Stop Amnesty

[spookyturtle 9,466]

why spend money deporting them?

Ok, we'll send them to your house.

[decocker 7,198]

Ok, we'll send them to your house.

mmm. okay but the owner wants to sell so we probably won't be around long.

[spookyturtle 9,466]

mmm. okay but the owner wants to sell so we probably won't be around long.

You could leave a forwarding address. That would be the humanitarian thing to do.

[decocker 7,198]

You could leave a forwarding address. That would be the humanitarian thing to do.

okay. soon as i find one.

[SaharaSunset 165]

Let me give you some background on myself. I was born in the U.S., as were my parents. I'm legal. I don't have any connections to any illegals, and I'm not fighting for anyone in particular on this.

What I do when I evaluate these sorts of situations is I put myself in other people's shoes. The big problem is misinformation in Mexico -- Mexicans think that if they go to the U.S., they can find a great job, make plenty of money, and support everyone. Mongolians think the same thing. Obviously, it's not the truth... most illegals don't make very much money in the U.S., at all.

But if you grow up hearing this, and you're sick and tired of not making enough money to feed your family... maybe you come from a poor background and didn't get enough of an education to apply for a visa. So, you go to the U.S., to pursue happiness.

If someone in this case is a person willing to work hard and make something of him/herself, he/she should be given the chance. People were able to do this in the early times, when immigration from Europe was easy.

If the government needs money, I would think people who are legal are more likely to pay taxes than those who aren't. If the illegals are made legal, they are more likely to contribute.

Put yourself in the shoes of these people. I think too many Americans think they are entitled just for being born in this country. I could care less where someone was born, or what background they come from. If they want to pursue happiness, I want to let them.

The more we exclude, the further from peace we are.

Sadly your generous attitude really only applies to people from Central and South America. And frankly I feel that the bias in all this towards certain countries, isn't right.

The vast vast vast majority of illegal aliens come from South and Central America. We know this. And while I know there are some people from other parts of the world, who travel to Mexico specifically to travel illegally into the U.S. (and some people who overstay their visas) the reality is, "amnesty" would mostly affect the Latin American illegal population. And how is that fair? Granting special privileges to people who happen to be able to break the law because of their location. (and yes, like it or not it is the LAW at present, and therefore they ARE criminals.)

What about all the desperate & starving people in Africa, Asia and the Middle East who are groveling in extreme poverty? They too yearn for a better life, but sadly for them, they could never dream of financing an intercontinental plane ticket and then coming in illegally. Who's looking out for them? According to the "we feel sorry for them" logic, should we offer free entry to anyone from other countries who wished in the last 20 or so years, that they could come to the U.S., but couldn't come illegally due to their location. And we should probably cover the cost of their plane ticket too, because we want it to be equal, right? Then we're really give all people a chance to live and work hard in America.

And as for calling Americans "entitled" - HA!! Why shouldn't American's feel entitled to concern over whats happening in their country? That's kind of how it works right?....Each human is entitled to what their home and country offers them. Its not "entitled" for Americans to have opinions about immigration....nor is it racist. Its just how life is. Ask someone from any country that is doing well economically how they feel about uneducated, unskilled immigrants pouring into their country and you'll see its not just Americans who worry about these things. If anyone is acting "entitled" it would be the illegal immigrants who blatantly ignore the laws of the U.S., and then are furious when people are upset about them demanding rights and amnesty. And while there are many many good souls, who illegally come in to the U.S. with the intention to work hard, I think there are plenty who would/will/do, take full advantage of good old U.S.government assistance....the other side of the American dream....that I personally shell out hundreds of dollars a month for. Do we really want a deeper gouge from our check to pay for millions who will cheerfully take advantage of the generous, and easily abused welfare programs we provide here.

I too want my money back for my husband immigrating legally. And while we're at it, I want some pain and suffering compensation for the months and months my husband and I had to spend apart because he couldn't just snake across the border to be with me. (And spare me the sad tales of families torn apart when illegal parents are sent home while their conveniently "citizen" children stay in the U.S. Easy solution - they all go home together...then no one is torn apart.)

So next time you wanna "put yourself in someone else's immigration shoes" don't forget, ask yourself, are you putting on just one pair (the Latin American pair) out of millions and millions of other pairs that don't have the advantages of an attached border to the U.S.?. Why don't you consider the plight of all the others in the world who also dream of the great U.S.A....then perhaps you'll see just one reason why amnesty is so incredibly outrageous and unfair on so many levels.

Edited April 20, 2013 by SaharaSunset

[duraaraa 203]

Sadly your generous attitude really only applies to people from Central and South America. And frankly I feel that the bias in all this towards certain countries, isn't right.

The vast vast vast majority of illegal aliens come from South and Central America. We know this. And while I know there are some people from other parts of the world, who travel to Mexico specifically to travel illegally into the U.S. (and some people who overstay their visas) the reality is, "amnesty" would mostly affect the Latin American illegal population. And how is that fair? Granting special privileges to people who happen to be able to break the law because of their location. (and yes, like it or not it is the LAW at present, and therefore they ARE criminals.)

What about all the desperate & starving people in Africa, Asia and the Middle East who are groveling in extreme poverty? They too yearn for a better life, but sadly for them, they could never dream of financing an intercontinental plane ticket and then coming in illegally. Who's looking out for them? According to the "we feel sorry for them" logic, should we offer free entry to anyone from other countries who wished they could come to the U.S., but couldn't come illegally due to their location? And we should probably cover the cost of their plane ticket too, because we want to be equal right? And give all people a chance to live and work hard in America.

And as for calling Americans "entitled" - HA!! Why shouldn't American's feel entitled to concern over whats happening in their country? That's kind of how it works right?....Each human is entitled to what their home and country offers them. Its not "entitled" for Americans to have opinions about immigration....nor is it racist. Its just how life is. Ask someone from any country that is doing well economically how they feel about uneducated, unskilled immigrants pouring into their country and you'll see its not just Americans who worry about these things. If anyone is acting "entitled" it would be the illegal immigrants who blatantly ignore the laws of the U.S., and then are furious when people are upset about them demanding rights and amnesty. And while there are many many good souls, who illegally come in to the U.S. with the intention to work hard, I think there are plenty who would/will/do, take full advantage of good old U.S.government assistance....the other side of the American dream....that I personally shell out hundreds of dollars a month for. Do we really want a deeper gouge from our check to pay for millions who will cheerfully take advantage of the generous, and easily abused welfare programs we provide here.

I too want my money back for my husband immigrating legally. And while we're at it, I want some pain and suffering compensation for the months and months my husband and I had to spend apart because he couldn't just snake across the border to be with me. (And spare me the sad tales of families torn apart when illegal parents are sent home while their conveniently "citizen" children stay in the U.S. Easy solution - they all go home together...then no one is torn apart.)

So next time you wanna "put yourself in someone else's immigration shoes" don't forget, ask yourself, are you putting on just one pair (the Latin American pair) out of millions and millions of other pairs that don't have the advantages of an attached border to the U.S.?. Why don't you consider the plight of all the others in the world who also dream of the great U.S.A....then perhaps you'll see just one reason why amnesty is so incredibly outrageous and unfair on so many levels.

No... I'm thinking worldwide, and I'd welcome anyone from any country into the U.S. Visa overstayers, non-inspected Latin Americans, anyone who wants to come, or wants to stay, I think, should be able to, provided they are not dangerous.

Edited April 20, 2013 by duraaraa

[spookyturtle 9,466]

No... I'm thinking worldwide, and I'd welcome anyone from any country into the U.S. Visa overstayers, non-inspected Latin Americans, anyone who wants to come, or wants to stay, I think, should be able to, provided they are not dangerous.

Thankfully you're not in charge.

[decocker 7,198]

No... I'm thinking worldwide, and I'd welcome anyone from any country into the U.S. Visa overstayers, non-inspected Latin Americans, anyone who wants to come, or wants to stay, I think, should be able to, provided they are not dangerous.

[duraaraa 203]

Thankfully you're not in charge.

I'm very willing to admit that the majority of Americans disagree with me, and I know that my opinion is nowhere near mainstream.

But, if you knew me, you would know that I have lead a really unique life, been many places, and done many things, and that my opinion isn't just being pulled out of my butt. As someone who had a nearly-impossible dream, and was able to achieve it, I want for all of humanity to have the freedom to live life in the way they see it best for them, and if that is going to America, I don't want to stand in their way -- I want to welcome them with open arms.

I see no difference between Americans and non-Americans, and I respect all of their wishes equally.

Edited April 20, 2013 by duraaraa

[SaharaSunset 165]

No... I'm thinking worldwide, and I'd welcome anyone from any country into the U.S. Visa overstayers, non-inspected Latin Americans, anyone who wants to come, or wants to stay, I think, should be able to, provided they are not dangerous.

Yeah but what about people who couldn't slip across the border? How do you propose to make it fair and equal for all? You suggesting we foot the bill for their plane ticket? And you say everyone should be welcome, but you also readily admit they rarely find the "dream jobs" they think they'll find. So just what will all the millions of uneducated, non-English speaking, unskilled people do? Because they're legal, they will surely tap into the welfare system....and then you, and me and all the taxpayers, will be footing the bill (at a much much higher rate to be sure) for "everyone" who want to, to live in America...but can't actually find work....

Edited April 20, 2013 by SaharaSunset

[BaBamSam 239]

I'm very willing to admit that the majority of Americans disagree with me, and I know that my opinion is nowhere near mainstream.

But, if you knew me, you would know that I have lead a really unique life, been many places, and done many things, and that my opinion isn't just being pulled out of my butt. As someone who had a nearly-impossible dream, and was able to achieve it, I want for all of humanity to have the freedom to live life in the way they see it best for them, and if that is going to America, I don't want to stand in their way -- I want to welcome them with open arms.

I see no difference between Americans and non-Americans, and I respect all of their wishes equally.

I respect your opinion because it comes from a genuine concern for humanity on a whole. I disagree with entirely open borders as that would lead to economical and political problems (not to mention, safety issues), and we would need some way to regulate everything. But the system is set up right now to not let people in. As we all know, getting a visa is difficult in this country - more so than just about any other (and we don't have the best welfare/state systems in the world, actually). I just can't understand how some others can't understand the very human problem of immigration -legal and illegal - and address it focusing on humanity within and beyond our borders. Instead we criminalize it as if these people are all dangerous killers.

[Merrytooth 5,748]

I'm very willing to admit that the majority of Americans disagree with me, and I know that my opinion is nowhere near mainstream.

But, if you knew me, you would know that I have lead a really unique life, been many places, and done many things, and that my opinion isn't just being pulled out of my butt. As someone who had a nearly-impossible dream, and was able to achieve it, I want for all of humanity to have the freedom to live life in the way they see it best for them, and if that is going to America, I don't want to stand in their way -- I want to welcome them with open arms.

I see no difference between Americans and non-Americans, and I respect all of their wishes equally.

Will only happen in your la la land.

[duraaraa 203]

Yeah but what about people who couldn't slip across the border? How do you propose to make it fair and equal for all? You suggesting we foot the bill for their plane ticket? And you say everyone should be welcome, but you also readily admit they rarely find the "dream jobs" they think they'll find. So just what will all the millions of uneducated, non-English speaking, unskilled people do? Because they're legal, they will surely tap into the welfare system....and then you, and me and all the taxpayers, will be footing the bill (at a much much higher rate to be sure) for "everyone" who want to, to live in America...but can't actually find work....

They would have to find their own way into the country, of course. If someone is motivated to get the money for a plane ticket, they can find a way.

Your other points regarding the welfare system do pose a challenge, and I would need a lot more time and dedication to figure out a solution to that. I'd be tempted to say that welfare shouldn't cover them unless they established that they are not a leech by holding a job, etc. The influx of immigration we would get would lead to larger non-English-speaking communities, in which non-English-speaking jobs could be found. Actually, I never use English at work, we only use Japanese, because we cater to the Japanese community.

I know that in Cambodia, it's possible to just buy a visa to live and work there. Basically, anyone who wants to move to Cambodia, can. Although Cambodia has many problems and is not an ideal place to live for many people, I do see a lot of beauty in the fact that if I couldn't get a Mongolian visa and my fiancee couldn't get an American visa, there's always Cambodia.

Will only happen in your la la land.

Yes. It will only happen in la la land. I am entirely sure it won't happen in reality. It's just my opinion that it should.

I respect your opinion because it comes from a genuine concern for humanity on a whole. I disagree with entirely open borders as that would lead to economical and political problems (not to mention, safety issues), and we would need some way to regulate everything. But the system is set up right now to not let people in. As we all know, getting a visa is difficult in this country - more so than just about any other (and we don't have the best welfare/state systems in the world, actually). I just can't understand how some others can't understand the very human problem of immigration -legal and illegal - and address it focusing on humanity within and beyond our borders. Instead we criminalize it as if these people are all dangerous killers.

I don't think that the economical and political problems that it would lead to would be permanent. I think that in the short term, it would absolutely be hard. In the long term, though, I think people would be happier as a whole. It could be said that the more problems America has economically, the fewer people would even want to move there. As I said, though, I'm sure it will not happen, at least in my life time.

Edited April 20, 2013 by duraaraa

[decocker 7,198]

As I said, though, I'm sure it will not happen, at least in my life time.

you got my vote

[spookyturtle 9,466]

I'm very willing to admit that the majority of Americans disagree with me, and I know that my opinion is nowhere near mainstream.

But, if you knew me, you would know that I have lead a really unique life, been many places, and done many things, and that my opinion isn't just being pulled out of my butt. As someone who had a nearly-impossible dream, and was able to achieve it, I want for all of humanity to have the freedom to live life in the way they see it best for them, and if that is going to America, I don't want to stand in their way -- I want to welcome them with open arms.

I see no difference between Americans and non-Americans, and I respect all of their wishes equally.

And how long do you think anyone would be able to make that dream come true in America if there was an open border policy? There'd be 600 million people here in a year and the infrastructure would never keep up. And USCIS can't process anything efficiently now, let alone with a 100 million new applications overnight. No way it will ever work, IMO.

you got my vote

It figures.