US vs UK Healthcare

[Rebecca Jo 1,962]

Sounds to me then the solution of having the best of both worlds then would be to have a universal health care system but allow for private practices for those who want speedy care.

There are private practices in the UK and there is private insurance available.

[Rebecca Jo 1,962]

Fletcher-Allen appears to be "huge" as it is the result of mergers of several hospitasl.

It is also a teaching hospital affiliated with the University of Vermont. Teaching hospitals in most states are very large (including my home state).

It does have a webpage dedicated to Canadian patients offering them a thirty percent discount for cash payment.

I would idly note that our local hospitals here offer a 25 percent discount for ANYONE paying cash.

[Boiler 45,765]

So apart from the likes of Michael Owen, does anybody know of UK Citizens coming to the US for medical treatment?

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Fletcher-Allen appears to be "huge" as it is the result of mergers of several hospitasl.

It is also a teaching hospital affiliated with the University of Vermont. Teaching hospitals in most states are very large (including my home state).

It does have a webpage dedicated to Canadian patients offering them a thirty percent discount for cash payment.

I would idly note that our local hospitals here offer a 25 percent discount for ANYONE paying cash.

Is that 25% (or 30%) off the rack rate? If so, that's a very foul deal. I've just spent two days in the hospital last month and the rack rate bills between the hospital, labs and various doctors came out to roughly $80K. Once the negotiated rates from my insurance we applied, I was looking at $13K for the hospital (down from $65K) and $3K for the various doctors and labs (down from $15K). Aside from the fact that the insurance obviously covers a major percentage of these amounts, a mere 25% or 30% discount off the rack rates would still have left me with $60K or $56K, respectively. No good.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

So apart from the likes of Michael Owen, does anybody know of UK Citizens coming to the US for medical treatment?

Same as some European celebreties come to the US for some specialized care, celebrity Americans are known to have travelled to Europe for cutting edge medical treatment. Kobe Bryant, went to Germany to undergo a cutting edge procedure on his knee, for example. Less famous Americans travel to Germany by the thousands to take advantage of some of the world's most advanced cancer treatments that are available there.

This whole attitude that America has the best medical care is ridiculous. It has the most expensive care. Cost is about the only part where America is No. 1 in the world in medical care.

[JohnR! 5,495]

Same as some European celebreties come to the US for some specialized care, celebrity Americans are known to have travelled to Europe for cutting edge medical treatment. Kobe Bryant, went to Germany to undergo a cutting edge procedure on his knee, for example. Less famous Americans travel to Germany by the thousands to take advantage of some of the world's most advanced cancer treatments that are available there.

This whole attitude that America has the best medical care is ridiculous. It has the most expensive care. Cost is about the only part where America is No. 1 in the world in medical care.

America has the best medical care in the world, for those who can afford it. It is a fallacy to ignore the fact that the quality of the care one receives is proportional to one's ability to pay.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

America has the best medical care in the world, for those who can afford it. It is a fallacy to ignore the fact that the quality of the care one receives is proportional to one's ability to pay.

Then why did Kobe Bryant head to Duesseldorf for his knee procedure. Surely, he can afford to pay for US medical care. Except, the specific treatment that he went to Duesseldorf for isn't available in the US. Which is why he went to Germany. Same for some of the cutting edge cancer treatments that I linked to in my post.

There is some very advanced and cutting edge medical care available in the US - for those that can afford it - but there is also quite a bit of very advanced and cutting edge medical care available in other parts of the world that you won't find here no matter your ability to pay.

The gigantic cost of our healthcare system has bought us really nothing at all.

[Boiler 45,765]

America has the best medical care in the world, for those who can afford it. It is a fallacy to ignore the fact that the quality of the care one receives is proportional to one's ability to pay.

Nope.

Look it up - 38th, one below Costa Rica.

And that is a scientific study.

[Póg mo 1,749]

So apart from the likes of Michael Owen, does anybody know of UK Citizens coming to the US for medical treatment?

Yeah, I don't see too many ordinary people wanting to come half way round the world to be treated by American hospitals, considering how difficult it is in America to have any idea up front how much any particular treatment will cost. Far easier to simply take advantage of EU membership and fly to a member state where there is no waiting times for the procedure they require at a fraction of the cost of medical care in USA.

[Rebecca Jo 1,962]

Is that 25% (or 30%) off the rack rate? If so, that's a very foul deal. I've just spent two days in the hospital last month and the rack rate bills between the hospital, labs and various doctors came out to roughly $80K. Once the negotiated rates from my insurance we applied, I was looking at $13K for the hospital (down from $65K) and $3K for the various doctors and labs (down from $15K). Aside from the fact that the insurance obviously covers a major percentage of these amounts, a mere 25% or 30% discount off the rack rates would still have left me with $60K or $56K, respectively. No good.

I don't know if the discount if based upon the standard rate or not.

You can Google the webpage if you like. All I did was enter "Fletcher Allen Health Care Canadians" and it was the first link.

But you are right in your assertions, nonetheless.

Also I should add that I misspoke earlier about the discount offered by our local hospitals. I don't really know what our local hospitals do for a cash discount. What I should have said is that our local hospitals offer a 25 percent discount off the negotiated insurance rate IF you pay prior to your procedure. So for example, if you know you are having your appendix removed, the finance office will figure your costs based upon their negotiated rates with your insurance company. And if you pay your costs before you have the appendix removed, they offer a 25 percent discount.

[Boiler 45,765]

I appreciate that the topic was UK Citizens coming to the US for medical treatment, I think we have done that one to death as in most cases nobody seems to know why they would.

So OT how does it work with Canadians, presumably it is not life threatening usually so the Hospital does not have to treat them, and I find it difficult to believe they just hand over a high limit CC and tell the Hospital to charge whatever they like?

Edited June 3, 2013 by Boiler

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Also I should add that I misspoke earlier about the discount offered by our local hospitals. I don't really know what our local hospitals do for a cash discount. What I should have said is that our local hospitals offer a 25 percent discount off the negotiated insurance rate IF you pay prior to your procedure. So for example, if you know you are having your appendix removed, the finance office will figure your costs based upon their negotiated rates with your insurance company. And if you pay your costs before you have the appendix removed, they offer a 25 percent discount.

That would actually be a good deal since that 25% could, at least in theory, more than cover your co-pay. Not sure that you can pull that off, though - i.e. claim the insurance for the negotiated rate but only pay that less 25% to the hospital. Even in a 80/20 split scenario, you'd actually make money that way. My guess is that the insurance company would pay their share only on what you actually ended up paying the hospital - or pay their share of the negotiated rate up to the amount that you actually paid.

[Boiler 45,765]

So how do you know what the Insurance rates are, presumably each insurer negotiates separately anyway.

[Rebecca Jo 1,962]

So how do you know what the Insurance rates are, presumably each insurer negotiates separately anyway.

Well - I was told that the hospital knows what the insurer will pay for X procedure.

Then, depending on your plan, they know how much of that cost you will be responsible for.

The hospital then discounts your portion.

Appendix removal costs 10K. Your insurer will pay 8K. Your portion should be 2K. Hospital will discount the 2K by 25 percent.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Well - I was told that the hospital knows what the insurer will pay for X procedure.

Then, depending on your plan, they know how much of that cost you will be responsible for.

The hospital then discounts your portion.

Appendix removal costs 10K. Your insurer will pay 8K. Your portion should be 2K. Hospital will discount the 2K by 25 percent.

Not bad. I wasn't offered any such discount, though. Must be select hospitals only.