State pushes to keep Trayvon Martin's past out of George Zimmerman trial

[SMR 368]

It's not revelant because the question everyone loves to avoid is, what was he doing that night? And why is everyone so quick to point out that Trayvon is the aggressor, when George has had two domestic violence issues and resisting arrest plus shoving a police officer?

Obviously, the most important question is what happened that night. That doesn't make everything else irrelevant. That's like saying motive, means, and opportunity are irrelevant to a criminal investigation because all that really matters is what actually happened. Unless the forensic evidence is overwhelming and has no other possible explanation, other factors beyond forensic evidence should be considered relevant.

As far as Zimmerman's history, of course it's relevant. I never said that Martin was the aggressor. I wasn't there and don't know what happened. I only said that history is relevant. So do you think that history is relevant?

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Perhaps it will show that he was a die hard stoner who often supported his habit in the middle of the night.... Would not doubt he bragged on twitter about his scores.

That would be a slam dunk for GZ's defense because everyone knows how violent and aggressive stoners can be when they are denied access to Doritos.

[We Keep Receipts 9,238]

Obviously, the most important question is what happened that night. That doesn't make everything else irrelevant. That's like saying motive, means, and opportunity are irrelevant to a criminal investigation because all that really matters is what actually happened. Unless the forensic evidence is overwhelming and has no other possible explanation, other factors beyond forensic evidence should be considered relevant.

As far as Zimmerman's history, of course it's relevant. I never said that Martin was the aggressor. I wasn't there and don't know what happened. I only said that history is relevant. So do you think that history is relevant?

Depends on who is telling the story. I know that certain factors will always come into play. My point is that this kid was walking home minding his own business, this has been proven time and time again.The mere fact that this man got out of his car to run after him should tell you something. If he was committing a crime or doing something unsavory, I could see this being self defense, but I know too well that being black, the rules change. There are way too many young black youths that are profiled and killed.

[Karee 4,191]

Depends on who is telling the story. I know that certain factors will always come into play. My point is that this kid was walking home minding his own business, this has been proven time and time again.The mere fact that this man got out of his car to run after him should tell you something. If he was committing a crime or doing something unsavory, I could see this being self defense, but I know too well that being black, the rules change. There are way too many young black youths that are profiled and killed.

Nothing has been proven until there is a trial.

[decocker 7,198]

Perhaps it will show that he was a die hard stoner who often supported his habit in the middle of the night.... Would not doubt he bragged on twitter about his scores.

he had marijuana in his system, not crack. good lord.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

GZ will be found guilty of manslaughter. Anyone who's read about both parties and the circumstances surrounding the death of Treyvon knows this. You have to blindsided or delusional to believe otherwise.

[Karee 4,191]

he had marijuana in his system, not crack. good lord.

Good point. There is a difference. Just because both are illegal, does not make them the same.

[SMR 368]

Depends on who is telling the story. I know that certain factors will always come into play. My point is that this kid was walking home minding his own business, this has been proven time and time again.The mere fact that this man got out of his car to run after him should tell you something. If he was committing a crime or doing something unsavory, I could see this being self defense, but I know too well that being black, the rules change. There are way too many young black youths that are profiled and killed.

So the fact that black youths are often profiled and killed means that we should make sure not to look into the specific history of this particular black youth? Wouldn't a desire to avoid profiling mean that we should look into specifics of this case in order to make sure we know who Trayvon Martin was, beyond being a young black kid? What if he was an honor student with a spotless record and no one could say anything bad about him or his behavior? Wouldn't that be relevant if we wanted to know the likelihood of Zimmerman's story that Martin knocked him down, jumped on top, and started beating him?

Obviously this is a complex issue with lots of tangents we can go down, particularly with the wide array of information and misinformation available on this particular case as well as the large number of unknowns. The question put forward in this thread is simply whether or not Martin's recent history, including potential violence and drug use, is relevant to determining what happened. I'm not saying we should assume Martin was a thug stoner because he was black. Quite the opposite. I'm saying let's see if there is evidence that this particular person had a history of drug use and violence. And if it turns out that no one can say anything bad about Martin's past, I think that's relevant, too.

[SMR 368]

GZ will be found guilty of manslaughter. Anyone who's read about both parties and the circumstances surrounding the death of Treyvon knows this. You have to blindsided or delusional to believe otherwise.

I thought the same thing, too, when I first read the story. Murder two always seemed like a real stretch, but manslaughter seems likely.

Since he's been charged with murder and not manslaughter, my question is how that goes down in court? Can the jury just come back with a verdict of guilty to a lesser charge? Does the judge have to make the decision to change the charge? If the jury finds him not guilty of murder 2, he can't be retried for manslaughter, can he?

[decocker 7,198]

Obviously this is a complex issue with lots of tangents we can go down, particularly with the wide array of information and misinformation available on this particular case as well as the large number of unknowns. The question put forward in this thread is simply whether or not Martin's recent history, including potential violence and drug use, is relevant to determining what happened. I'm not saying we should assume Martin was a thug stoner because he was black. Quite the opposite. I'm saying let's see if there is evidence that this particular person had a history of drug use and violence. And if it turns out that no one can say anything bad about Martin's past, I think that's relevant, too.

history of smoking pot and a couple school suspensions would hardly be mentioned if this was a dead white kid.

imo, if trayvon had a large amount of marijuana in his system that night, i'd say that helps his credibility. you don't go around jumping people, alone, at night, when you're stoned.

[SMR 368]

history of smoking pot and a couple school suspensions would hardly be mentioned if this was a dead white kid.

imo, if trayvon had a large amount of marijuana in his system that night, i'd say that helps his credibility. you don't go around jumping people, alone, at night, when you're stoned.

So you think that his toxicology report is relevant?

[Darnell 8,479]

now wait a mo,

if TM's past shows a pattern of fighting and general thug-a-ry,

the defense would want to show that,

to lay a trail of this repeated behavior

and [hopefully to the defense team]

show a pattern of 'quick to violence' prior behavior to the jury.

But that's just my opinion. I'm not an attorney, nor do I play one on TV.

[decocker 7,198]

So you think that his toxicology report is relevant?

no.

but if it's going to be used, if would be nice if people understood the effects of marijuana - instead of acting like trayvon was going all pookie in new jack city on zimmerman..

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Kinda apples and oranges don't you think? What if a woman had a history of making false rape claims? Would that be relevant?

That would be as relevant as TMs history of faking to be shot to death by some paranoid yahoo.

[Karee 4,191]

That would be as relevant as TMs history of faking to be shot to death by some paranoid yahoo.

He brought rape into the conversation. I was addressing that.