George Zimmerman's Lawyer Wants Jurors To See Photos Of Handgun, Pot Plants Found On Trayvon Martin's Cell Phone

[GandD 5,966]

I don't think I said it is. I said it is a fact that Martin is dead and that Zimmerman killed him. There's no dispute on that. Again, I don't know why you make what's undisputed into some issue.

Because you keep saying he's a victim, which he wouldn't be if it really was a self defense thing. Calling him a victim implies that you know or are biased against the idea that GZ was not trying to save his own life.

And? That would still not change the facts I mentioned above.

It would change him from victim to aggressor which makes this conversation entirely different.

If you pursue an affirmative defense (which is what Zimmerman is doing) then you have opened the door to have your credibility thoroughly examined. That necessarily includes your past transgressions. You cannot pursue an affirmative defense - i.e. say I did it but it was justified - and then claim that your credibility cannot be examined. Doesn't work that way.

You don't think that its a little biased to only look at one person's history? It IS a possibility that TM decided to teach him a lesson for following him. And it IS a possibility that GZ thought he was going to be killed during said lesson regardless of TM's intention.

Yes, I rule that out as a possibility. It would take more mental stretching than I am comfortable to even attempt to actually think that Martin had "planned to kill" Zimmermann for following him. I mean, really? If Martin had planned to kill Zimmerman, I suspect he would have armed himself with something slightly more lethal than a bag of skittles.

That's fine, many people agree with you.

Oh, and how are you doing the multiple quote deal?

Edited May 30, 2013 by GandD

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

The behavior that the killer accused his victim of should be admitted to support the defense of the killer? Are you serious? So the beavior that rapists assign to their rape victims should be relevant and admitted in trial as well without giving the rape victim any opportunity to present their side of the story? You have got to be kidding.

Well see in your eyes it is an open shut murder cause. A lot of evidence says other wise. That is why we have trials. GZ is maintains that TM came out of nowhere as he was walking back to his truck and violently attacked him

What is the truth. I don't know. Honestly don't. I do however think the fact that TM has displayed this kind of behavior before is completely relevant to the case. I also think GZ past behavior is relevant. It's called being fair and giving everyone all the info.

Why are you so scared of facts coming out in the trial, if the case is so open and shut. It TM had a history of violent behavior and was constantly in trouble with authorities, why should that be hidden.

Maybe you like the NBC sanitized version that only showed a 13 year old rosy cheeked TM and a doctored 911 tape.

Get real. Here is the the real truth. If race was not the real issue here and the race baiters had not distorted this case you would have never heard of it and if it had been two black guys, you would not give a shat.

[ready4ONE 5,400]

In court Tuesday, O'Mara mentioned for the first time new pieces of evidence damaging to Trayvon's reputation: that the teenager had shot video of his buddies beating up a homeless man; that Trayvon had served as referee in another fight; and that he had won one fight after punching his opponent in the nose.

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2013-05-28/news/os-george-zimmerman-trial-stay-hearing-20130528_1_trayvon-martin-sybrina-fulton-benjamin-crump

All of which speak volumes about the wisdom of the 911 dispatcher telling George thanks for the tip, stay away and let the police handle it.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

You don't think that its a little biased to only look at one person's history?

No, I don't. It is Zimmermann's choice to pursue an affirmative defense that makes his past relevant as that goes to the very credibility of his chosen defense. Seeing that Martin has not chosen any such path, his past is off the table. His credibility is not at issue at this trial. Why is that biased?

How do I do multiple quotes? Copy and paste.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Well see in your eyes it is an open shut murder cause. A lot of evidence says other wise. That is why we have trials. GZ is maintains that TM came out of nowhere as he was walking back to his truck and violently attacked him.

It matters not what Mr. Zimmermann maintains, it only matters what he can prove. If he can prove what he maintains, then it becomes relevant. Whether Martin smoked weed now and then or skipped classes from time to time does not aid in the process to prove the claim Mr. Zimmermann is making.

What is the truth. I don't know. Honestly don't. I do however think the fact that TM has displayed this kind of behavior before is completely relevant to the case. I also think GZ past behavior is relevant. It's called being fair and giving everyone all the info.

You are free to think whatever you want. But the fact is that Mr. Zimmermann's past is relevant only because he chose to pursue an affirmative defense. Credibility of the defendant is central when the defendent admits to have committed the act for which he is tried but claims that he was justified in committing it. Mr. Zimmermann made his past relevant. It was his choice. It is only fair that the choice whether Mr. Martin's past is relevant is left with Mr. Martin. I am not aware of Mr. Martin having chosen to have his past examined not only at the trial of the man that killed him but also in defense of the man that killed him. I'd wager a guess that Mr. Martin would object to becoming a tool in the defense of the man that took his life.

Why are you so scared of facts coming out in the trial, if the case is so open and shut. It TM had a history of violent behavior and was constantly in trouble with authorities, why should that be hidden.

I'm not scared at all. I have no dog in that race. The facts will come out. Those that are relevant to the matter at hand. Mr. Martin's past is not among those. The judge ruled on that.

[GandD 5,966]

How do I do multiple quotes? Copy and paste.

Yeah, I know that. I just figured it out. In google chrome I get this until I hit enter under the paste. I thought you were actually editing the code like the old format.

How do I do multiple quotes? Copy and paste.

Never mind, it added your name and timestamp after post. This is what I was seeing (attachment)

Edited May 30, 2013 by GandD

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

You really don't think a pattern of exactly the kind of Behavior TM was accused of by GZ is relevant. Seriously ?

Of what? Punching a mate in the nose? If Z wasn't the tough guy he thought he was, he should have stayed in the car. By getting out of the car, Z was looking to confront M. Z could have withdrawn at any time - none of his injuries were life threatening. There is no basis under Florida law for a claim of self-defense.

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

It matters not what Mr. Zimmermann maintains, it only matters what he can prove. If he can prove what he maintains, then it becomes relevant. Whether Martin smoked weed now and then or skipped classes from time to time does not aid in the process to prove the claim Mr. Zimmermann is making.

You are free to think whatever you want. But the fact is that Mr. Zimmermann's past is relevant only because he chose to pursue an affirmative defense. Credibility of the defendant is central when the defendent admits to have committed the act for which he is tried but claims that he was justified in committing it. Mr. Zimmermann made his past relevant. It was his choice. It is only fair that the choice whether Mr. Martin's past is relevant is left with Mr. Martin. I am not aware of Mr. Martin having chosen to have his past examined not only at the trial of the man that killed him but also in defense of the man that killed him. I'd wager a guess that Mr. Martin would object to becoming a tool in the defense of the man that took his life.

I'm not scared at all. I have no dog in that race. The facts will come out. Those that are relevant to the matter at hand. Mr. Martin's past is not among those. The judge ruled on that.

So GZ claims that when 911 told him not to follow, he headed back to his truck. He said TM came up, uttered a bunch of vulgarities and attacked him. I have no clue if that is true or not.

I do however think that the fact that TM had been suspended for swinging at a bus driver, and had videos of he and his friends attacking homeless men is totally relevant. It is just as relevant as a person being accused of rape,having a hard drive full of rape porno.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

all allegations are hyped beyond reason. so..whatever you say bro. hope you don't have any kids.

I have four sons. One is still a teenager (barely) And what?

GZ will walk out a free man. It is not a question if TM so much "deserved to die" as it is a question of "did GZ have reasonable grounds to believe he was in danger of severe injury while his head was bashed on the sidewalk?"

If that is the case, then GZ can use deadly force and such carries a risk of death, which risk in this case did not go in TM's favor.

Moral of the story...do NOT bash people's heads on the sidewalk

[lostinblue 1,989]

Travon could have just walked home (a hundred yards or so?)and he would be alive today. . He is the one who attacked George. George was walking back to his truck and did not know where Travon was at all times.

[lostinblue 1,989]

So GZ claims that when 911 told him not to follow, he headed back to his truck. He said TM came up, uttered a bunch of vulgarities and attacked him. I have no clue if that is true or not.

I do however think that the fact that TM had been suspended for swinging at a bus driver, and had videos of he and his friends attacking homeless men is totally relevant. It is just as relevant as a person being accused of rape,having a hard drive full of rape porno.

I understand Travon had a photo of a naked minor on that cell phone. This was brought out at the discovery yesterday. Judge for now will not allow it to be introduced.

[Karee 4,191]

I have four sons. One is still a teenager (barely) And what?

GZ will walk out a free man. It is not a question if TM so much "deserved to die" as it is a question of "did GZ have reasonable grounds to believe he was in danger of severe injury while his head was bashed on the sidewalk?"

If that is the case, then GZ can use deadly force and such carries a risk of death, which risk in this case did not go in TM's favor.

Moral of the story...do NOT bash people's heads on the sidewalk

Makes sense to me.

[lostinblue 1,989]

Of what? Punching a mate in the nose? If Z wasn't the tough guy he thought he was, he should have stayed in the car. By getting out of the car, Z was looking to confront M. Z could have withdrawn at any time - none of his injuries were life threatening. There is no basis under Florida law for a claim of self-defense.

You just have to be in fear of your life....This has been established in many cases. Clear cut self- defense . Travon was on top,had grass stains on his knees and people who can back this up. Perhaps you could post a different story that we have not seen.

[decocker 7,198]

I have four sons. One is still a teenager (barely) And what?

GZ will walk out a free man. It is not a question if TM so much "deserved to die" as it is a question of "did GZ have reasonable grounds to believe he was in danger of severe injury while his head was bashed on the sidewalk?"

If that is the case, then GZ can use deadly force and such carries a risk of death, which risk in this case did not go in TM's favor.

Moral of the story...do NOT bash people's heads on the sidewalk

yes gary, i know about your sons. i've been here awhile. and i don't live in vermont so the kids i know and care about don't dazzle with perfection like yours.

moral of the story is still don't be a black kid under the wreckless kind of neighborhood watch.

[Ban Hammer 13,584]

yes gary, i know about your sons. i've been here awhile. and i don't live in vermont so the kids i know and care about don't dazzle with perfection like yours.

moral of the story is still don't be a black kid under the wreckless kind of neighborhood watch.