Stop Amnesty

[Karee 4,190]

I know that in Cambodia, it's possible to just buy a visa to live and work there. Basically, anyone who wants to move to Cambodia, can. Although Cambodia has many problems and is not an ideal place to live for many people, I do see a lot of beauty in the fact that if I couldn't get a Mongolian visa and my fiancee couldn't get an American visa, there's always Cambodia.

I don't know too much about Cambodia, but I do know quite a bit about Thailand and their visa policies. Although the U.S. process to immigrate legally is broken in my mind, it still is pretty liberal as opposed to most other countries.

In Thailand you can get a 1 year renewable multiple entry visa based on marriage. You can't work, you can't own land, you have to report in person every 90 days etc. etc. You can get permanent residency, but you have to live there for at least 3 years and jump through some pretty big hoops. Thai citizenship? Near impossible.

I suspect that Cambodian visa you speak of has nowhere near the benefits of U.S. permanent residency. In the U.S. you can apply for citizenship after being a permanent resident for 2 years and 9 months based on marriage/family. 4 years 9 months for all other permanent residents.

You should probably do a little research on that Cambodian visa. I bet it's not as good as it looks on the surface.

[Darnell 8,478]

Stop Amnesty

The immigration bill will give amnesty and citizenship to illegal aliens who have already been deported from the US.

Agree ! Stop amnesty ! did you catch c-span Friday ? 3 hours of stuff and testimony - I smell the 'research' was tainted.

[Darnell 8,478]

If their only crime is migrating to the U.S. to look for work, I don't think of them as criminals.

Your POV will vary, when compared to others with an opposite view. Bear that in mind when the convo gets heated, aye?

They didn't 'migrate' at all - fwiw - they entered illegally, without inspection, and were searching for illegal work at wages much less than minimum wage in the USA.

It's a huge problem, and the gang of 8 don't have the fix, alas. They have something that will get them re-elected, but that's about it.

[Darnell 8,478]

Well we didn't listen to them then, why should we start now?

But really, if the only crime is people trying to come here for a better future for themselves and their children - how are we demonizing them for that when our ancestors all came here for the same reason? Is it more complicated than "just clear them", well, duh. We have taxes, security, etc. to consider, but what else, as a human society, should we do? Send these people back to war-torn or violent countries where they can't even drink the water? When you have thousands of people risking lives and limbs to jump on trains crossing the border, you have to acknowledge the desperation and good intent of these people. They aren't trying to con us out of our jobs or our homes - they sacrifice everything to come here, to work jobs we won't consider taking, to live in dangerous or poor neighborhoods, to sacrifice all of their workers' rights and legal protections to try and make things better.

Is it frustrating to consider amnesty when we are going through the costly and extensive legal process? Of course it is. Selfishly, I am annoyed. But my fiance and I can afford to go through the process and I am not fearing for his safety or his future while we wait. I bemoan the separation, but how can I compare our situation to the people who risk everything and give up their human rights for a shot at opportunity?

That's an interesting POV ! I'd love to extend your POV, just a bit.

So there's these masses of folk in the USA, illegal, and 'just want something better for their families'.

Great. Let's round them all up, per country of origin, give them small-arms combat training, and tonnes of weapons, and drop them off back in the trouble spots in their countries.

Then, and only then, can they reclaim their lives, back in their own countries. Quite happy to give them guns and training and ammo and transport back.

The hell with laws! Let's abandon all of them! Make crime pay!! Let's really bust everyone's balls who immigrates legally!! ANY person who has gone through the process legally should be appalled at amnesty. You know who you are. Shame on you.

Hi Spookies ! Here I was, having a Satire-Free-Saturday.

I'm going through this process (got my NOA2 just last week), and it makes me want for immigration to be easier..

At some point, you might want to learn to differentiate between 'illegal aliens' and 'immigration'.

I wish you some luck, with that.

[Darnell 8,478]

Why not incentivize getting un- and under-employed Americans to work the jobs, rather than perpetuating the exploitation of illegal immigrant labour?

It already is incentive-ized. Alas, for any business owner to get the incentive, one has to fill out paper.

Lame-f(cks, IMO.

when i hear people complaining about the fact that they went through the process the correct way and 'demand a refund' i think = bitter whiners.

we did things the right way and we have the security of that fact. others do not. doesn't mean they shouldn't have a path to citizenship. anyone here knows the paths to citizenship are very, very, limited.

Alas, we disagree, on that one point. Probably others, as well.

[Darnell 8,478]

So sad that the pursuit of power gets in the way of sanity.

Ain't that the truth ? I say flush em all this upcoming week, get in a new crop of Congressman, let them fluster for a while whilst they figure out the new power structure they just walked into, from the newly destroyed power vacuum.

[Darnell 8,478]

When I was 15 I broke the law by staying outside after 10:00pm, our town's curfew for anyone under age 16. I also drank underage in college. How badly have I damaged my moral character? Next thing you know I'll be dealing drugs to the local children.

And did you go to school? Cheating was as rampant as the hormones in most I've seen or heard of.

Everyone's advance into the realm of moral decay occurs at different speeds. Thanks for mentioning yours.

[Darnell 8,478]

These workers play an integral role in the economy and likely will not go away. Many of them if legal would leave for jobs that pay legal wages and provide benefits, creating openings for other illegal workers. Legalization of the work force is not likely to have a significant impact on the tax base.

Alas, you're missing out the big labor force of teenagers and young adults.

Used to be, we'd work in the industries for the summer or a long semester (not as any intern) and do a good job !

pull the illegals out of play, put USCitizens back to work, and things will refactor, rebalance, once again.

[Darnell 8,478]

No... I'm thinking worldwide, and I'd welcome anyone from any country into the U.S. Visa overstayers, non-inspected Latin Americans, anyone who wants to come, or wants to stay, I think, should be able to, provided they are not dangerous.

Cool ! You and I disagree, on this very basic point.

[duraaraa 203]

Oh no, this pure idealistic vision I've had of you has been shattered. A new car? Really?

Even with money to afford a new car, I still cannot bring myself to buy one ... just a newer clunker than the older clunkers I used to own.

I have a fiancee and four kids coming to live with me in the U.S. The last thing I can afford to deal with is car troubles without a warranty... I experienced that in Mongolia, and ended up going through about six cars in a year... it was miserable.

Cool ! You and I disagree, on this very basic point.

I've never met anyone who agrees with me on this point, really. I'm not trying to recruit people to my point of view or anything, and I understand the points of views of others... just wanted to put my own honest view out there.

Edited April 20, 2013 by duraaraa

[Darnell 8,478]

Not all Mexicans can just "walk across the border." Mexico's a fairly large country, you know? I can definitely see how those from Southern and Central Mexico could spend a good chunk of money just getting to a border crossing.

I teach Adult ESL classes and there's a guy who has been here for 25 years. He's spent more of my life in the US than he has in Mexico. He's never been back to Mexico. His parents died without him being there. He works full-time and has a family but attends every English class he can. How could I say someone like that doesn't deserve citizenship?

It's easy. Check his papers, call ICE.

That's the thing... I wouldn't mind if the U.S. became a less-developed country if the tradeoff is true openness to anyone to come live here. That is where everyone disagrees with me, because they want to protect their own quality of life. I can find happiness in Afghanistan, without a problem.

it really smells like the American Way of Life isn't for you anymore, and it really smells best for you to give up your citizenship, after you finish emigrating to your country of choice.

That's the way it smells, reads, so far.

I think that is the idea America was founded on. People who didn't like where they were living could move to the U.S. and experience more freedom.

That was 2 centuries ago. It's not the same this century and half of the last. When you want to keep 'this idea' from 200+ years ago, people will start to question your reliability of remaining 'mainstreamed' in the USA, and most likely will help you to leave.

Just saying.

Go feel sorry for the illegals as they are mooching off your taxes while our own should be taken care of first.

Oh, I don't feel sorry for them, O Eric. You bet yer sweet bippy !

[Darnell 8,478]

Alas, their plight is brushed under the rug because we all know full well, were it not for the new focus on "the Latin American" vote, most Americans wouldn't care three straws about immigration reform. So, heart-wrenching stories aside, "amnesty" only applies to some, and I frankly think that's not okay. Nor do I think certain people "deserve" citizenship more than others.

Aiya.

Why is the 'Latin American vote' even pertinent?

Well, lots of USCitizens have married illegal aliens from Mexico and all points south, but - that was the plan, all along.

[Darnell 8,478]

I very much admire those people for their dynamism.

That was 150 years ago, and that dynamic doesn't exist anymore.

I challenge you to let it go, either quickly or after a long term of inner reflection.

[Darnell 8,478]

Without resources to pay the 600 million, what motivates them to move to the U.S. in the first place?

Great question !! Yet it keeps happening, to the tune of 11 million illegal aliens currently in-country.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

Great question !! Yet it keeps happening, to the tune of 11 million illegal aliens currently in-country.

Do you like lettuce? Do you drink wine? How about apples? All three of those crops really on seasonal workers, many of whom sneak across the border every spring, and usually return back south of the border every fall.