Brutality in Saudi

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

Oh dear lord , I have never personally attacked you and I don't even know what a Mena flag is. I told you quote the post in this thread in which I attacked you or Islam as a whole.. Did not happen.

You still refuse to address two very simple questions.. What is the basis for all law in Saudi. and do you think women in Saudi are oppressed. it's not hate, I am not lashing out against all of Islam.

I really don't understand why you continue to engage me then act like a spoiled child when the debate does not go your way with threats of "I will report you, last warning". Of course when you do, at the very hint of anti-Muslim they come flying . That must give you comfort that you can use the mods to shut down dissent. Only you can't because I don't care if I get banned for simply presenting my side of an argument. thousands of other board love IP traffic.

Once again show me the post in this thread in which attacked all of Islam. You can't do it.. You suggested I start my own Saudi thread an dstay out of yours. I did as you suggested and you could not help but jumping in to rebuke the facts I posted.

If you don't like what I have to say don't open my threads. If you don't like criticism don't dish it out. simple.

I've already given you examples of some of the personal attacks you've made. And I will report you for making any further personal attacks as well, and (as I warned you) if keep making claims that I said things I never said. I just got sick of it, Nature - it's out of order, it derails the thread, and it doesn't add anything at all to the discussion. It's just clutter.

"Act like a spoiled child" is yet another one. You don't like it when people disagree with you, especially if they are female, I get that.

And don't exalt yourself about how much "web traffic" you're supposedly bringing in. Your threads have come nowhere near the top threads on this site (and I ain't talkin' about the game forum - I'm talking about P&R.)

Your questions have been answered repeatedly. But you don't like the answers you get, so you ignore them. Why should I keep answering the same fricken question over and over and over for your entertainment, when you don't even answer a question the first time you're asked ? I'm not your puppet.

I quote you each and every time I respond to you, and I specifically respond to what you've stated in that quote. If you can't even keep track of your own conversations, that's not my problem.

Now, I suggest you get on topic in your own thread, if you don't want it closed, and try to back up your claims with something credible rather than Islamophobia dot com.

Edited April 13, 2013 by wife_of_mahmoud

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

I've already given you examples of some of the personal attacks you've made. And I will report you for making any further personal attacks as well, and (as I warned you) if keep making claims that I said things I never said. I just got sick of it, Nature - it's out of order, it derails the thread, and it doesn't add anything at all to the discussion. It's just clutter.

"Act like a spoiled child" is yet another one. You don't like it when people disagree with you, especially if they are female, I get that.

And don't exalt yourself about how much "web traffic" you're supposedly bringing in. Your threads have come nowhere near the top threads on this site (and I ain't talkin' about the game forum - I'm talking about P&R.)

Your questions have been answered repeatedly. But you don't like the answers you get, so you ignore them. Why should I keep answering the same fricken question over and over and over for your entertainment, when you don't even answer a question the first time you're asked ? I'm not your puppet.

I quote you each and every time I respond to you, and I specifically respond to what you've stated in that quote. If you can't even keep track of your own conversations, that's not my problem.

Now, I suggest you get on topic in your own thread, if you don't want it closed, and try to back up your claims with something credible rather than Islamophobia dot com.

Your funny. You have yet to answer my question and now you are threatening and warning me that you will report me for derailing my own thread. You are going to report me for what ??? Now you are threating to have my thread closed... Is it that automatic? that you just snap your fingers and the mods close the thread..Actually sadly and amazingly from what I see here that would not surprise me.

Please remind me what it is you are reporting again. because i disagree with you.? Because you keep pounding away in a thread I started.

Are you mad because you suggested i start my own thread and I did .

once again what post in this thread did i slander all Muslims ??? You still have not told me.

You still have not answered you think women i Saudi are oppressed. ?

If you don't like criticism don't step in the arena.

P.S. I have no problem with women. I think the whole thread has been loosely about the oppression of woman in Saudi.

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

Your funny. You have yet to answer my question and now you are threatening and warning me that you will report me for derailing my own thread. You are going to report me for what ??? Now you are threating to have my thread closed... Is it that automatic? that you just snap your fingers and the mods close the thread..Actually sadly and amazingly from what I see here that would not surprise me.

Please remind me what it is you are reporting again. because i disagree with you.? Because you keep pounding away in a thread I started.

Are you mad because you suggested i start my own thread and I did .

once again what post in this thread did i slander all Muslims ??? You still have not told me.

You still have not answered you think women i Saudi are oppressed. ?

If you don't like criticism don't step in the arena.

P.S. I have no problem with women. I think the whole thread has been loosely about the oppression of woman in Saudi.

Dude - get back on your topic. Quote me directly if you are going to attribute words to me, and use the quote function. You can also use the search function and find posts I've made about Saudi women, in case you really want to know what I think and what I've said about the subject - 'cause I've posted on this board about it several times. You constantly misquote me or attribute statements to me that I've never said anything even remotely resembling, and then try to use it to advance yet another stupid remark like "If you don't like criticism..." and on and on.

I am certainly not "threatening to have your thread closed" - that's a decision the mods make on their own. I don't like closed threads. And just for your information, I have never ever requested that a thread be closed, nor would I (unless it was something illegal or a blatant violation of VJ rules thing - then I would.)

So back to your topic, dude. Or you might as well just make a thread called "Misquote and attack Wife of Mahmoud" because that's what you're doing.

[himher 634]

Not oppressive? Adult women must have a male guardian, can't drive, can't freely participate in the labor market, have no voice politically. That's not oppressive? Wow.

And yes, I am in charge of my destiny. Who would be if not me?

LOL aren't you deluded. The average Saudi household has a permanent driver. Who drives the ladies around all day. He stays outside with the car as they go from place to place. Every parking lot has dozens of these cars and drivers. They are everywere all the time with cars full of Saudi ladies.

Can't participate in the labor market? We had a baby over there. My wife never saw a male doctor. Never had a male nurse. The teachers aren't male. Our lab techs at work weren't male. Males aren't allowed anymore to work in ladies clothing stores. The person who handled all of our translations and drivers licenses and other government affairs related to living there as a non-Saudi wasn't male. She also spoke like 4 languages. Wonder where she learned all those languages? From being locked in the house all day huh. This could go on and on.

WOW yourself. There are many non-Muslim countries that are led by a monarchy. And no, not all monarchy governments are oppressive. Oppressive in my opinion is all the hoops we have to go through to get a dam asthma inhaler. Over there we just went and bought one.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

LOL aren't you deluded. The average Saudi household has a permanent driver.

And Saudi Arabia is still the only country on the face of this earth that forbids women to drive. It forbids women to do a lot of things. Most things, in fact. It's as oppressive a regime as they come. Believing that it isn't is what's delusional.

As for women's access to career opportunities - females make up only 17% of the labor force in Saudi Arabia. Odd, ain't it? If they are free to pursue careers and if they're all so well educated then what happened? Why are they not out there working, then?

Edited April 13, 2013 by Mr. Big Dog

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

Dude - get back on your topic. Quote me directly if you are going to attribute words to me, and use the quote function. You can also use the search function and find posts I've made about Saudi women, in case you really want to know what I think and what I've said about the subject - 'cause I've posted on this board about it several times. You constantly misquote me or attribute statements to me that I've never said anything even remotely resembling, and then try to use it to advance yet another stupid remark like "If you don't like criticism..." and on and on.

I am certainly not "threatening to have your thread closed" - that's a decision the mods make on their own. I don't like closed threads. And just for your information, I have never ever requested that a thread be closed, nor would I (unless it was something illegal or a blatant violation of VJ rules thing - then I would.)

So back to your topic, dude. Or you might as well just make a thread called "Misquote and attack Wife of Mahmoud" because that's what you're doing.

whatever you just keep going in circles.

[himher 634]

Which Christian government has sponsored death squads in the last century to kill a blasphemer?

Like the genocides in Bosnia?

Name a time that Saudi Arabia sponsored a "death squad" to commit genocide on thousands of people. Then we will discuss the full-time christian ministers currently employed there by our recreation division.

Your words are kind of amusing having been written in a country where the very first ammendment to the constitution was penned to protect the people from the excesses of state christian rule.

Shall we otherwise discuss nearly 2000 years of bloodshed in the name of the church? Start a thread on it and we will play "fun with numbers" as we swim through rivers and oceans of blood. Dare ya.

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

Saudi women are not as submissive as one might think. And they're not all beaten or ordered around like slaves or maids. If you pay attention to Arab news sources (like for instance this al Jazeera report below) you will see that many of them are making protests against laws that discriminate against them, even facing arrest - but they do it in their own way, within their own culture (and, as you will see, often with the full support of their husbands):

Things are changing in Saudi. Of course not at the rate things change in the US - this is a very traditional society, and Saudis like a lot of their traditions. They don't really want to make some kind of total revamping of their culture and society, but they are starting to make more and more adjustments to the modern world. This is inevitable. But they do it in their own way.

[Karee 4,190]

Name a time that Saudi Arabia sponsored a "death squad" to commit genocide on thousands of people.

Easy. The Taliban.

[himher 634]

And Saudi Arabia is still the only country on the face of this earth that forbids women to drive. It forbids women to do a lot of things. Most things, in fact. It's as oppressive a regime as they come. Believing that it isn't is what's delusional.

As for women's access to career opportunities - females make up only 17% of the labor force in Saudi Arabia. Odd, ain't it? If they are free to pursue careers and if they're all so well educated then what happened? Why are they not out there working, then?

It appeared to me that most of 'em don't want to. Would it stun you to know that my own wife doesn't WANT to get out and go to work? WOW ain't it

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

LOL aren't you deluded. The average Saudi household has a permanent driver. Who drives the ladies around all day. He stays outside with the car as they go from place to place. Every parking lot has dozens of these cars and drivers. They are everywere all the time with cars full of Saudi ladies.

Can't participate in the labor market? We had a baby over there. My wife never saw a male doctor. Never had a male nurse. The teachers aren't male. Our lab techs at work weren't male. Males aren't allowed anymore to work in ladies clothing stores. The person who handled all of our translations and drivers licenses and other government affairs related to living there as a non-Saudi wasn't male. She also spoke like 4 languages. Wonder where she learned all those languages? From being locked in the house all day huh. This could go on and on.

WOW yourself. There are many non-Muslim countries that are led by a monarchy. And no, not all monarchy governments are oppressive. Oppressive in my opinion is all the hoops we have to go through to get a dam asthma inhaler. Over there we just went and bought one.

I find it ironic that in a thread telling us how Saudi is not oppressive, you also tell us Men are not allowed to work in women's clothing stores, by law.

[himher 634]

Easy. The Taliban.

Why don't you take a time out and come back after your geography lesson LOL

I find it ironic that in a thread telling us how Saudi is not oppressive, you also tell us Men are not allowed to work in women's clothing stores, by law.

The women did not wish them to. This is a recent thing and a the time (late 2011/early 2012) was a big deal.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

It appeared to me that most of 'em don't want to. Would it stun you to know that my own wife doesn't WANT to get out and go to work? WOW ain't it

Women in the US did not want to vote for a long time either. Blacks didn't care to vote for an even longer time. They liked to sit in the back of the bus, too. And preferred not having to share facilities with white folk. Keep telling yourself all that.

[Karee 4,190]

Why don't you take a time out and come back after your geography lesson LOL

What does financing have to do with Geography. Last I checked money moves across geography and borders. LOL.

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

Saudi women are not as submissive as one might think. And they're not all beaten or ordered around like slaves or maids. If you pay attention to Arab news sources (like for instance this al Jazeera report below) you will see that many of them are making protests against laws that discriminate against them, even facing arrest - but they do it in their own way, within their own culture (and, as you will see, often with the full support of their husbands):

Things are changing in Saudi. Of course not at the rate things change in the US - this is a very traditional society, and Saudis like a lot of their traditions. They don't really want to make some kind of total revamping of their culture and society, but they are starting to make more and more adjustments to the modern world. This is inevitable. But they do it in their own way.

Sounds like a virtual Equal rights paradise for women. here is a good story. Surely you will not find a way to say Human rights watch is a hate site...??

Saudi Arabia: Huge Obstacles for First Woman Lawyer

http://www.hrw.org/n...st-woman-lawyer

By licensing a female lawyer, Saudi Arabia has opened up a key profession to women. But for Saudi women to practice law on anything close to an equal footing with men, they need protection from discrimination against women in the courtroom, freedom to travel and to drive, and the ability to make their own decisions about their work lives. Eric Goldstein, deputy Middle East director (Beirut) – Saudi authorities need to lift the many obstacles facing the first woman to train as a lawyer in Saudi Arabia before she can enter the profession on an equal basis with men. The Justice Ministry on April 8, 2013, licensed Arwa al-Hujaili, a King Abdulaziz University graduate from Jeddah, as a legal trainee, which allows her to practice law and, after a three-year apprenticeship, to become a fully licensed lawyer.

"By licensing a female lawyer, Saudi Arabia has opened up a key profession to women," said Eric Goldstein, deputy Middle East director at Human Rights Watch. "But for Saudi women to practice law on anything close to an equal footing with men, they need protection from discrimination against women in the courtroom, freedom to travel and to drive, and the ability to make their own decisions about their work lives."

Any woman seeking to practice law in the kingdom will have major hurdles to overcome, Human Rights Watch said. Saudi judges have wide discretion to remove a lawyer from a case before them, and nothing would prevent them from using al-Hujaili's gender to do that. Some judges continue to segregate men and women in their courtrooms.

In addition to potential discrimination in the courtroom, female lawyers will also face the severe discrimination that the male guardianship system imposes on all working Saudi women, Human Rights Watch said. This system requires a woman's designated male guardian to approve her decisions to work and travel, among other things. Moreover, women lawyers are not allowed to drive themselves to work since all women remain banned from driving in Saudi Arabia.