Tattoos and piercings

[maryandatif 0]

Seeing as the vast majority of these discussions go SO badly here, I am curious why someone would start a thread essentially knowing where it will go.

Is that the case here? Surely there are other fora more appropriate for learning about your faith?

The regional forums here are intended to be a place to trade 'local' notes about Embassies etc. Seems to me that these types of topics stretch the intended use of VJ. Beyond what a polite guest would do.

I started this thread in this forum because it is for regional discussion and I believe that questions about Islam fit in here as this forum is the Middle East and North Africa forum which are generally Muslim countries.

Which does not answer the questions I asked.

This is an immigration related site. The admin offered a regional area to contain travel, moving, local getting-around info that is related to the immigration process.

Add a cup of:

These conversations have consistantly turned into flame wars, hurt feelings and outright cruelty with a sprinkle of ignorance and intolerance.

Starting to look like a recipe for disaster?

[meauxna 15]

Sorry, the snack bar is closed!

[Joel Halfwassen 0]

This has been fascinating to read about, I never knew about the tradition of facial tattoos in the Middle East --thank for talking about this!

I second that! This is awesome reading!

Joel

[Joel Halfwassen 0]

Seeing as the vast majority of these discussions go SO badly here, I am curious why someone would start a thread essentially knowing where it will go.

Is that the case here? Surely there are other fora more appropriate for learning about your faith?

The regional forums here are intended to be a place to trade 'local' notes about Embassies etc. Seems to me that these types of topics stretch the intended use of VJ. Beyond what a polite guest would do.

I started this thread in this forum because it is for regional discussion and I believe that questions about Islam fit in here as this forum is the Middle East and North Africa forum which are generally Muslim countries.

Which does not answer the questions I asked.

This is an immigration related site. The admin offered a regional area to contain travel, moving, local getting-around info that is related to the immigration process.

Add a cup of:

These conversations have consistantly turned into flame wars, hurt feelings and outright cruelty with a sprinkle of ignorance and intolerance.

Starting to look like a recipe for disaster?

MENA is a very active group here in VJ (as you know better then anyone ) The threads are pointed towards topics that affect this region or that have a distict cultural characteristic FROM the region. I find their postings very appropriate for this forum. Part of the immigration process is the cultural aspect of the American citizen blending with the culture of the spouse. This includes history, poilitics, family, local tradition/lore, etc. This forum provides a good home for that transition.

Joel

Edited November 20, 2006 by Joel Halfwassen

[jordanianprincess 0]

Seeing as the vast majority of these discussions go SO badly here, I am curious why someone would start a thread essentially knowing where it will go.

Is that the case here? Surely there are other fora more appropriate for learning about your faith?

The regional forums here are intended to be a place to trade 'local' notes about Embassies etc. Seems to me that these types of topics stretch the intended use of VJ. Beyond what a polite guest would do.

I started this thread in this forum because it is for regional discussion and I believe that questions about Islam fit in here as this forum is the Middle East and North Africa forum which are generally Muslim countries.

Which does not answer the questions I asked.

This is an immigration related site. The admin offered a regional area to contain travel, moving, local getting-around info that is related to the immigration process.

Add a cup of:

These conversations have consistantly turned into flame wars, hurt feelings and outright cruelty with a sprinkle of ignorance and intolerance.

Starting to look like a recipe for disaster?

MENA is a very active group here in VJ (as you know better then anyone ) The threads are pointed towards topics that affect this region or that have a distict cultural characteristic FROM the region. I find their postings very appropriate for this forum. Part of the immigration process is the cultural aspect of the American citizen blending with the culture of the spouse. This includes history, poilitics, family, local tradition/lore, etc. This forum provides a good home for that transition.

Joel

[mellaliya 0]

Tattoos are haram according to the Bukhari and Muslim ahadith, which most Sunnis follow.

http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/Satelli...d=1119503544192

About the Amazigh(Berber) women who tattoo, apparently they used them as a form of protection from the Evil Eye, but since most are Muslims and according to the Sunnah it's forbidden, some of the women use henna instead of ink.

[deeshla 0]

Tattoos are haram according to the Bukhari and Muslim ahadith, which most Sunnis follow.

http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/Satelli...d=1119503544192

About the Amazigh(Berber) women who tattoo, apparently they used them as a form of protection from the Evil Eye, but since most are Muslims and according to the Sunnah it's forbidden, some of the women use henna instead of ink.

They also used them to beautify the body and denote tribal identification - same reasons we do it here. Most women just use henna on hands and feet. Those old face tattoos are inked with an alfalfa ink and some other inks I am not familiar with.

Berbers are Muslims but the Amazigh culture predates Islam by several thousand years. You can see preIslamic (circular) cemetaries in Morocco. Amazigh peoples had Goddess figures in their religion. There were many differences with Islam. The face tat is just one example, I think, of how some of those early cultural traditions persist (though are disappering) and show how relatively new Islam is to some Amazigh in Morocco. By the way, there are big Amazigh pride areas in the Southeast that claim to not be Muslim and are re-claiming the old ways.

[ya falaha! 0]

Both from what I've read and have been told (not just by my husband) I'd say tattoos are haram. I don't know about piercings.

I don't have any tattoos and I only have pierced ears.

[Mrs. Forgetful 2]

I have my ears pierced, 3 in each lobe 2 in one cartilige and 1 in the other, a total of 9 piercings. I have thought about getting a tatoo, but decided against it. It was right after my 18th b-day, I was going to get a "jesus fish" (icthus?) on my foot, but thanks God I decided against it because 3 years later I converted to Islam.

[peezey 0]

Amazigh peoples had Goddess figures in their religion.

There's a lot of interesting research on this. The Amazigh Queen Kahena was revered, and the older societies were matriarchal. One of the most interesting bits about tamazight is how closely related it is to Hawaiian language. There is a significant amount of word sharing. The mystical bits of the cultures are strikingly similar, too. Makes you wonder how/when these cultures/people were once together and now so far apart.

[deeshla 0]

Amazigh peoples had Goddess figures in their religion.

There's a lot of interesting research on this. The Amazigh Queen Kahena was revered, and the older societies were matriarchal. One of the most interesting bits about tamazight is how closely related it is to Hawaiian language. There is a significant amount of word sharing. The mystical bits of the cultures are strikingly similar, too. Makes you wonder how/when these cultures/people were once together and now so far apart.

Wow! Didn't know about that. You have any suggestions for reading about Amazigh origins? There are so many debates about this. I did know there are some similarities with ancient Egyptian languages and Tiffinagh looks similar to the heiroglyphs.

[peezey 0]

Amazigh peoples had Goddess figures in their religion.

There's a lot of interesting research on this. The Amazigh Queen Kahena was revered, and the older societies were matriarchal. One of the most interesting bits about tamazight is how closely related it is to Hawaiian language. There is a significant amount of word sharing. The mystical bits of the cultures are strikingly similar, too. Makes you wonder how/when these cultures/people were once together and now so far apart.

Wow! Didn't know about that. You have any suggestions for reading about Amazigh origins? There are so many debates about this. I did know there are some similarities with ancient Egyptian languages and Tiffinagh looks similar to the heiroglyphs.

I have some books of my own from previously mentioned professor, but I've relied a lot on her (and her colleaugues) theses, writings, articles, research since they write in English. There are also lots of shorter articles online that have culled information from the few english-writing anthros. The majority of the work is in French, which I do not speak or read at the level necessary to go through this intricate information. I'll PM you when I get home tonight and look through my stuff.

Al Akhawayn University has the largest collection of tamazight research outside of France. Thankfully researchers have been good enough to supply copies of their books now that the level of fervor over acknowledging tamazight has died down significantly. It used to be that these books would have to be sneaked in.