What Happens Without Affirmative Action: The Story Of UCLA

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Get back to me when you can have an intelligent debate. My GPA or whether or not I went to a university is irrelevant.

It is relevant because you're making the argument that grades alone make someone more qualified when applying to a university. So just answer question - did you attend a university and if so, what was your GPA?

[Karee 4,191]

It is relevant because you're making the argument that grades alone make someone more qualified when applying to a university. So just answer question - did you attend a university and if so, what was your GPA?

No, I didn't attend a university. I dropped out of school shortly after beginning the 10th grade with most of my school years spent in the Detroit Public School System. On top of that I'm a twice convicted felon. Yet, I'm still able to point out your numerous spelling errors around here, as well as your constant failed socialist logic. So it seems that degree hasn't helped you much.

Must be because I'm white.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

No, I didn't attend a university. I dropped out of school shortly after beginning the 10th grade with most of my school years spent in the Detroit Public School System. On top of that I'm a twice convicted felon. Yet, I'm still able to point out your numerous spelling errors around here, as well as your constant failed socialist logic. So it seems that degree hasn't helped you much.

Must be because I'm white.

So you're living proof that employers don't always pick 'the most qualified,' assuming that you have some success being employed.

[Karee 4,191]

So you're living proof that employers don't always pick 'the most qualified,' assuming that you have some success being employed.

Depends on what you mean by "qualified" Some look at your work history and base your qualifications on that. Others want to see a college degree. Some employers hire someone because they're married to their sister.

If you have a point, make it. Quit screwing around asking me personal questions.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Depends on what you mean by "qualified" Some look at your work history and base your qualifications on that. Others want to see a college degree. Some employers hire someone because they're married to their sister.

If you have a point, make it. Quit screwing around asking me personal questions.

The process for applicants who wish to attend university is similar. Diversity is regarded as a vital part of that process. GPA's and test scores aren't the only thing they look at, nor are they necessarily the most important because we know statistically they don't indicate a higher success rate. Do you get it now?

Edited June 24, 2013 by Lincolns mullet

[Karee 4,191]

The process for applicants who wish to attend university is similar. Diversity is regarded as a vital part of that process. GPA's and test scores aren't the only thing they look at, nor are they necessarily the most important because we know statistically they don't indicate a higher success rate. Do you get it now?

That's fine. Race should not be part of that selection process since racism is a bad thing. However, according to the article I posted, it seems that setting aside some admission slots for people that come from low income backgrounds has had the effect of more minorities being admitted. Doing this while not using race as a factor. As I said before, seems like a good deal for everyone involved, unless you're a racist and want to treat people differently based on their race. I can see why the racists might have an issue with this program.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

I think we can confidently say that racial considerations for admissions should be a thing of the past when equally qualified black men with a clean criminal background have better chances to be considered for employment than white men with a criminal background. Apparently, we're not there yet. Given similar qualifications, employers seem to prefer white convicts over black employees with a clean background.

That's affirmative action right there. And it's not minorities that benefit from it!

Devah Pager
Princeton University

Is racial discrimination a thing of the past?

Debates about the relevance of discrimination in today's society have been difficult to resolve, in part because of the challenges in identifying, measuring, and documenting its presence or absence in all but extreme cases. Discrimination is rarely something that can be observed explicitly.

To address these issues, I recently conducted a series of experiments investigating employment discrimination. In these experiments, which took place in Milwaukee and New York City, I hired young men to pose as job applicants, assigning them resumes with equal levels of education and experience, and sending them to apply for real entry-level job openings all over the city.

Team members also alternated presenting information about a fictitious criminal record (a drug felony), which they “fessed up to” on the application form. During nearly a year of fieldwork, teams of testers audited hundreds of employers, applying for a wide range of entry level jobs such as waiters, sales assistants, laborers, warehouse workers, couriers, and customer service representatives.

The results of these studies were startling. Among those with no criminal record, white applicants were more than twice as likely to receive a callback relative to equally qualified black applicants. Even more troubling, whites with a felony conviction fared just as well, if not better, than a black applicant with a clean background.

http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2008/08/09/study-black-man-and-white-felon-same-chances-for-hire/

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

If you follow any professional sports (my guess is you don't), you'd know that the top draft picks don't always pan out. The above quote from that article exemplifies that - that measuring sticks are often inaccurate in determining success - whether it's in professional sports, business or even academics. What they can look at statistically, is when teams, companies and universities thrive and they most often thrive from diversity.

and you will also note that the best performers get drafted. If one Defensive end has better strength, speed, and vertical jump than another, the lesser of the two does not get points because he is white and whites are under represented in the nFL The Job goes to the best performer period.

You are correct, sometimes a 5 star athlete it is a bust , but past performance is the best indicator of future success.

Glad you brought up sports. Should a certain percentage of whites be drafter into the NBA ahead of better prospects because they might turn into a star and it would help diversity ?

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

First,

Why are their historically "black" or "African American Colleges?" Well, being that soooo many "White" colleges did not want to let blacks into their colleges and blacks still wanted to get an education, there rose the idea, lets create a college of our own so that students do not have to be humiliated, spit at, gawked at, and ignored by teachers when they are trying to get admitted or sitting in a classroom. However, this does not mean that any non black students will not get admitted into a historically black college. Many non black students would not want to attend a historically black college, although I personally know of some non black students who have attended and who have accepted positions to these types of schools. I personally did not try for one, because I believe in diversity, understanding of other cultures, regardless of race. But as you can see by some of the negative, ignorant comments being made on just this board alone, (really, look at yahoo) others are not so accepting of blacks. Lets face it, there will always be people from many races who are ignorant and judgmental of other races, but do not let it be because the television told you to or because you saw this one black person that meets the stereotypes, let it be because you have actually searched and have met many people of that particular race and have come to that conclusion. Like for instance, black people don't speak foreign languages. Many people were upset over Star Trek because Zoe was speaking a foreign language. I speak Japanese, Sinhalese and English!!

We would not need these types of admission programs as colleges if people would not be discriminated against because of their race and socioeconomic background. It should be a balance of things that are looked at to make a determination on whether or not a student is admitted. And just because someone was admitted because a university needs to meet their diversity quota, does not mean that they picked a person of color whom does not meet any academic quality at all. "Ow heres a good candidate. Made a 12 on the ACT, cant spell or write. Let him into the Law School." I mean really, schools would not be that stupid to do that.

Thank you for the history lesson on why we had black colleges. That was a complete mystery to most of us.In other news water is wet.

We also use to have Jim Crow, separate bathrooms, black seating sections on trains, black only hospitals, etc etc. I guess you get my drift. Somehow we ended segregation but at the same time blacks held on to the segregated things that, ,well they wanted to keep segregated. Sorry but it is still Racism and segregation.

So you are ok with a country club working to promote white culture, and be a place where whites can feel comfortable in a culture that is theirs.

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

Exactly. In a way, it is a lot like professional sports drafts, where often, 6th round draft picks far exceed many top draft picks because of the various intangibles that contribute to the success or failure of an athlete. Scouts scour through all the statistics in hope of finding the best athletes only to find that some things can't be measured or translated into statistics.

So why don't they just draft the 6th round athlets to start with... Your point is insane. Yes sometimes an athlete blooms late or does better at the next level than expected and sometimes 1st round picks go bust.

However it is not the norm. There is a reason the 1st round draft picks go in the 1st round. They are much more likely to succeed.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

SCOTUS punted and sent the issue back to the lower courts. The issue will be revisited again in two years.

High court sends back Texas race-based plan

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

We had to go to the emergency room last night at 3:00 AM, because my wife had an allergy to crab. The doctor came in to see us. Nice young black man, my first thought was " I wonder if he got here because of of Affirmative action and god I hope not. Racist of me ? Perhaps. However until we endrace based affirmative action programs it is always going to be a stigma.

That was your first thought - was the doctor there because of affirmative action ?

And some people still think we don't have a ways to go.....

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

That was your first thought - was the doctor there because of affirmative action ?

And some people still think we don't have a ways to go.....

Ain't that the truth.

[RGinWA 816]

That was your first thought - was the doctor there because of affirmative action ?

And some people still think we don't have a ways to go.....

Internal attitude towards others usually creeps it's way into actions in some way. I see this by people all the time and they don't see the reasoning that we still have a long way to go in regards to equality.

Case in point the Muslim intolerance based on a branch of extremist teachings. In my experience I've been fortunate to have Muslim friends, but many learn about the faith through TV and news reports. It's a huge misconception perpetrated by the media.

[Karee 4,191]

That was your first thought - was the doctor there because of affirmative action ?

And some people still think we don't have a ways to go.....

What's wrong with that thought? Granted it shouldn't be the first the thought he has when going to an emergency room. I find myself thinking the same things at times. Did this person get this position because they are qualified, or did they get it because of their race? That's a rational thought IMO when you make hiring decisions based on race rather than qualifications.

I agree we have a long way to go. One place to start would be to bring an end to racist programs like affirmative action.