Senior Democrat to reintroduce legislaion to reinstate the military draft

[Trompe le Monde 1,107]

I'm sorry that you're "insulted". I don't see you arguing for the U.S. Citizens that are of the age 18 to 20 that also have no "say" because they're too young to vote.

umm, last time I checked citizens aged 18-20 could vote

they just can't have a beer

[Hilarious Clinton 452]

though the movie version disappointed me....

[kaydee457 13]

I'm sorry that you're "insulted". I don't see you arguing for the U.S. Citizens that are of the age 18 to 20 that also have no "say" because they're too young to vote.

umm, last time I checked citizens aged 18-20 could vote

they just can't have a beer

If that's true then I'll correct it but I'm pretty sure they were given the right to vote (about 15 or so years ago) but later that right was recinded through legislation.

Wait 1- I'll look it up on the internet because if it's on the internet it must be true.....

[Trompe le Monde 1,107]

Maybe try the constitution?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twenty-sixth_...es_Constitution

Edited November 20, 2006 by robinklake

[kaydee457 13]

though the movie version disappointed me....

Yes, you're right. The age to vote is 18 in National Elections and was changed (lowered) to that in 1971.

However as a result of a Supreme Court case later lodged for reasons unknown to me individual STATES were given the option to raise the age to 21.....

So, there are some states that have a voting age of 21.

If someone has some spare time perhaps they can fill in the details as I don't have time right now- I'm at work.......

Having said that, my comments about assimilation are still valid. Immigrants should assimilate or not migrate to this country.

I'm not for a draft other than I think it's a good vehicle for many to mature.....I'm just enjoying the fact that people are just now begining to find out who/whom they put into office.

I once lived in New York (fact is I grew there) so I certainly know Chuck Rangel and his antics....

Robinklake- sorry, I quoted the wrong post. Your answer is in my previous post......

[Trompe le Monde 1,107]

Tell me the states where it is 21?

Amendment 26 of the US Constitution

Section 1. The right of citizens of the United States, who are eighteen years of age or older, to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or by any State on account of age.

[kaydee457 13]

Tell me the states where it is 21?

Amendment 26 of the US Constitution

Section 1. The right of citizens of the United States, who are eighteen years of age or older, to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or by any State on account of age.

I think it only applies to State and local elections......

[DeadPoolX 9]

We are talking about service to your country- in the military or domestic form. How does required civic engagement not benefit society? The question for me is only the legality in regards to individual liberties.

Maybe I wasn;t clear in my explaination of how a grandfather clause would work. Let's say the the law goes into effect on Jan 1 2008. It will require all 18-42 yr olds to serve 2 years of service. It could mean that you choose which two years to do service between those years. There could also be a clause stating that it only applies to those turning 18 as of Jan1 2008 and all future citizens.

Because required civic engagement takes me away from my career and my family. I think I'd better serve society working at my chosen profession, helping those with psychological problems. Yes, I realize community service wouldn't take up all of my time nor would it cause me to shut down my future practice; however, it would cut into my work and family. I wouldn't necessarily mind doing some community service if it was at my leisure and my choice -- donating to charitable organizations, for instance, is something I strongly believe in. However, I am very much against being forced to do it.

Your idea about being "grandfathered in" is an interesting one. If it worked that way, well...I'd be safe and all, but I'd still be against mandatory service in this country -- military or community.

Anyway...onto Kaydee's post.

Last I recall, the 26th Amendment guarantees every U.S. citizen, 18 years and up, the right to vote. Whether or not they do is another question entirely. However, they still have the right.

Now as far as legally drinking alcohol goes...the National Minimum Drinking Age Act was signed into action on July 17, 1984 and that forced all states to comply with federal guidelines to make the drinking age 21. If a state didn't follow this order, it would receive 10% less funding under the Federal Aid Highway Act for its annual federal highway apportionment.

Some states still have their own "age rules" though -- Utah's minimum age for tobacco use is 19 and Nevada and other states have a limit of 21 years for gambling.

[Trompe le Monde 1,107]

I think it only applies to State and local elections......

I don't think so -- find me evidence that contradicts the constitutiuon (which does not protect other "adult"right likes marriage, gambling, tobacco which are left to the states) and then we'll talk

[kaydee457 13]

I think it only applies to State and local elections......

I don't think so -- find me evidence that contradicts the constitutiuon (which does not protect other "adult"right likes marriage, gambling, tobacco which are left to the states) and then we'll talk

You have me searching for the article I read about the 1971 lowering of the age. It had a reference to some challenge made by states unknown to maintain local voting age at 21.

Perhaps I misread it, I don't know......I only skimmed over it....Maybe it said drinking age, or other such things....

This thread has become on non-issue......Watch out for that Rangel fellow though.....

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20061120/pl_nm/draft_dc

[Heracles 417]

Common sense? And here I was thinking its completely disingenuous to suggest that Legal Permanent Residents who pay taxes like everyone else, should have no opinion about a draft - when they could potentially be included in that draft.

What is this? Starship Troopers?

Would a LPR in the UK have a say? It's like saying a renter should have the right to tell the landlord what to do with their house, considering they are possible paying their mortgage payments..

A person that is not a USC has generally not pledged any allegance to this country and should, therefore, not only not be required but not even be permitted to serve in this country's military. That would be common sense.

Not really. There are too many people living here after their own financial gain. People who couldn't care less about the country. Many European and other developed nations are enacting new laws and procedures which force new immigrants to pass a national values test. Someone being a LPR means just that, Permanent Resident. The countries laws and rules should not be negotiable to suit others.

Edited November 20, 2006 by Infidel

[aussiewench 9]

Common sense? And here I was thinking its completely disingenuous to suggest that Legal Permanent Residents who pay taxes like everyone else, should have no opinion about a draft - when they could potentially be included in that draft.

What is this? Starship Troopers?

Would a LPR in the UK have a say? It's like saying a renter should have the right to tell the landlord what to do with their house, considering they are possible paying their mortgage payments..

A person that is not a USC has generally not pledged any allegance to this country and should, therefore, not only not be required but not even be permitted to serve in this country's military. That would be common sense.

Not really. There are too many people living here after their own financial gain. People who couldn't care less about the country. Many European and other developed nations are enacting new laws and procedures which force new immigrants to pass a national values test. Someone being a LPR means just that, Permanent Resident. The countries laws and rules should not be negotiable to suit others.

I agree. But one should not be FORCED to fight and maybe die for that country either if they don't have the same rights as the citizen.

Edited November 20, 2006 by aussiewench

[kaydee457 13]

Common sense? And here I was thinking its completely disingenuous to suggest that Legal Permanent Residents who pay taxes like everyone else, should have no opinion about a draft - when they could potentially be included in that draft.

What is this? Starship Troopers?

Would a LPR in the UK have a say? It's like saying a renter should have the right to tell the landlord what to do with their house, considering they are possible paying their mortgage payments..

A person that is not a USC has generally not pledged any allegance to this country and should, therefore, not only not be required but not even be permitted to serve in this country's military. That would be common sense.

Not really. There are too many people living here after their own financial gain. People who couldn't care less about the country. Many European and other developed nations are enacting new laws and procedures which force new immigrants to pass a national values test. Someone being a LPR means just that, Permanent Resident. The countries laws and rules should not be negotiable to suit others.

I agree. But one should not be FORCED to fight and maybe die for that country either if they don't have the same rights as the citizen.

Remember, you are not forced to serve as an LPR. You can leave the country at any time, giving up your residency.

U.S. Citizens are forced to serve and face criminal charges if they don't.

There are many things you are "forced" to do as a condition to be an LPR. You need to ask for permission to work, ask for permission to live here, get medicals and have interviews. In each case it's a requirement to comply with our laws.

[aussiewench 9]

Common sense? And here I was thinking its completely disingenuous to suggest that Legal Permanent Residents who pay taxes like everyone else, should have no opinion about a draft - when they could potentially be included in that draft.

What is this? Starship Troopers?

Would a LPR in the UK have a say? It's like saying a renter should have the right to tell the landlord what to do with their house, considering they are possible paying their mortgage payments..

A person that is not a USC has generally not pledged any allegance to this country and should, therefore, not only not be required but not even be permitted to serve in this country's military. That would be common sense.

Not really. There are too many people living here after their own financial gain. People who couldn't care less about the country. Many European and other developed nations are enacting new laws and procedures which force new immigrants to pass a national values test. Someone being a LPR means just that, Permanent Resident. The countries laws and rules should not be negotiable to suit others.

I agree. But one should not be FORCED to fight and maybe die for that country either if they don't have the same rights as the citizen.

Remember, you are not forced to serve as an LPR. You can leave the country at any time, giving up your residency.

U.S. Citizens are forced to serve and face criminal charges if they don't.

There are many things you are "forced" to do as a condition to be an LPR. You need to ask for permission to work, ask for permission to live here, get medicals and have interviews. In each case it's a requirement to comply with our laws.

Thats a pathetic excuse Kaydee but typical. Big difference in what you are referencing, to that of dying for a country you have no right to vote in.

[peezey 0]

Having said that, my comments about assimilation are still valid. Immigrants should assimilate or not migrate to this country.

Saying your own comments are valid does not make them so, it just makes them your own comments.

Who defines assimilation? Is assimilation based on one's dedication to one's country? What is the definition of dedication? And are only immigrants to assimilate culturally & civically, or should old people assimilate into younger behaviors? Should modest people assimilate into the sex culture that's rampant in the US?