Fear of democracy in the Jewish community

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

You know you tend to lump everyone who isn't like you into the same category

I did not lump anybody into anything. All I am saying is that when anybody posts anything that is the least big critical of Islam, she claims we are all Islamaphobes, denounces whatever source as hate filled . Then tries to tell us what a great place countries run by fundamentalist Islamic regimes are for women etc. Then usually reports anyone who dares critize many of the problems associated with " FUNDAMENTAL ISLAM"

However she has no problem slamming the state of Israel at every turn.

Because I am critical of many of the violent and mysgonic practices associated with a large swath of fundamental Islamist does not mean I think all Muslims are bad.

I think a rather large percentage of Pentecostals if given the chance and power, would have us looking just like Saudi or Afghanistan . That does not mean I think all Christians are bad.

I think the Catholic pedophile scandal was widespread and accepted by many of the highest of the church leadership. Does not mean I think all Catholics are bad.

I think many of my ancestors practiced abhorrent racial injustices toward African Americans and even my parents generation maintained severe discriminatory practices. Does not mean I think all white people are racists.

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

I did not lump anybody into anything. All I am saying is that when anybody posts anything that is the least big critical of Islam, she claims we are all Islamaphobes, denounces whatever source as hate filled . Then tries to tell us what a great place countries run by fundamentalist Islamic regimes are for women etc. Then usually reports anyone who dares critize many of the problems associated with " FUNDAMENTAL ISLAM"

However she has no problem slamming the state of Israel at every turn.

Because I am critical of many of the violent and mysgonic practices associated with a large swath of fundamental Islamist does not mean I think all Muslims are bad.

I think a rather large percentage of Pentecostals if given the chance and power, would have us looking just like Saudi or Afghanistan . That does not mean I think all Christians are bad.

I think the Catholic pedophile scandal was widespread and accepted by many of the highest of the church leadership. Does not mean I think all Catholics are bad.

I think many of my ancestors practiced abhorrent racial injustices toward African Americans and even my parents generation maintained severe discriminatory practices. Does not mean I think all white people are racists.

You are failing to grasp the crucial difference between criticizing a political ideology or the policies of a government, and criticizing a religion (or an ethnicity, or a race, etc.)

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

Run is still learning, give him some slack, he's one of the more modest ones when it comes to Islam.

What you do not get is that I detest all ignorant hate filled practices based on stupid 13th century superstitions no matter where they originate. It's just that in some Islamic countries the patients tend to be running the asylum. Thankfully our forefathers were smart enough to keep religious law from dictating our civil laws.

*** Yes i know there is some influence and some examples of it creeping in, I am saying for the most part"--Save yourself some search engine time.

You are failing to grasp the crucial difference between criticizing a political ideology or the policies of a government, and criticizing a religion (or an ethnicity, or a race, etc.)

what kind of law runs the court system in Saudi and what is it based on and dictated by. ?? Thank you end of argument goodnight.

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

What you do not get is that I detest all ignorant hate filled practices based on stupid 13th century superstitions no matter where they originate. It's just that in some Islamic countries the patients tend to be running the asylum. Thankfully our forefathers were smart enough to keep religious law from dictating our civil laws.

*** Yes i know there is some influence and some examples of it creeping in, I am saying for the most part"--Save yourself some search engine time.

what kind of law runs the court system in Saudi and what is it based on and dictated by. ?? Thank you end of argument goodnight.

Your perception that the Saudi court system exemplifies and fulfills Islamic law is your big mistake. So you haven't ended any argument; you've just given yet another example of how little you know about what you keep posting about.

It's the mirror image of people who try to push the idea that Zionism (or even Bolshevism) grew out of some inherent evil quality in the Jewish religion. It's bigotry.

Edited April 11, 2013 by wife_of_mahmoud

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

Your perception that the Saudi court system exemplifies and fulfills Islamic law is your big mistake. So you haven't ended any argument; you've just given yet another example of how little you know about what you keep posting about.

It's the mirror image of people who try to push the idea that Zionism (or even Bolshevism) grew out of some inherent evil quality in the Jewish religion. It's bigotry.

Ok what law is the law in Saudi.. enlighten us ..

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

Ok what law is the law in Saudi.. enlighten us ..

Don't you have Google on your internets ?

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

Don't you have Google on your internets ?

Like I said good night.. end of argument..

Tell me what Law is the Law in Saudi..

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

Don't you have Google on your internets ?

Well, I do, and this it what he is proffering:

Article 45 affirms that religious rulings must be in accordance with the " Holy Qur'an and the Prophet's Sunnah." To this end, a panel of Islamic clergy and research group shall be established.

According to Article 55, the king has to "rule according to the rulings of Islam and shall supervise the application of Shari'ah." Article 56 states that the king is the prime minister as well. Article 57 makes it clear that the king's cabinet and other lower-ranking officials must follow Islam. Those who deviate from this can be dismissed or punished.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basic_Law_of_Saudi_Arabia

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

Well, I do, and this it what he is proffering:

Sofiyya can give a much more professional and detailed run-down of precisely where Saudi's legal system does not meet the standards of Islam. But it does not represent the consensus of the vast majority of Islamic scholars. As even Wiki notes:

The legal system of Saudi Arabia is exceptional in the world of Islam, in that Muslim countries that retain or adopt Sharia usually determine which parts of the Sharia are enforceable and codify (and thereby modernize) them.[21] In Saudi Arabia, the state regards uncodified Sharia in its entirety as the law of the land and does not interfere with it.[21] It is, therefore, unique not only when compared to Western systems, but also in comparison to other Muslim countries, and is said to be the closest system in the modern world to the form of Sharia adopted at the advent of Islam.[2

So it's not the standard that the majority of Islamic scholars or countries support. In fact, it is a fringe element.

The selection of Saudia Arabia as the poster child of what Islam "really means" is kind of like trying to claim that ultra-Orthodox Jews who insist on practicing metzitzah b'peh, among other things, represent the "authentic" followers of Judaism, and that their views are mainstream "authentic" Halacha. They're not; they're a fringe element.

[We Keep Receipts 9,238]

I did not lump anybody into anything. All I am saying is that when anybody posts anything that is the least big critical of Islam, she claims we are all Islamaphobes, denounces whatever source as hate filled . Then tries to tell us what a great place countries run by fundamentalist Islamic regimes are for women etc. Then usually reports anyone who dares critize many of the problems associated with " FUNDAMENTAL ISLAM"

However she has no problem slamming the state of Israel at every turn.

Because I am critical of many of the violent and mysgonic practices associated with a large swath of fundamental Islamist does not mean I think all Muslims are bad.

I think a rather large percentage of Pentecostals if given the chance and power, would have us looking just like Saudi or Afghanistan . That does not mean I think all Christians are bad.

I think the Catholic pedophile scandal was widespread and accepted by many of the highest of the church leadership. Does not mean I think all Catholics are bad.

I think many of my ancestors practiced abhorrent racial injustices toward African Americans and even my parents generation maintained severe discriminatory practices. Does not mean I think all white people are racists.

Well, to be honest, I believe WOM and a few others(myself included) do that because nothing positive is ever posted about Islam outside of the muslims on here. You speak about other religions, but no religon on this site gets the rap that Islam does. It's a no win situation; if one of us posts something about Islam, nothing negative, you have folks running in here trying to debunk it and spread hatred, because nothing good can come from Islam. If it's a deragatory link, it will always turn into a slur fest. And it's the folks that know nothing about the Quran or Islam yelling at the top of their lungs about not submitting or they know what we are.

It's impossible to talk about because no one outside of being a muslim wants to learn about our ways, all they want to hear is the bad stuff so it can feed their fear of Islam.

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

Well, I do, and this it what he is proffering:

I knew.. She knew.. Some people just can't handle the truth.

Sofiyya can give a much more professional and detailed run-down of precisely where Saudi's legal system does not meet the standards of Islam. But it does not represent the consensus of the vast majority of Islamic scholars. As even Wiki notes:

So it's not the standard that the majority of Islamic scholars or countries support. In fact, it is a fringe element.

The selection of Saudia Arabia as the poster child of what Islam "really means" is kind of like trying to claim that ultra-Orthodox Jews who insist on practicing metzitzah b'peh, among other things, represent the "authentic" followers of Judaism, and that their views are mainstream "authentic" Halacha. They're not; they're a fringe element.

I did not say all Islamic countries, I was talking about Saudi. You said I should criticize the politics not the religion . The relgion is the law of the country is it not.

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

Well, to be honest, I believe WOM and a few others(myself included) do that because nothing positive is ever posted about Islam outside of the muslims on here. You speak about other religions, but no religon on this site gets the rap that Islam does. It's a no win situation; if one of us posts something about Islam, nothing negative, you have folks running in here trying to debunk it and spread hatred, because nothing good can come from Islam. If it's a deragatory link, it will always turn into a slur fest. And it's the folks that know nothing about the Quran or Islam yelling at the top of their lungs about not submitting or they know what we are.

It's impossible to talk about because no one outside of being a Muslim wants to learn about our ways, all they want to hear is the bad stuff so it can feed their fear of Islam.

so not true. Christianity catches it here . The difference is that we are not in a complete state of denial about the problems that are inherent in our religion. Isalm has much bigger problem with radical absurd bigoted especially mygonic practices than do many other religions.

When someone like Wife of M continues to try and feed us BS about how good women have it in places like Saudi, Afghanistan, Iran etc. and how some of the problems are just because of a few polotical problems. Well at that point everyone knows it is such a complete pile of malarkey, she really hurts Islam more than she helps it.

You want to gain my respect. be honest and open about the bad,, tell me about the good and convince me by being the practical Muslims that is very outspoken for women's rights, human rights, and absolutely condemn any and all that support terrorism. When someone babbles on about how good women have it under fundamentalist Islamic regimes then I have no interest in trying to have a rational conversation with them.

Notice i keep saying fundamentalist. That does not include all Muslims. I know that. I know not all Muslims are bad.. I get it

Well, to be honest, I believe WOM and a few others(myself included) do that because nothing positive is ever posted about Islam outside of the muslims on here. You speak about other religions, but no religon on this site gets the rap that Islam does. It's a no win situation; if one of us posts something about Islam, nothing negative, you have folks running in here trying to debunk it and spread hatred, because nothing good can come from Islam. If it's a deragatory link, it will always turn into a slur fest. And it's the folks that know nothing about the Quran or Islam yelling at the top of their lungs about not submitting or they know what we are.

It's impossible to talk about because no one outside of being a muslim wants to learn about our ways, all they want to hear is the bad stuff so it can feed their fear of Islam.

as far as Positive things about Muslims. Is anything positive about anything ever posted here.

[decocker 7,198]

so not true. Christianity catches it here . The difference is that we are not in a complete state of denial about the problems that are inherent in our religion.

completely not the difference. "complete state of denial" is not valid description with either group.

basically you're saying that christians as a whole are aware that they have extremists and islam as a whole is unaware of their extremists.

[Sarah Elle-Même 660]

what kind of law runs the court system in Saudi and what is it based on and dictated by. ?? Thank you end of argument goodnight.

Wahhabism. Go look it up on Wikipedia or something. Their interpretation of the Holy Qur'an is whackadoo to many Muslims. Much like we modern Christians find Pentecostals to be whackadoo.

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

I knew.. She knew.. Some people just can't handle the truth.

I did not say all Islamic countries, I was talking about Saudi. You said I should criticize the politics not the religion . The relgion is the law of the country is it not.

You're still not getting it. Go right ahead and criticize Saudia Arabia's legal system or its government policies all you want - I will not have any problem with that - there is much to criticize there.

It's when you start claiming that Saudi Arabia represents Islam, or represents the consensus of the Muslim world - that's when you've crossed the line.