If Divorced, I-864 Can or Can't be withdrawn

[SOL.Broken 0]

Does anyone know if this is true, I have been reading some other posts, and have found some disturbing court rulings, that in fact the alien spouse, can take me to the federal court and claim 125% for remainder of her time left for the citizenship, below is a link to few of these cases I have found…

Here are links showing some of these rulings, this is scary.

http://www.ilw.com/articles/2006,0110-wheeler.shtm

http://www.ilw.com/articles/2006,0608-mehta.shtm

She entered as a CR 1 on Jan 28, 2006, were married on Dec 2, 2004, and were living separately until her entry. We have separated since Oct 31, and have filled for divorce.

So does anyone know if I can withdraw my affidavit of support? Or if I withdraw my name from the affidavit of support on file with USCIS?

letter to the USCIS where her case is filed asking to remove your name for AOS?

I have set up the Infopass meeting and want to do this right, and not miss anything, it is difficult enough with everything else going on, I don’t want to screw this up and assure to cover myself and protect myself with immigration as much as I can.

Thanks again for your thoughts…

[YuAndDan 153]

Yes,

The Court in Cheshire v. Cheshire analyzed, after reviewing Section 213A, that the sponsor’s obligation to support the sponsored immigrant under the Affidavit of Support only terminated upon the occurrence of one of the five circumstances:

1) the sponsor’s death,

2) the sponsored immigrant’s death,

3) the sponsored immigrant becoming a US citizen,

4) the sponsored immigrant permanently departing the US, or

5) the sponsored immigrant being credited with a total of 40 qualifying quarters of work.

Number 5 is the most damning, 40 qualifying quarters of work means the immigrant needs to work at least 10 years. Here is the catch, what if the immigrant chooses not to work, in the case the immigrant remarries and chooses to stay at home?

The best bet is to have a happy marriage, and get the immigrant naturalized ASAP.

Simply read the instructions included with the I-864 form.

On page 3 note what it states:

How Long Does My Obligation

as a Sponsor Continue?

Your obligation to support the immigrant(s) you are

sponsoring in this affidavit of support will continue until the

sponsored immigrant becomes a U.S. citizen, or can be

credited with 40 qualifying quarters of work in the United

States.

Although 40 qualifying quarters of work (credits) generally

equate to ten years of work, in certain cases the work of a

spouse or parent adds qualifying quarters. The Social Security

Administration can provide information on how to count

qualifying quarters (credits) of work.

The obligation also ends if you or the sponsored immigrant

dies or if the sponsored immigrant ceases to be a lawful

permanent resident and departs the United States. Divorce

does not end the sponsorship obligation.

http://www.uscis.gov/files/form/I-864.pdf

I wonder how many sign this form not knowing what they are signing, especially the co-sponsors?

When entering into a relationship, and signing this form the sponsors had better realy know the person that they are sponsoring.

Edited November 20, 2006 by YuAndDan

[PurrSuede 0]

Does anyone know if this is true, I have been reading some other posts, and have found some disturbing court rulings, that in fact the alien spouse, can take me to the federal court and claim 125% for remainder of her time left for the citizenship, below is a link to few of these cases I have found…

Here are links showing some of these rulings, this is scary.

http://www.ilw.com/articles/2006,0110-wheeler.shtm

http://www.ilw.com/articles/2006,0608-mehta.shtm

She entered as a CR 1 on Jan 28, 2006, were married on Dec 2, 2004, and were living separately until her entry. We have separated since Oct 31, and have filled for divorce.

So does anyone know if I can withdraw my affidavit of support? Or if I withdraw my name from the affidavit of support on file with USCIS?

Thanks again for your thoughts…

As I told you in the other thread within this forum:

go read Post #12 in this thread (link is below). I've discussed this at length several times within this forum.

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=41915

My opinions, such as they are.

-- Dan

Yes,

The Court in Cheshire v. Cheshire analyzed, after reviewing Section 213A, that the sponsor’s obligation to support the sponsored immigrant under the Affidavit of Support only terminated upon the occurrence of one of the five circumstances:

1) the sponsor’s death,

2) the sponsored immigrant’s death,

3) the sponsored immigrant becoming a US citizen,

4) the sponsored immigrant permanently departing the US, or

5) the sponsored immigrant being credited with a total of 40 qualifying quarters of work.

Number 5 is the most damning, 40 qualifying quarters of work means the immigrant needs to work at least 10 years. Here is the catch, what if the immigrant chooses not to work, in the case the immigrant remarries and chooses to stay at home?

The best bet is to have a happy marriage, and get the immigrant naturalized ASAP.

Simply read the instructions included with the I-864 form.

On page 3 note what it states:

How Long Does My Obligation

as a Sponsor Continue?

Your obligation to support the immigrant(s) you are

sponsoring in this affidavit of support will continue until the

sponsored immigrant becomes a U.S. citizen, or can be

credited with 40 qualifying quarters of work in the United

States.

Although 40 qualifying quarters of work (credits) generally

equate to ten years of work, in certain cases the work of a

spouse or parent adds qualifying quarters. The Social Security

Administration can provide information on how to count

qualifying quarters (credits) of work.

The obligation also ends if you or the sponsored immigrant

dies or if the sponsored immigrant ceases to be a lawful

permanent resident and departs the United States. Divorce

does not end the sponsorship obligation.

http://www.uscis.gov/files/form/I-864.pdf

I wonder how many sign this form not knowing what they are signing, especially the co-sponsors?

When entering into a relationship, and signing this form the sponsors had better realy know the person that they are sponsoring.

Same thing, again, Yu and Dan... as I've told you before, per Wheeler, see the following link:

go read Post #12 in this thread (below). I've discussed this at length several times within this forum.

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=41915

My opinions, such as they are.

-- Dan

I'll say this ~again~

From the Wheeler article:

At the same time, it is important to provide a realistic assessment of the probability of actions to enforce the affidavit of support. The author is not aware of any successful actions to obtain reimbursement for means-tested benefit programs obtained by the alien, largely due to the following: (1) sponsored aliens are barred from receiving these benefits for a five-year period in most jurisdictions; (2) after this five-year period, the income of the sponsor is deemed to the alien in determining financial eligibility; and (3) most states have not implemented a system for seeking such reimbursement in cases where the alien does access benefits. Over the course of the last nine years, only a handful of actions have been brought against sponsors by the sponsored alien, and all have been by disgruntled spouses.

So let's get REALISTIC as Wheeler suggests, shall we???

-- Dan

[diadromous mermaid 36]

Does anyone know if this is true, I have been reading some other posts, and have found some disturbing court rulings, that in fact the alien spouse, can take me to the federal court and claim 125% for remainder of her time left for the citizenship, below is a link to few of these cases I have found…

Here are links showing some of these rulings, this is scary.

http://www.ilw.com/articles/2006,0110-wheeler.shtm

http://www.ilw.com/articles/2006,0608-mehta.shtm

She entered as a CR 1 on Jan 28, 2006, were married on Dec 2, 2004, and were living separately until her entry. We have separated since Oct 31, and have filled for divorce.

So does anyone know if I can withdraw my affidavit of support? Or if I withdraw my name from the affidavit of support on file with USCIS?

letter to the USCIS where her case is filed asking to remove your name for AOS?

I have set up the Infopass meeting and want to do this right, and not miss anything, it is difficult enough with everything else going on, I don’t want to screw this up and assure to cover myself and protect myself with immigration as much as I can.

Thanks again for your thoughts…

Dan and SOL.broken,

While I tend to agree that Wheeler does suggest that there are only a handful of published cases of sponsored immigrants successfully suing the US citizen for support, pursuant to the contractual terms of the I-864, we should bear in mind that this may not accurately reflect reality. Divorce matters are handled in family court, and the obligation made by the US citizen to maintain the sponsored immigrant at a level equal or above 125% of the poverty line could conceivably be used to leverage the sponsored immigrant's settlement in the actual termination of the marriage. It's weight and entitlement does not preclude it from becoming a very viable tool in the divorce setting, not simply in a separate civil action post divorce. That being said, I can't imagine how Wheeler could be aware of the minutia of each and every divorce action that occurs between a US citizen and his or her alien spouse to know with any certainty if the I-864 itself played a role or not.

As far as the I-864 is concerned, it is an irrevocable agreement between the USCIS and the sponsor and as such can only be "withdrawn" prior to adjudication of the Adjustment of Status application, technically. I say technically because although it can't be withdrawn thereafter, an action to rescind the approved AOS would render it null and void. So, if the US citizen were to learn that the alien deceived him or her, or entered the marriage solely for immigration benefit and could provide enough evidence to support that conclusion to the USCIS, the I-864 might just fall with the approved AOS.

[PurrSuede 0]

Dan and SOL.broken,

While I tend to agree that Wheeler does suggest that there are only a handful of published cases of sponsored immigrants successfully suing the US citizen for support, pursuant to the contractual terms of the I-864, we should bear in mind that this may not accurately reflect reality. Divorce matters are handled in family court, and the obligation made by the US citizen to maintain the sponsored immigrant at a level equal or above 125% of the poverty line could conceivably be used to leverage the sponsored immigrant's settlement in the actual termination of the marriage. It's weight and entitlement does not preclude it from becoming a very viable tool in the divorce setting, not simply in a separate civil action post divorce. That being said, I can't imagine how Wheeler could be aware of the minutia of each and every divorce action that occurs between a US citizen and his or her alien spouse to know with any certainty if the I-864 itself played a role or not.

Mermaid:

"could conceivably be used to leverage" is a far cry from the dire circumstances that everyone ascribes to this document.

Because in many states, to begin with, there is often some sort of obligation of the financially better-off party to provide aid/support to the one less financially well-to-do in the case of a divorce. And a good family-law (aka Divorce) attorney would be aware of that and would know how to structure this properly to protect your assets as best as possible.

And my immigration attorney also pointed out to me that the very act of "bringing her to America" was a very viable BENEFIT that could be construed as something having been furnished of "significant value" to offset such a claim for support. That being said, it wasn't necessary to go to such extremes.

I think it is necessary, as Wheeler said, to have a REALISTIC assessment of the likelihood of it being used. Despite this being a "weighty" document, the odds of it being used in some manner to garnish your wages or other such nonsense is extremely slim.

After all my research, and having gone through a divorce personally, I would still tend to agree with Wheeler that the likelihood is indeed quite significantly lower than the doom and gloom which everyone keeps ascribing to it here, as though, oh my god! you'll have to send this person a check every month for the rest of your life.

Fact is, it very very likely will NOT happen in such an event, and a good, knowledgeable family-law attorney would make sure it would be very unlikely that it would happen.

As I'm sure you know there are issues of SUPPORT which must be addressed in EVERY divorce, regardless of whether either of the two parties are immigrants or not. I don't see the "obligation" of the I-864 any weightier than any issues of support that occur within a dissolution of marriage, and again, I tend to view with Wheeler that it is most often used when a spouse is disgruntled with the support they have received.

And usually someone does not reach that point unless there's been several attempts to resolve the dispute. As I have stated, there are ways for a good family-law attorney to address these concerns and they should be considered in an equitable divorce. Doesn't make it an easier pill to swallow, but all these people extemperorizing about "Oh my God! The I-864..." and yet the REALITY is that very very very few people have been ever subjected to any action on the basis of it.

Again, the keyword here is REALISTIC ASSESSMENT, and having a good divorce attorney can go a long way to preclude such an event, based on the fact that SOME support for a spouse may occur in a divorce situation ~anyway~ under the laws of the state that the parties live in.

As a REALISTIC ASSESSMENT, per Wheeler, I feel I would have more to worry about such things as her breaking into my house while I'm gone, or having kept a spare key on the side, than her using the I-864 against me in some way, shape or form. That is my REALISTIC ASSESSMENT.

I'm not saying it couldn't happen, but the odds of it happening are extremely extremely slim, indeed.

-- Dan

[SOL.Broken 0]

Dear friends,

When I got married, I had all my assets liquated and kept in a separate account joint with my mother and brother. During marriage I have lost more money and have gained no money.

From Family lawyer stand point, once they get my list of assets, even though separate and not commingled with the marriage accounts nor life, the lawyer for the wife will use all they can to get all they can for the poor lady who has fooled me for all this time, as she will play the “Poor Me, I have been brought over and left out in the cold in US, oh poor me “, she is good looking and will be using it well with her lawyer. I offered her lawyer a one way ticket back, they offered me not file for divorce so she get’s her g.c. then she will give me my divorce, further she will sign an agreement not to have any financial claims against me. If I agree, she can later claim agreement signed under due stress and sue me anyways, so let the judge decide her share..

All information provided here from my fiends help me with understanding with different issues can arise.

I’m in California now, and California is a tough one for men, rather than women.

I have not had a job since Aug 1 to date, and she has been working, so I get lucky I can ask her for support vs. other way around, at least I hope. My lawyers' realistic assessment is " she deserves and can get ZERO, only if 1/2 of time lived together for support, and even that she will augue, since i'm out of work and she works... eventhough she can quite her job and claim... we'll see

Thanks again for all the info..

God shows his blessing in different ways, sometimes, these blessings costs us in order to teach us hard lessons in life.

Edited November 20, 2006 by SOL.Broken

[Yodrak 7]

SOL.Broken,

Who fooled who? Sounds to me like you're the one who is playing the 'oh poor me' game - I'd want to divorce you for pulling sh|t like this.

Was it God who taught you to be a gigolo?

Yodrak

Dear friends,

When I got married, I had all my assets liquated and kept in a separate account joint with my mother and brother. During marriage I have lost more money and have gained no money.

From Family lawyer stand point, once they get my list of assets, even though separate and not commingled with the marriage accounts nor life, the lawyer for the wife will use all they can to get all they can for the poor lady who has fooled me for all this time, as she will play the "Poor Me, I have been brought over and left out in the cold in US, oh poor me ", .....

I have not had a job since Aug 1 to date, and she has been working, ....

God shows his blessing in different ways, sometimes, these blessings costs us in order to teach us hard lessons in life.

[SOL.Broken 0]

SOL.Broken,

Who fooled who? Sounds to me like you're the one who is playing the 'oh poor me' game - I'd want to divorce you for pulling sh|t like this.

Was it God who taught you to be a gigolo?

Yodrak

Dear friends,

When I got married, I had all my assets liquated and kept in a separate account joint with my mother and brother. During marriage I have lost more money and have gained no money.

From Family lawyer stand point, once they get my list of assets, even though separate and not commingled with the marriage accounts nor life, the lawyer for the wife will use all they can to get all they can for the poor lady who has fooled me for all this time, as she will play the "Poor Me, I have been brought over and left out in the cold in US, oh poor me ", .....

I have not had a job since Aug 1 to date, and she has been working, ....

God shows his blessing in different ways, sometimes, these blessings costs us in order to teach us hard lessons in life.

'Yodrak' , if anyone is dumb enough to put all they earned into a marriage life that just started where the spouse does not do the same and just asks for more and more, and i loose more and more, no one can judge me, as i know i gave it all, so you are entitled to ur opnion, and i'm mine, and don't judge.

[WifeOHunkyJohn 2]

'Yodrak' , if anyone is dumb enough to put all they earned into a marriage life that just started where the spouse does not do the same and just asks for more and more, and i loose more and more, no one can judge me, as i know i gave it all, so you are entitled to ur opnion, and i'm mine, and don't judge.

Don't give Yodrak a hard time.

Despite what you say, you did not "put all they earned into a marriage life" because you wrote:

When I got married, I had all my assets liquated and kept in a separate account joint with my mother and brother.

So since you already seem to have decided to cover your own a$$ and keep the assets from her, his comment stands. It does very much look like you are playing the "poor me" game by trying to say she is the bad egg, when you yourself look as though you went into the venture with both eyes well and truly open, and a lock on your money.

So much for marriage being a union of two people wanting to spend forever together.

[edited for spelling]

Edited November 21, 2006 by WifeOHunkyJohn

[SOL.Broken 0]

WifeOHunkyJohn, Yodrakl ..

Dear member, as if you know my x, (well not yet), you speak as if you are speaking from her mouth. The issue of relationship and for two people taking a piece of themselves and give it into and for the relationship and other partner, when when it is a one way of giving, and not in the financial ways, but in the relationship itself for two people to develop trust and other needed bases for a relationship grow on, and having planted and planting seeds of life to grow together and form a family which can withstand storms of life and having the feeling of being able to lean on one another when needed to face them, weather alone or together. With our relationship we were not able to solve issues which were simple enough in my oponion in a maretial life , yet we were not able to solve issues to put them behind us, her method was to just say yes, yes, and stay quiet and not to engage in the discussions in such a way to be able to jointly see it the issues from each others point of view, inorder to fairly for both parties to agree on a solution, and put it behind them to move on and grown on ablity to solve them and become stroger. She saying yes, and she was doing the opposite of what was said yes to or no to, and she would just do what she wanted as she allways did, and ignore the issues discussed and agreed on.

anyhow, i had another post with this list shown, if you want to read on, this is a aff. of support thread.

i welcome constructive comments, not beating one another up, ablity to reason, and discuss, as i allway have done, as such. enjoy your marriage and i'm glad you are having a good married life and love your housband, and i extended my best wishes to you for hollidays and be safe and happy.

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.ph...&hl=sg14all

Edited November 22, 2006 by SOL.Broken

[sweety_pie 0]

I was wondering if a prenuptial agreement can take away this obligation of the sponsor to the alien.Does anyone know?

[meauxna 15]

I don't see the obligation as being Sponsor to Alien. It's Sponsor to Fellow American Taxpayers.

We don't want to foot the bill because your alien went on welfare.

(don't see how a prenup would kill it)

[diadromous mermaid 36]

I don't see the obligation as being Sponsor to Alien. It's Sponsor to Fellow American Taxpayers.

We don't want to foot the bill because your alien went on welfare.

(don't see how a prenup would kill it)

Meauxna, that's quite true. The principle obligation of the Affidavit of Support is one between the sponsor and the USCIS, but I believe that sweety pie may be referring to the exposure that a sponsor undertakes to the alien to support to the 125% poverty level. This brings about an interesting issue, in my eyes, because unless flagrant fraud is at hand wherein the alien should not be entitled to the benefits outlined by the sponsor in the Affidavit, to make any attempt to obviate any obligation to the alien, implied or otherwise, would be counter-productive in my mind. If the alien is indeed struggling on less than the national poverty income level, he or she might possibly try to draw benefits, and then the sponsor is on the hook to the government.

[Wild Wind 0]

Yes,

The Court in Cheshire v. Cheshire analyzed, after reviewing Section 213A, that the sponsor’s obligation to support the sponsored immigrant under the Affidavit of Support only terminated upon the occurrence of one of the five circumstances:

1) the sponsor’s death,

2) the sponsored immigrant’s death,

3) the sponsored immigrant becoming a US citizen,

4) the sponsored immigrant permanently departing the US, or

5) the sponsored immigrant being credited with a total of 40 qualifying quarters of work.

Number 5 is the most damning, 40 qualifying quarters of work means the immigrant needs to work at least 10 years. Here is the catch, what if the immigrant chooses not to work, in the case the immigrant remarries and chooses to stay at home?

The best bet is to have a happy marriage, and get the immigrant naturalized ASAP.

Simply read the instructions included with the I-864 form.

On page 3 note what it states:

How Long Does My Obligation

as a Sponsor Continue?

Your obligation to support the immigrant(s) you are

sponsoring in this affidavit of support will continue until the

sponsored immigrant becomes a U.S. citizen, or can be

credited with 40 qualifying quarters of work in the United

States.

Although 40 qualifying quarters of work (credits) generally

equate to ten years of work, in certain cases the work of a

spouse or parent adds qualifying quarters. The Social Security

Administration can provide information on how to count

qualifying quarters (credits) of work.

The obligation also ends if you or the sponsored immigrant

dies or if the sponsored immigrant ceases to be a lawful

permanent resident and departs the United States. Divorce

does not end the sponsorship obligation.

http://www.uscis.gov/files/form/I-864.pdf

I wonder how many sign this form not knowing what they are signing, especially the co-sponsors?

When entering into a relationship, and signing this form the sponsors had better realy know the person that they are sponsoring.

As you work and pay taxes, you earn credits that count toward your eligibility for future Social Security benefits. You can earn a maximum of four credits each year. Most people need 40 credits to qualify for benefits. You can earn up to 4 credits per year based on your annual earnings. The amount of earnings required for a credit increases each year as general wage levels rise. Currently for 2006 you need to earn $970 for one credit so $3880 earns you 4 credits for the year.

[diadromous mermaid 36]

As you work and pay taxes, you earn credits that count toward your eligibility for future Social Security benefits. You can earn a maximum of four credits each year. Most people need 40 credits to qualify for benefits. You can earn up to 4 credits per year based on your annual earnings. The amount of earnings required for a credit increases each year as general wage levels rise. Currently for 2006 you need to earn $970 for one credit so $3880 earns you 4 credits for the year.

Wild Wind,

This is, for the most part, correct with one little correction.

Currently for 2006 you need to earn $970 for one credit so $3880 earns you 4 credits for the year.

You do not acquire one credit for every $970.00 you EARN. You acquire one quarter's credit for every $970.00 credited (noted by the wages on your paycheck reported by your employer by way of a 941 return to the Social Security Administration). The reason I note this specifically is that some people may earn enough but do not report that income. A person that works in an industry that is tip-related comes to mind, for example.

And, while married you do get the benefit of your US spouse's work quarter's credits as well. The complication arises if the parties divorce prior to a determination being made to see whether the alien has satisfied the Affidavit of Support 40-quarters. Any quarters acquired by way of the US citizen spouse, upon divorce, are no longer valid. In essence this means that for the average couple, both working consistently and earning enough to have a $970.00 deposit applied to his or her SSA account, the Affidavit of Support could be satisfied in as little as 5 years. Of course if divorce occurs that can be stretched immediately to 10 years and possibly more, if the alien does not have a solid work history or substantial enough earnings rate.

Edited November 29, 2006 by diadromous mermaid