Thai Court Order of Sole Custody in liu of Statement of Consent from biological parent

[Bennett Family 0]

I'm petitioning for my Thai wife and step-daughter (born out of wedlock) from a previous relationship.

My wife and I would very much like to hear from any couples who have successfully obtained an official Thai "Court Order of Sole Custody" for their child since we have not been able to get consent from the biological father.

We went to the court yesterday and my wife spoke with a top official there in great detail (my impression was that the official was very sympathetic and wanted to help if she could) but nonetheless were told that such a court order is non-existent in Thailand and that the certificate of sole custody that my wife already has is the most she can hope to get under the Thai legal system.

We are painfully aware that the certificate is often not accepted by the Embassy officials.

Has anybody ever successfully obtained an actual Court Order? If so, please tell us how. What did you do, where did you go, who did you speak with, what Thai jurisdiction were you in, did you use a lawyer and if so who, etc.?

A step-by-step account would be highly appreciated and most likely of tremendous value to many other couples who are in the same situation, thanks!

David

PS. Please limit this thread to the topic at hand regarding a 'Court Order of Sole Custody' as we could have an entirely different thread about the alternative of getting an affidavit of consent from the biological father (trust me, we're still trying very hard to get in contact with the biological father). We'd appreciate remaining on topic here to help future couples who are running into the same "no-court-order-of-sole-custody-exists-under-Thai-law" roadblock.

[Ning 619]

I'm petitioning for my Thai wife and step-daughter (born out of wedlock) from a previous relationship.

My wife and I would very much like to hear from any couples who have successfully obtained an official Thai "Court Order of Sole Custody" for their child since we have not been able to get consent from the biological father.

We went to the court yesterday and my wife spoke with a top official there in great detail (my impression was that the official was very sympathetic and wanted to help if she could) but nonetheless were told that such a court order is non-existent in Thailand and that the certificate of sole custody that my wife already has is the most she can hope to get under the Thai legal system.

We are painfully aware that the certificate is often not accepted by the Embassy officials.

Has anybody ever successfully obtained an actual Court Order? If so, please tell us how. What did you do, where did you go, who did you speak with, what Thai jurisdiction were you in, did you use a lawyer and if so who, etc.?

A step-by-step account would be highly appreciated and most likely of tremendous value to many other couples who are in the same situation, thanks!

David

PS. Please limit this thread to the topic at hand regarding a 'Court Order of Sole Custody' as we could have an entirely different thread about the alternative of getting an affidavit of consent from the biological father (trust me, we're still trying very hard to get in contact with the biological father). We'd appreciate remaining on topic here to help future couples who are running into the same "no-court-order-of-sole-custody-exists-under-Thai-law" roadblock.

One source could be the embassy or another could be the consulate section.

To make calls directly into the embassy people can buy a special pin number at any Thai post office which allows X amount of calls. Questions must be posed in a general manner rather than about the exact case. Such as " what has the embassy accepted in these cases"? Is there a sample copy of the acceptable court order?

It may be possible for an American citizen to get some info from the consulate section which provides services to Americans only. The consulate is located across the street from the embassy in the high rise building. I would ask for the duty officer or deputy director. They will not comment directly about visa cases. I would ask how to find the correct court for example.

[rascalcat 28]

Not sure if you would find this helpful, but I found this link that mentions some info on this.. http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/346662-how-does-my-gf-get-sole-custody/

[rascalcat 28]

Especially if she has sole responsibility of the child, then there has to be a way around this.

[Ning 619]

Especially if she has sole responsibility of the child, then there has to be a way around this.

I know everyone means well so with respect I caution that this subject has been tested in BKK many times. The embassy will not issue visas unless the parent can prove by Thai court order they have custody or by submitting the proper documents in both languages signed by the absent bio parent. In addition they sometimes insist on the absent parent coming in to be interviewed. These are sometimes difficult requirements to comply with but it must be done.

There are two cases I know of where this couldn't be done and the children remain in Thailand to this day. One couple spent around 10K trying to find a different way.

[Karee 4,190]

I know everyone means well so with respect I caution that this subject has been tested in BKK many times. The embassy will not issue visas unless the parent can prove by Thai court order they have custody or by submitting the proper documents in both languages signed by the absent bio parent. In addition they sometimes insist on the absent parent coming in to be interviewed. These are sometimes difficult requirements to comply with but it must be done.

There are two cases I know of where this couldn't be done and the children remain in Thailand to this day. One couple spent around 10K trying to find a different way.

Also, this is a Thai thing. It really has little to do with the U.S. Embassy or U.S. policies. For some reason Thailand does not like their children leaving permanently, no matter the circumstances. Their adoption policies are also very restrictive.

[rascalcat 28]

That is absurd! What if the mother does not even know where the father is since finding out about the pregnancy of that child, and the biological father wants nothing to to with the situation or to even acknowledge that he has a child out there. There has to be some way of waivering this, as if he is not wanting to be involved in the childs life, then he is not a father. The mother is solely responsible for the child.. this has to account for something. There has to be a way of filling this in court with an attorney. If the father has not been present in the child`s life for a long period of time, then this needs to be addressed in court.

[Bennett Family 0]

Ok, so the main point is there any known example of a couple actually obtaining a bona-fide Thai Court Order satisfying the Embassy requirements?

If so, what were the step-by-step procedures followed?

Edited March 26, 2013 by Bennett Family

[rascalcat 28]

If the biological parent cannot be located or contacted, provide evidence in the form of a Statutory Declaration outlining the details of steps taken to contact the nonmigrating parent, including the biological parents last known address and phone number and their parents last known contact details, if possible, including phone and address. As much information as you can about the biological parent from the last time of contact. A Statutory Declaration could be witnessed by the Embassy.

[Bennett Family 0]

If the biological parent cannot be located or contacted, provide evidence in the form of a Statutory Declaration outlining the details of steps taken to contact the nonmigrating parent, including the biological parents last known address and phone number and their parents last known contact details, if possible, including phone and address. As much information as you can about the biological parent from the last time of contact. A Statutory Declaration could be witnessed by the Embassy.

Yes, we are accumulating all that documentation of course (topic for another thread). This thread, however, is all about obtaining the alternative "Court Order". We hope someone out there can 'prove' that such a court order has been obtained in Thailand and share with us the steps required to get it. Finding the father, and documenting the ordeal along the way, is all fine and dandy, but there is no guarantee he'll be found, and even if found, that he will even cooperate.

[Ning 619]

Yes, we are accumulating all that documentation of course (topic for another thread). This thread, however, is all about obtaining the alternative "Court Order". We hope someone out there can 'prove' that such a court order has been obtained in Thailand and share with us the steps required to get it. Finding the father, and documenting the ordeal along the way, is all fine and dandy, but there is no guarantee he'll be found, and even if found, that he will even cooperate.

There has been at least 3 cases here on V J where the Thai court order was obtained, submitted to the embassy and the visas were issued to the children. I am hoping some of those people will respond here. I am also trying to find that info in my 'content' area of my V J account.

Its possible Karee can shed some light on this as well.

[Ning 619]

Yes, we are accumulating all that documentation of course (topic for another thread). This thread, however, is all about obtaining the alternative "Court Order". We hope someone out there can 'prove' that such a court order has been obtained in Thailand and share with us the steps required to get it. Finding the father, and documenting the ordeal along the way, is all fine and dandy, but there is no guarantee he'll be found, and even if found, that he will even cooperate.

If he isn't found the effort to document what went into the search will be of great value in the explanation to the embassy. In cases I know of where it wasn't done the embassy insisted more effort would be required. They wanted to know exactly what was done. Not one of the people seeking the visa documented the effort.

The difference in this unique case is the fact that the father is a farang. This alone may change the embassies requirement on finding him. This is not as easy as finding a Thai.

[thairath 4]

Didn't Rin & John obtain a court order of sole custody?

[Ning 619]

Also, this is a Thai thing. It really has little to do with the U.S. Embassy or U.S. policies. For some reason Thailand does not like their children leaving permanently, no matter the circumstances. Their adoption policies are also very restrictive.

I respectfully disagree about some of this. It has everything to do with U S policies. This seems to have changed after the situation with the Cuban boy Elian Gonzales in Florida and the attempt to remove the children from Haiti a few years back. Shorty before that my husband & I were successful in getting our daughters visa with none of the requirements we see today.

Didn't Rin & John obtain a court order of sole custody?

I think you are correct and I have sent a P M to them asking for help. They have a lot of good experience and invaluable advise.

[Karee 4,190]

I respectfully disagree about some of this. It has everything to do with U S policies. This seems to have changed after the situation with the Cuban boy Elian Gonzales in Florida and the attempt to remove the children from Haiti a few years back. Shorty before that my husband & I were successful in getting our daughters visa with none of the requirements we see today.

I checked into some of the polices in Thailand regarding adoption of children. It's very restrictive, especially if one of the parents are alive, regardless if they have been in the child's life or not. I guess we might be talking apples and oranges here. For example, if my wife wanted to adopt her niece (her sister had been close to death twice, and now is again.) and I am involved at all in the process, I have to somehow live in Thailand for 2 years with my niece. The father of my niece has never even met her. So finding him wont be easy, and if he is found you can bet he'll have his hand out.

Also, I find it odd that Thailand is one of few countries where you have to get the Thai govt.s approval to get a J-1 waiver if you want to immigrate to the U.S. within 2 years of completing your J-1 stay. But I guess that's another story.

I think you are correct and I have sent a P M to them asking for help. They have a lot of good experience and invaluable advise.

Laugh. I sent him a PM as well.