Our story: CRBA for our child denied, entering the US with a baby transportation letter and Citizenship through the CCA

[BCN_CAL 0]

On 8/9/2017 at 10:47 PM, Mark88 said:

It has changed, and just one parent (doesn't matter if father or mother who is a LPR) can apply for a BTL.

 

 

If you (the green card holder) travelled to the US without the child, I am sorry to say, that was it. The rules say it must be on the first trip back to US and you must accomodate the child.

You will have to take the regular greencard route. You might be able to expedite the process for the green card, but expect it to be 6-12 months since Spain does not offer DCF.

Dear Mark88,

 

Thank you so much for your reply. 

 

It almost passed one year and I am still in Spain. As I checked the law in the USCIS website, it also mentions about US NATIONAL:

 

"(b) Waivers. (1) A waiver of the visa required in paragraph (a) of this section shall be granted without fee or application by the district director, upon presentation of the child's birth certificate, to a child born subsequent to the issuance of an immigrant visa to his or her accompanying parent who applies for admission during the validity of such a visa; or a child born during the temporary visit abroad of a mother who is a lawful permanent resident alien, or a national, of the United States, provided that the child's application for admission to the United States is made within 2 years of birth, the child is accompanied by the parent who is applying for readmission as a permanent resident upon the first return of the parent to the United States after the birth of the child, and the accompanying parent is found to be admissible to the United States." (https://www.uscis.gov/ilink/docView/SLB/HTML/SLB/0-0-0-1/0-0-0-11261/0-0-0-15844/0-0-0-15852.html)

 

In this case can we consider my Wife as the "US national"? In this case we won't have any problem to bring my Baby to the US with transportation letter. 

 

Thank you for your reply in advance.

 

Best,

 

Meysam

 

 

[Mark88 184]

I don't really understand it. The USC or USN would be able to get the BTL under your LPR, but still it wouldn't be valid, since you already travelled to the US.

Otherwise the IR process wouldn't be necessary if every USC could have a BTL issued for their child. You will have to contact the embassy and ask them on this mater yourself.

[BCN_CAL 0]

1 hour ago, Mark88 said:

I don't really understand it. The USC or USN would be able to get the BTL under your LPR, but still it wouldn't be valid, since you already travelled to the US.

Otherwise the IR process wouldn't be necessary if every USC could have a BTL issued for their child. You will have to contact the embassy and ask them on this mater yourself.

Thank you for your reply. The issue is that my wife is the US citizen and she has not traveled to the US after the birth of the baby. My question was that if we can get BTL though her, because as you said I ( as green card holder and LPR) have already traveled to the US.

 

Thank you,

 

BCN_CAL 

[Mark88 184]

As to my understanding, you have two options: You can either get a BTL as a LPR or file for an IR-2 visa as a USC.

 

It wouldn't make much sense to me, that if a child of a USC doesn't qualify for a CRBA, that a USC can simply apply for a BTL (this would have changed the case of my story a lot). Just think of the scenario: You can get the BTL, disqualify of it through your trip to th US, but your wife, a USC can now derive your visa to your child for entering the US? A BTL is basicly derived from a LPR, since a USC can't have a visa.

 

The law also states what you quoted above: ....the child is accompanied by the parent who is applying for readmission as a permanent resident upon the first return of the parent to the United States after the birth of the child.....

 

It doesn't bring up the USN again, only if you're applying as the LPR.

 

But as I stated above, if you think the law is in your favour, you will have no other option than sorting out things with the consulate section of the embassy.

[BCN_CAL 0]

On 4/14/2018 at 9:30 PM, Mark88 said:

As to my understanding, you have two options: You can either get a BTL as a LPR or file for an IR-2 visa as a USC.

 

It wouldn't make much sense to me, that if a child of a USC doesn't qualify for a CRBA, that a USC can simply apply for a BTL (this would have changed the case of my story a lot). Just think of the scenario: You can get the BTL, disqualify of it through your trip to th US, but your wife, a USC can now derive your visa to your child for entering the US? A BTL is basicly derived from a LPR, since a USC can't have a visa.

 

The law also states what you quoted above: ....the child is accompanied by the parent who is applying for readmission as a permanent resident upon the first return of the parent to the United States after the birth of the child.....

 

It doesn't bring up the USN again, only if you're applying as the LPR.

 

But as I stated above, if you think the law is in your favour, you will have no other option than sorting out things with the consulate section of the embassy.

Dear Mark, 

 

Thank you again for your answer.

 

For updating the case...

 

Last week we went to the US embassy in Madrid. First we got an appointment for Reporting of Baby Birth. They again told to us that she can not get CRBA for our baby. Then we showed them a print of law from USCIS website and asked them for BTL. At the beginning they did not know that what is BTL. Then they told us that we have to send an email the Immigration Visa (IV) segment. We emailed IV segment a scan of baby birth certificate, my wife US passport, and a PDF file of the VISA Waiver law about transportation letter.  

 

We received a reply from them that: 

 

"You have to print the letter attached and travel with it, and with your baby´s original birth certificate and passport.

 

and the content of the letter is as the following:

 

"To whom it may concern:                                                    

 

This is to inform that under the Immigration and Naturalization Law (8 CFR 211.1 (b)(1)) “…a child born during the temporary visit abroad of a mother who is a lawful permanent resident alien, or a national, of the United States, provided that the child's application for admission to the United States is made within 2 years of birth, the child is accompanied by the parent who is applying for readmission as a permanent resident upon the first return of the parent to the United States after the birth of the child, and the accompanying parent is found to be admissible to the United States.”

 

The minor should carry a valid travel document and an original birth certificate with English translation."

 

We replied to them and asked them about a letter with Baby Name, signature and stamp or NA3 visa. We also attached a sample of the NA3 visa to the email. but they replied to us that: 

 

"Dear XXX:

 

We only provide this letter, we do not process transportation letters for this cases, and the letter you are taking is only to clarify your son´s situation.

 

When you arrive at the port of entry you will present the baby´s passport, birth certificate and letter to indicate your baby has the right to get lawful permanent resident status once you contact the Immigration Services, as it is specified in the Immigration Law.

 

Regards.

 

IV Unit Madrid."

 

Can I trust this people in the embassy IV segment. With a letter without any signature and stamp do they allow us to take a plane? Moreover, if we fly to the US is it possible they do not allow my baby to enter to the US at the POE? What do you think? Can I trust what they say and buy our tickets to Boston.

 

Thank you!

 

BCN_CAL

 

 

 

 

 

[Mark88 184]

30 minutes ago, BCN_CAL said:

Can I trust this people in the embassy IV segment.

I am sure they gave you the best information that is possible. And they were right, concerning that they can not process the NA3. In theory it is not the consulate that does it, it is Customs and Border Protection. My case was handled by the Frankfurt, Germany general consulate which has a Customs and Border Protection section which issued the NA3. You can find the info here: https://imgur.com/srhWSt5

 

So the trust in your case basicly comes down to, if the IV unit at Madrid embassy (and the guy/girl who answered your email) is even aware of this scenario. Sadly as you can see to the many replies in this post, many have been stuck with consular officers that have no idea a NA3 exists. Or just shrugg it as something off that might be country specific.

 

If I were you, I would contact CBP at Frankfurt and see what they say, since they have jurisdiction over Madrid (and all of Europe).

 

30 minutes ago, BCN_CAL said:

With a letter without any signature and stamp do they allow us to take a plane?

I assume your child has Spanish citizenship and a valid passport. Due to this all your baby needs is an approved ESTA.

Were you from a country that is not part of the VWP you are correct, and your child would definately need the NA3 to board the plane (the airline would otherwise deny boarding).

 

30 minutes ago, BCN_CAL said:

Moreover, if we fly to the US is it possible they do not allow my baby to enter to the US at the POE? What do you think? Can I trust what they say and buy our tickets to Boston.

I think since your child is a baby there is almost virtually no chance of the child being denied entry to the US. You will have a valid ESTA and the child will get legal entry for up to 90 days. HOWEVER this will not solve your problem: Your child did not enter on an IV/NA3 visa and does not qualify for the CCA and will not receive USC through your wife.

 

Here is what I would do (better more did):

Contact Frankfurts CBP cbp.frankfurt@dhs.gov and ask if they can issue the NA3 for your child. If they say yes, further clarify if they will do it for you even if your residence is in Spain. Three things might happen:

a) You might get lucky and they'll contact Madrid IV for you and give them exact instructions how to issue the NA3 visa (best case scenario, least time and cost).

b) They will say yes, and you can make an appointment for Frankfurt to get the NA3 in Germany. You will have to chip in the flights and maybe even a night in a hotel, but this will still be much better than having an hours long discussion with CBP in Boston after a transatlantic flight with a baby, stressed parents and at the end maybe not getting the I-181.

c) They will say they can't help you since they don't do it (anymore) or you do not live in their (immidiate) jurisdiction.

 

This is all above is only my personal opinion. I have no idea if it might be just as easy as the Madrid consular section noted. It will set you back a day or two and the travel costs to Frankfurt. But this is what I think and I have personally done, since the risk of having trouble at the border, not receive a I-181, and not derivative citizenship were too great of a risk for me and my family. If you contacted Frankfurt and they can gurantee you the issuance of a NA3 in your childs passport, the extra time , costs and effort would be totally worth it considering what would happen if there are border problems (and no I-181 issued). Again, only my personal opinion.

If Frankfurt can't help you, you might have no other choice than Madrid consular sections advice on how to do it.

 

Please keep us updated about your case. I am sure it will help many what the outcome will be, if they are stuck in your situation.

 

[BCN_CAL 0]

9 hours ago, Mark88 said:

I am sure they gave you the best information that is possible. And they were right, concerning that they can not process the NA3. In theory it is not the consulate that does it, it is Customs and Border Protection. My case was handled by the Frankfurt, Germany general consulate which has a Customs and Border Protection section which issued the NA3. You can find the info here: https://imgur.com/srhWSt5

 

So the trust in your case basicly comes down to, if the IV unit at Madrid embassy (and the guy/girl who answered your email) is even aware of this scenario. Sadly as you can see to the many replies in this post, many have been stuck with consular officers that have no idea a NA3 exists. Or just shrugg it as something off that might be country specific.

 

If I were you, I would contact CBP at Frankfurt and see what they say, since they have jurisdiction over Madrid (and all of Europe).

 

I assume your child has Spanish citizenship and a valid passport. Due to this all your baby needs is an approved ESTA.

Were you from a country that is not part of the VWP you are correct, and your child would definately need the NA3 to board the plane (the airline would otherwise deny boarding).

 

I think since your child is a baby there is almost virtually no chance of the child being denied entry to the US. You will have a valid ESTA and the child will get legal entry for up to 90 days. HOWEVER this will not solve your problem: Your child did not enter on an IV/NA3 visa and does not qualify for the CCA and will not receive USC through your wife.

 

Here is what I would do (better more did):

Contact Frankfurts CBP cbp.frankfurt@dhs.gov and ask if they can issue the NA3 for your child. If they say yes, further clarify if they will do it for you even if your residence is in Spain. Three things might happen:

a) You might get lucky and they'll contact Madrid IV for you and give them exact instructions how to issue the NA3 visa (best case scenario, least time and cost).

b) They will say yes, and you can make an appointment for Frankfurt to get the NA3 in Germany. You will have to chip in the flights and maybe even a night in a hotel, but this will still be much better than having an hours long discussion with CBP in Boston after a transatlantic flight with a baby, stressed parents and at the end maybe not getting the I-181.

c) They will say they can't help you since they don't do it (anymore) or you do not live in their (immidiate) jurisdiction.

 

This is all above is only my personal opinion. I have no idea if it might be just as easy as the Madrid consular section noted. It will set you back a day or two and the travel costs to Frankfurt. But this is what I think and I have personally done, since the risk of having trouble at the border, not receive a I-181, and not derivative citizenship were too great of a risk for me and my family. If you contacted Frankfurt and they can gurantee you the issuance of a NA3 in your childs passport, the extra time , costs and effort would be totally worth it considering what would happen if there are border problems (and no I-181 issued). Again, only my personal opinion.

If Frankfurt can't help you, you might have no other choice than Madrid consular sections advice on how to do it.

 

Please keep us updated about your case. I am sure it will help many what the outcome will be, if they are stuck in your situation.

 

Many Thanks Mark for your reply.

 

Tomorrow I am going to the airport in Madrid to ask from the Iberia Airline's station manager about this procedure. Airlines must know if we can fly with this letter and documents.

 

The other issue is that my baby does not have Spanish passport yet and it is in process. She will have it next year. At the moment she has a passport from one of the countries in the "Black List"!!! This is my concern as well

 

I am not 100% sure if the people in the IV section of the embassy studied our case carefully. I am worry if at the POE they don not allow my baby to enter to the US. I do not want to have any problem in the airport or POE. Can I trust these people said in the IV segment? If they send us this letter does it mean that we won't have any problem at the POE?

 

Kind regards,

 

BCN_CAL

[Mark88 184]

46 minutes ago, BCN_CAL said:

Many Thanks Mark for your reply.

You're welcome

 

46 minutes ago, BCN_CAL said:

Tomorrow I am going to the airport in Madrid to ask from the Iberia Airline's station manager about this procedure. Airlines must know if we can fly with this letter and documents.

It won't help you much. Even if he gives you the go, who knows what will happen the day you fly: New regulations, different chekin agent, no supervisor on duty who has knowledge about your case... If it eases your mind, go ahead, but I wouldn't count on it being a sure thing if he gives you the go ahead. And it won't solve your problem at the border if there is an issue with CBP.

 

46 minutes ago, BCN_CAL said:

The other issue is that my baby does not have Spanish passport yet and it is in process. She will have it next year. At the moment she has a passport from one of the countries in the "Black List"!!! This is my concern as well

If she doesn't have VWP qualifying passport, she needs some form of VISA to enter the US anyway. GET THE NA3 somehow.

 

46 minutes ago, BCN_CAL said:

I am not 100% sure if the people in the IV section of the embassy studied our case carefully. I am worry if at the POE they don not allow my baby to enter to the US. I do not want to have any problem in the airport or POE.

Personally I think they didn't. If you told them she has a non VWP qualifying passport and they said he can just board a plane with a printed non official letter - well - I would definately not trust on it.

 

46 minutes ago, BCN_CAL said:

Can I trust these people said in the IV segment? If they send us this letter does it mean that we won't have any problem at the POE?

Again, and this is just my personal opinion*, is I would not. I would not put my trust in to a letter that has no data of you or your child, stamp from the embassy etc.

What happens if you get to the US and they'll admit the child, but won't issue a I-181? You made it that far, but you have no one competent at CBP that day who knows about the procedure. The risk for me pesonally would just be too high. Try going to BOS the next day and finding someone from CBP who can sort it out afterwards... Good luck....

 

*My personal opinion means: This is how I would do it for my own child based on experience with USCIS, CBP etc. and of what we went through. I don't want to send you on a journey though that might have been easier and less costs than originally thought (or recommded by the embassy). But again, the risk would be just to high for me with something going wrong with my childs citizenship. And if you don't get it right here, try doing this in the aftermath will take forever and be much more a hassle than a travel to Frankfurt.

[BCN_CAL 0]

Thank you again Mark for your reply.

 

Just an update about our case.

 

Yesterday  I went to the airport and talked with the station manager. 

It was her first time to see a case like this. She told me that for the US flights they have a special phone number for legal advisement of the visa of the passengers. After 30 minutes talking with different people and also with this visa advisor of the US she told me that I must have a certified english translation of my baby birth certificate, passport of baby and mother, and the letter of the embassy.  Then I won't have any problem to fly there.

 

However, to be in the safe side and to avoid any hassle in the airport, I also sent an email to the US consulate in Frankfurt about Baby Transportation Letter. Let's see what they respond?! If they tell me that I have to come to Frankfurt to take the letter, I will certainly do it.

 

Best,

 

 BCN_CAL

Edited May 21, 2018 by BCN_CAL

[Mark88 184]

On 21.5.2018 at 5:34 PM, BCN_CAL said:

However, to be in the safe side and to avoid any hassle in the airport, I also sent an email to the US consulate in Frankfurt about Baby Transportation Letter. Let's see what they respond?! If they tell me that I have to come to Frankfurt to take the letter, I will certainly do it.

 

Like I mentioned, the risk for me would be too high if something goes wrong. See what Frankfurt says and let us know. Thanks!

[BCN_CAL 0]

On 5/26/2018 at 1:51 PM, Mark88 said:

 

Like I mentioned, the risk for me would be too high if something goes wrong. See what Frankfurt says and let us know. Thanks!

 

On 5/26/2018 at 1:51 PM, Mark88 said:

 

Like I mentioned, the risk for me would be too high if something goes wrong. See what Frankfurt says and let us know. Thanks!

Thank you Mark88,

 

I sent an email to Frankfort and Custom and Border Protection (CBP) email address in the US. But they did not answer after almost 10 days!?

[Mark88 184]

1 hour ago, BCN_CAL said:

 

Thank you Mark88,

 

I sent an email to Frankfort and Custom and Border Protection (CBP) email address in the US. But they did not answer after almost 10 days!?

 

Last time I had an issue it was within a couple days. You can always try to print out the email and send it by postal mail. Old fashioned, but I had to do it once, since the spam filters of the consulate didn't let it go through for some reason.

[Mark88 184]

On 6/2/2018 at 11:15 PM, BCN_CAL said:

 

Thank you Mark88,

 

I sent an email to Frankfort and Custom and Border Protection (CBP) email address in the US. But they did not answer after almost 10 days!?

 

What happened, did you hever finish the process? Please update, it might help others. Thanks!

[Stateless 0]

Hello Mark, not sure if you are still around. 

I am also unable to prove 5 years physical presence even though I was born a US citizen (got my CRBA) and lived in the US for about 15 years. My records are spotty since I moved around a lot and did not attend school regularly. But I did graduate from college. Unfortunately, I completed my degree quickly so I'm still short on docs. I submitted other docs such as car loan, car insurance, driving record (with issue date and citation), ATM withdrawals, point of sale purchases. It should be obvious to anybody that I lived in the US for far longer than 5 years but they're giving me a hard time. They're also unhelpful and quite rude(for example, they don't reply to emails, don't tell me how much more time I need to prove). 

Unfortunately, the mother of the baby will not be travelling to the US with me. We are not married and not in any a relationship. She is not a USC nor a resident. She's never been to the US. I think this means the baby would not qualify for any kind of visa/BTL to travel to the US despite of the mother's consent. Is this correct? 

What about hiring an investigator to locate additional documents (for example, rental contracts, gym memberships)? 

 

Any advice?

Edited December 13, 2019 by Stateless

[Mark88 184]

Judging from your statement, it seems the consular officer already made up his mind, and it will be hard to convince them otherwise. IMHO, spending more money and wasting time to convince them, is not worth it (only exception is if you get fairly easy your evidence together that is solid without too much hassle).

 

Since you yourself have a CRBA, you might want to consider the grandparent option with the N-600K form. All requirements have been fulfilled with your CRBA (proving the grandparents physical presence in the US prior to your childs birth).