Unbelieveable K1 decision at Thailand US Embassy!!!!

[Boiler 45,482]

I do not understand the issue.

Seems the K1 application wss valid and issued appropriately.

[Ceilla 7]

I think as long they can be reunited, every other problem they had just put them aside. Their happiness is the most important. I believe he earn enough money to support his family when they'll get to US. The power of love is miracle

[VanessaTony 3,567]

Again, he submitted NO tax transcripts, NO pay stubs, had a $17,000 federal tax lien, $75,000 past child support judgment, revoked and expired US Passport!!!.....and still got APPROVED!!

Tax transcripts and pay stubs are not a requirement of the I-134 so that's irrelevant.

A judgment is also irrelevant (may be relevant depending what it's for but because it's child support, doesn't matter).

Expired/revoked US passport, irrelevant.

The tax lien is also irrelevant unless he's using assets to qualify.

Honestly, they DO NOT care about debts, they only care about income compared to family size. A judgment cannot collect on someone below a certain threshold. A lien only comes into place when someone sells their property, so again, this doesn't affect his income, just his asset pool if that were used.

Reads like it was appropriately approved.

[mrrobj 20]

Tax transcripts and pay stubs are not a requirement of the I-134 so that's irrelevant.

A judgment is also irrelevant (may be relevant depending what it's for but because it's child support, doesn't matter).

Expired/revoked US passport, irrelevant.

The tax lien is also irrelevant unless he's using assets to qualify.

Honestly, they DO NOT care about debts, they only care about income compared to family size. A judgment cannot collect on someone below a certain threshold. A lien only comes into place when someone sells their property, so again, this doesn't affect his income, just his asset pool if that were used.

Reads like it was appropriately approved.

VanessaTony,

Everything you mentioned was exactly what the Immigration Attorney advised him, with the exception of the tax lien. He indicated that federal tax liens are public records and our accessible to the Embassy during their review. The Attorney further indicated that the tax lien was subtracted from his income, but, even after the tax lien was removed from his income, his income still met the income guidelines for approval of the Fiance Visa.

I think this case shows how an Immigration Attorney can be beneficial to some applicants, but maybe not to all. This individual did not feel comfortable going at this process alone or listening to someone like me, who was not a lawyer or experienced in the Immigration laws. Thus, he made an good choice for his family.

It is repeatedly cited on this site how hiring an Attorney can be a waste of money. However, just as in this case, an individual could read the guides extensively from this site and/or read repeated opinions of others and believe he did not have a chance. Yes, we are all aware that they are some bad lawyers out there, but some produce desired results, as in this case.

Some can believe lawyers could be a waste of money and they could have valid points, but I think we should be careful by repeatedly stating on this site that hiring a lawyer is "waste of money".

I feel I followed the advice of many on this site and attempted to advise this individual and I was completely wrong. If this individual would have listened to me, he would have been separated from his family for another year and I can't help but think about this and feel somewhat guilt. Notably, he followed the advise of this Immigration lawyer and obtained his Fiance Visa.

As I previously indicated, I would never again advise someone against the advice of an Attorney based on what I read or believe. Notably, it is a valid disclaimer on this website that makes it clear the site should not be used in place of an experienced Immigration lawyer.

Another point, I attempted to make was the fact that the Consulars do have some type of discretion in these cases. I do not think anyone can dispute this. As we have seen in some cases, we can dot all the "i"s and submit the applications to the letter AND still have the Visa denied because a Consular can determine it is not credible or sufficient.

With this in mind, I thought a Consular would have exercised their discretion on this case and seen some of the red flags and denied the Visa. Notably, the Visa was approved in this case and another family is going to be happily re-united and this is definitely good news!!

This site could be very valuable to members, but I think we should take all advice with a grain of salt and be careful in how we respond to others who are looking for advice on serious family matters. Our advice and opinons could have serious implications on the re-uniting of families......and this should not be taken lightly.....

Edited June 16, 2013 by mrrobj

[NikLR 13,227]

The problem is; good lawyers can be very beneficial to many people. There are people on this site that SHOULD have lawyers helping them.

If you have a straightforward, easy case, and the time to devote to it, then yes, a lawyer probably is not necessary.

If you don't have time, an easy case, it's not straightforward, there are any kind of issues, then looking into a lawyer is a very good idea.

Hiring a lawyer always requires research and will cost you. A good lawyer is not cheap, but not all expensive lawyers are good lawyers either.

[VanessaTony 3,567]

Everything you mentioned was exactly what the Immigration Attorney advised him, with the exception of the tax lien. He indicated that federal tax liens are public records and our accessible to the Embassy during their review. The Attorney further indicated that the tax lien was subtracted from his income, but, even after the tax lien was removed from his income, his income still met the income guidelines for approval of the Fiance Visa.

I think this case shows how an Immigration Attorney can be beneficial to some applicants, but maybe not to all. This individual did not feel comfortable going at this process alone or listening to someone like me, who was not a lawyer or experienced in the Immigration laws. Thus, he made an good choice for his family.

It is repeatedly cited on this site how hiring an Attorney can be a waste of money. However, just as in this case, an individual could read the guides extensively from this site and/or read repeated opinions of others and believe he did not have a chance. Yes, we are all aware that they are some bad lawyers out there, but some produce desired results, as in this case.

Some can believe lawyers could be a waste of money and they could have valid points, but I think we should be careful by repeatedly stating on this site that hiring a lawyer is "waste of money".

I feel I followed the advice of many on this site and attempted to advise this individual and I was completely wrong. If this individual would have listened to me, he would have been separated from his family for another year and I can't help but think about this and feel somewhat guilt. Notably, he followed the advise of this Immigration lawyer and obtained his Fiance Visa.

As I previously indicated, I would never again advise someone against the advice of an Attorney based on what I read or believe. Notably, it is a valid disclaimer on this website that makes it clear the site should not be used in place of an experienced Immigration lawyer.

Another point, I attempted to make was the fact that the Consulars do have some type of discretion in these cases. I do not think anyone can dispute this. As we have seen in some cases, we can dot all the "i"s and submit the applications to the letter AND still have the Visa denied because a Consular can determine it is not credible or sufficient.

With this in mind, I thought a Consular would have exercised their discretion on this case and seen some of the red flags and denied the Visa. Notably, the Visa was approved in this case and another family is going to be happily re-united and this is definitely good news!!

This site could be very valuable to members, but I think we should take all advice with a grain of salt and be careful in how we respond to others who are looking for advice on serious family matters. Our advice and opinons could have serious implications on the re-uniting of families......and this should not be taken lightly.....

Actually if the person you're talking about posted on here I think absolutely every experienced member would say "Hire an attorney" because we don't advise about that stuff.

I disagree with the tax lien v income stuff but as his income was more that sufficient to deal with it, so whether it did or didn't count against him his income was still sufficient.

I would never have advised your friend (on the forums maybe a little bit of advice but not definitively). I've advised people with simple cases, successfully. I once helped someone with a late-filed ROC (again successfully), but your friends situation was WAY outside DIY, and I think I can confidently say that most of us here wouldn't have become involved in something like that and told him in no uncertain terms to see a lawyer.

[Boiler 45,482]

Nothing to suggest a Lawyer was needed in this case.

[Karee 4,190]

.

The only way the embassy is going to know about a tax lien is call IRS its not stamped on your form. So submitting the tax forms he shows his income and thats it. I-134 for fiance visa isn't even binding.

Absolutely 100% not true. I know this because it happened to me. Also, NVC approved my I-864 with no issues.

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/180632-denied-in-bangkok/

[VanessaTony 3,567]

Nothing to suggest a Lawyer was needed in this case.

So given the child support judgment, tax lien and everything else you would have been 100% confident telling the OP's friend he doesn't need a lawyer?

Guaranteed if he already had those issues, there were probably others the OP didn't mention.

[Karee 4,190]

VanessaTony,

Everything you mentioned was exactly what the Immigration Attorney advised him, with the exception of the tax lien. He indicated that federal tax liens are public records and our accessible to the Embassy during their review. The Attorney further indicated that the tax lien was subtracted from his income, but, even after the tax lien was removed from his income, his income still met the income guidelines for approval of the Fiance Visa.

I think this case shows how an Immigration Attorney can be beneficial to some applicants, but maybe not to all. This individual did not feel comfortable going at this process alone or listening to someone like me, who was not a lawyer or experienced in the Immigration laws. Thus, he made an good choice for his family.

It is repeatedly cited on this site how hiring an Attorney can be a waste of money. However, just as in this case, an individual could read the guides extensively from this site and/or read repeated opinions of others and believe he did not have a chance. Yes, we are all aware that they are some bad lawyers out there, but some produce desired results, as in this case.

Some can believe lawyers could be a waste of money and they could have valid points, but I think we should be careful by repeatedly stating on this site that hiring a lawyer is "waste of money".

I feel I followed the advice of many on this site and attempted to advise this individual and I was completely wrong. If this individual would have listened to me, he would have been separated from his family for another year and I can't help but think about this and feel somewhat guilt. Notably, he followed the advise of this Immigration lawyer and obtained his Fiance Visa.

As I previously indicated, I would never again advise someone against the advice of an Attorney based on what I read or believe. Notably, it is a valid disclaimer on this website that makes it clear the site should not be used in place of an experienced Immigration lawyer.

This site could be very valuable to members, but I think we should take all advice with a grain of salt and be careful in how we respond to others who are looking for advice on serious family matters. Our advice and opinons could have serious implications on the re-uniting of families......and this should not be taken lightly.....

As far as using a lawyer. Keep in mind that's a two-way street. What happens if the lawyer does nothing? What if they sit on your forms for months before mailing them? What if they are incompetent? What's your recourse?

Pretty much there is no recourse that will not delay your case for months, if not a year or more. When you sign the G-28, you are basically turning everything over to the lawyer at that point.

I know all about using a lawyer. If someone wants to use a lawyer, that's up to them. Keep a few things in mind:

1. As stated above, once you sign that G-28, all the documentation goes to the lawyer from that point forward. You might get a courtesy I-797C when USCIS approves our petition.

2. What skins do the lawyers have in the game? None. They get paid up front.

3. What's you recourse if your lawyer doesn't work out? Well you can count on major delays, because you signed that G-28. Also, all the lawyers I have seen regarding filing immigration, require ALL the money up front. There is no incentive for them to do a decent job

I could go on and on, but just thinking about what I went through in 2008 makes my blood boil. The lawyer in my case delayed my wife's arrival by 3 months or more. Look around on this website and you'll find my story is not unique.

Glad things worked out for your friend, but trust me there's a damn good reason alot of people here on VJ don't like to use a lawyer. Your friends case is the exception, not the rule

/rant

[mrrobj 20]

Absolutely 100% not true. I know this because it happened to me. Also, NVC approved my I-864 with no issues.

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/180632-denied-in-bangkok/

Karee...I fully see your point!

I am fully aware that you can point to numerous cases on how lawyers did not process applications correctly, but I do not think you can honestly state for certain that hiring a lawyer is the "exception". I do not think we have enough stats from thsi board and other stats to accurately make this statement.

Another case in point......As you can see from the above mentioned responses, some posters have stated for certain federal tax liens are not taken into consideration with the consular at the interview. As you witnessed first hand in your case, it happened to you! The lawyer in this case also agreed with you.

There also could be numerous other posters relying on the same information and have their Visas denied because they listened to same advice.

Therefore, on this issue on alone, let alone others, it makes the case for a lawyer. Obviously, you and others had bad experiences with lawyers, but they are always bad apples in a barrel. I would not cast them all out. I do not think a lot of lawyers will remain in business if they continually screw over clients.

As one poster stated, some case are very simple and straigh forward and lawyer may not be necessary.....but some applicants are not comfortable with the process and may need assistance.

[Karee 4,190]

Karee...I fully see your point!

I am fully aware that you can point to numerous cases on how lawyers did not process applications correctly, but I do not think you can honestly state for certain that hiring a lawyer is the "exception". I do not think we have enough stats from thsi board and other stats to accurately make this statement.

Another case in point......As you can see from the above mentioned responses, some posters have stated for certain federal tax liens are not taken into consideration with the consular at the interview. As you witnessed first hand in your case, it happened to you! The lawyer in this case also agreed with you.

There also could be numerous other posters relying on the same information and have their Visas denied because they listened to same advice.

Therefore, on this issue on alone, let alone others, it makes the case for a lawyer. Obviously, you and others had bad experiences with lawyers, but they are always bad apples in a barrel. I would not cast them all out. I do not think a lot of lawyers will remain in business if they continually screw over clients.

As one poster stated, some case are very simple and straigh forward and lawyer may not be necessary.....but some applicants are not comfortable with the process and may need assistance.

I forgot to add. I had the pleasure of paying $1800 for the lawyer to fill out some forms. I blame myself more than the lawyer for allowing myself to be swindled.

[ppihtr123 68]

Nothing to suggest a Lawyer was needed in this case.

I agree. It sounds like the only thing the lawyer in this case was to say...GO for it. If he had gone for it without a lawyer, he probably would have had the same conclusion given the high income to overcome the lien.

I am all for a good lawyer once things get crazy with some denials, bans, and such.

[Karee 4,190]

I agree. It sounds like the only thing the lawyer in this case was to say...GO for it. If he had gone for it without a lawyer, he probably would have had the same conclusion given the high income to overcome the lien.

I am all for a good lawyer once things get crazy with some denials, bans, and such.

Exactly. I had a lien for around 10k. I barely made over 18.5k for 2007. Embassy said that means you only made 8.5k. They just deducted the amount of the lien from my income. I gave them my 2008 income which was something like 50k and the lien became a non-issue.

Also, I agree with you about getting a lawyer when it comes to waivers,bans, etc. Choose carefully though.

[mrrobj 20]

I think you guys are missing the CRITICAL point in this case. The applicant did not feel comfortable applying for this Visa on his own, nor did he feel his Fiance was able to handle the process alone, therefore, he felt the need to hire a lawyer. He also did not have an issue paying for the lawyer.

Just because you felt it was an easy process to complete, others may not feel the same.