64 year old could physically restrain 3 15 year olds.

The two questions I see are #1 did he have the power to stop it ?

#2 If so should he?

My answer to #2 is yes

I respect his answer to #1 in this case which was no

If the answer to both of those is yes then he should use necessary force. which in this case would include using the same amount of force they were using against the victim

If you come home from work and find a couple of 15 year olds raping your wife. Naturally your first response is to request that they cease. "Excuse me sir, That's my wife you're boning. I was wondering if you could uh maybe go bone someone else's wife. You appear to be minors so of course I'm not going to

hit you but I would really appreciate it if you did not actual cum in there. When they failed to comply all you could do would be to throw yourself in between

them and your wife. Still they fail to stop. Suddenly you realize your pants are down around your ankles. UMMMMF OMG that hurts. At least at first. The boys being satisfied put on their clothes and leave. The worst part is your wife is mad at you because you didn't let her finish.

You're not thinking this one through because your supposition has no basis in reality. Employees are expected to follow company policy, especially regarding liability and when they don't, they are punished. If company policy is wrong, then direct criticism at such policy and not the employee whose job is to follow it. Now suppose you are 64 and decide to take a job as a school bus driver. In your training, you are told what the proper protocol is for a crisis - say a fight on the bus. The school tells you to radio it in and the dispatcher will contact law enforcement if necessary. Then you raise your hand and ask, "What if a child is being attacked by several children?" Your supervisor says call 911, but don't get physically involved in the altercation, do you tell him, "Can't do that. If I see a kid taking a beating by several others, I'm gonna busts some heads until the hitting stops." Guess what? You don't get hired. Why? Because of liability. Don't like it? Criticise the system or the policy, but not an old, black, bus driver because you think he was showing racial preference to the perpetrators. That's called a red herring.

[Dan and Judy 614]

You're an odd guy

Who? Me?

No I think he was talking to me.

Oh, Ok as long as he wasn't talking to me

[Penny Lane 8,159]

Who? Me?

No I think he was talking to me.

Oh, Ok as long as he wasn't talking to me

Oh good, this act again.

It's amateur comedy hour on VJ.

[GandD 5,966]

You're not thinking this one through because your supposition has no basis in reality. Employees are expected to follow company policy, especially regarding liability and when they don't, they are punished. If company policy is wrong, then direct criticism at such policy and not the employee whose job is to follow it. Now suppose you are 64 and decide to take a job as a school bus driver. In your training, you are told what the proper protocol is for a crisis - say a fight on the bus. The school tells you to radio it in and the dispatcher will contact law enforcement if necessary. Then you raise your hand and ask, "What if a child is being attacked by several children?" Your supervisor says call 911, but don't get physically involved in the altercation, do you tell him, "Can't do that. If I see a kid taking a beating by several others, I'm gonna busts some heads until the hitting stops." Guess what? You don't get hired. Why? Because of liability. Don't like it? Criticise the system or the policy, but not an old, black, bus driver because you think he was showing racial preference to the perpetrators. That's called a red herring.

Yeah but there's a human level involved too. I think what you're saying is right but it may not be what stayed the bus drivers hand in this case. He could have been afraid for his own personal safety, paralyzed with fear or uncertainty. Hard to say, since people handle situations so differently. I would think your fear of losing your job would go out the window after a few minutes of hearing this kid getting beat down. But like I said earlier, what are you going to do going forward? Hire bus drivers with the physical means to restrain children or accept that their will be more of these types of events so the schools can keep their nose clean?

[decocker 7,198]

all bus drivers should have aides. it's just silly to expect a driver to also babysit. i hated riding the bus as a kid, it was a free for all. a daily ride through lord of the flies..

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Yeah but there's a human level involved too. I think what you're saying is right but it may not be what stayed the bus drivers hand in this case. He could have been afraid for his own personal safety, paralyzed with fear or uncertainty. Hard to say, since people handle situations so differently. I would think your fear of losing your job would go out the window after a few minutes of hearing this kid getting beat down. But like I said earlier, what are you going to do going forward? Hire bus drivers with the physical means to restrain children or accept that their will be more of these types of events so the schools can keep their nose clean?

It's all conjecture, but at least the poor man has been public about how terrible he feels about not doing more. I'm sure I would have reacted differently in that situation but I'm younger and tend to be more impulsive.

You bring up an important question - what should be done to prevent such violence? I tend think an ounce of prevention is the most effective way.

[spookyturtle 9,466]

I used to get beat up on the bus too. Once I started packin' heat, end of problem.

[Dan and Judy 614]

Criticise the system or the policy, but not an old, black, bus driver because you think he was showing racial preference to the perpetrators. That's called a red herring.

I think you are hallucinating

I never criticized the the driver. I think you are arguing with the wrong guy.

Hey don't look at me , I never criticized the driver. Did anyone here criticize the driver?

Not me!

Me either.

Edited August 7, 2013 by Dan and Judy

[Penny Lane 8,159]

I loved riding the bus. If you got the seat at the back of the bus, you were the envy of everyone!

[Jacque67 7,328]

I think you are hallucinating

I never criticized the the driver. I think you are arguing with the wrong guy.

Hey don't look at me , I never criticized the driver. Did anyone here criticize the driver?

Not me!

Me either.

What are you on? Lol.