Planning Ahead to Marry Algerian Man

[chaine1 116]

I don't post much on here, but I just wanted to say you are getting very good advice from the members here.

I'm not married to a MENA man, but I lived in and traveled around the MENA region for 5 years. I would advise you to take things very slowly and first understand the culture before attaching yourself to this man further.

From your posts it sounds like you haven't traveled outside the USA too much? I think staying in Algeria for an extended period of time is a good idea so you can gain perspective regarding the culture.

He once had a long-term (secret) sexual affair with a woman 16 years older than him, which lasted for 3 years. (This makes me think he's more Western-minded)

What wife_of_mahmoud said. Be careful placing too much emphasis on this affair, and try not to look at it from a Western perspective.

He told me that his mother and brother told him that he's 'lost his mind' - and said, "Why would an American woman be interested in YOU?"

A lot of the families I knew would have reacted very differently - voicing displeasure that their son was interested in an older American (non-muslim) woman. Not to say that his family feels that way, but family is a HUGE thing in most MENA families, and the idea of their son marrying a woman who would be unable to give him children would be a deal breaker.

But again, there are always exceptions. Just take your time to give yourself a chance to see if you have found one of these exceptions.

Good luck, and have fun in Algeria!

[Sarah Elle-Même 660]

Hello fellow 'older women' -

I am still in the 'online romance' stage with a man from Algeria, although I plan to fly to Constantine at the end of this year. Even though we haven't met, yet, I'm the type of person who likes to think ahead...especially because I already feel like I'm falling for this one, big time. Ok, so here's the deal; I'm 44, and he's 27.

A little more background:

I am an American atheist. He is, of course, a Muslim. We've talked at great length about religion, and even had a lot of good debates about it, but in the end, we both respect each other's individual choices, and agree to disagree.

I don't know if you are aware, but it is against Islamic law for a Muslim to marry an Atheist. Full stop. Muslim men are allowed to marry outside the faith to Christians and Jews only. If he's religious or practicing at all I have a hard time believing he won't plead with you to convert either to Islam or Christianity/Judaism so you can marry. If he is religious and your lack of religion doesn't seem to bother him, this would be a big red flag that you should not ignore.

He once had a long-term (secret) sexual affair with a woman 16 years older than him, which lasted for 3 years. (This makes me think he's more Western-minded)

As Mithra and WOM said, this just means he found someone to, pardon my language, bang. He didn't marry this older woman probably because he didn't love her and because it's against his culture. Now, it's not unheard of in my fiance's country either for younger men who are called "marios" or "shaggies" to shack up with older rich widows for their money. But they usually try to hide it because their families, neighbors and friends would taunt them mercilessly if they found out. The woman herself would be ashamed and her family would feel dishonored if it became public.

I once had a long-term relationship with a man 10 years younger than me.

I am divorced (for over five years, and the marriage itself lasted less than one year) with no children.

He has never been married and of course has no children.

My fiance doesn't really want children either. It's not culturally normal but it depends on the individual.

He loses a great deal of sleep to stay online and talk with me - faithfully, every night, from 2 to 6 hours each time, nearly from the start.

He works at a court house, and has a degree in Criminal Law, as well as one in Banking (all together 5.5 years of university)...although he told me he is not able to get the position he wants because of 'nepotism' (his English vocabulary is quite advanced - I had to look this word up in the dictionary, hahaha! He is also fluent in French, as well as his native language of Arabic) So, let me ask this to all of you: Even though a significant age difference may appear suspicious and raise a red-flag....wouldn't the fact that he spent 5.5 years working hard to earn degrees in Algerian law and Banking cancel out any suspicion, since that field of study was a choice that could never be used outside of Algeria. So if leaving the country were some big plan he's fostered all along, wouldn't he have chosen something that would be useful in another country, like the medical field?)

Education and even wealth do not cancel out suspicion. Lots of people want to get out of Algeria and other MENA countries for a variety of reasons, not just for better economic opportunities. His country-specific education may not help him much if he moves to the US. Realizing your education isn't worth much in your new country is a very depressing prospect for every immigrant. He will have a difficult time adjusting. The banking degree may help him to get a bookkeeping or accounting job though.

He's tried very hard to convince me that if things continue to develop between us, it would be better for me to move to Constantine, and also describes with great emotion how close he is to his family and friends. He also worries that if he came here, he would face bigotry against Muslims, and would not know how to interact with Americans. He shows no hatred toward Americans, but feels distraught that he will not fit in, and will have difficulty 'taking care of me' in a country he knows nothing about. I am the first American he's spoken to on a personal level.

There is nothing you can do about Islamophobia in the US and there is no getting around it. I can tell you I live in New York City and even in the greatest melting pot city in the country I encounter it often. Most recently in the form of despicable advertising campaigns by Pamela Geller's "organization" on buses and in the subway stations. But hey it's free speech so they have the right to spew ignorant cr*p. My fiance, having lived in the US a few years, doesn't let it bother him because he sees similar ignorance in his country toward westerners. The pendulum, so to speak, swings both ways. As for being head of the household in the US, he should erase any expectations of accomplishing that especially in the first couple years. Getting a good job with benefits takes time even for US citizens.

He told me that he's already mentioned me to his family, and he wants me to meet them right away when I come. He told me that his mother and brother told him that he's 'lost his mind' - and said, "Why would an American woman be interested in YOU?" - and the brother telling him, "Don't trust everything on the stupid internet. It's not real."

On MY end, almost all of my family has died. I remain only in contact with a few cousins, and they have no concern over how I live my life. So no problems or interference here whatsoever. Although my best friend told me the same thing as the Algerian's brother: "Don't trust the internet!" But also tells me that because of the age difference, it is a disaster waiting to happen.

Your friend probably knows you better than anyone and cares for your well being. I don't think you should totally discount what she (or he?) says but you seem like a thoughtful person so I don't imagine you will. I can tell you that if I met my fiance in the same manner you did my family would be staunchly opposed and pose the same concerns. It's only because they have gotten to know him well over the years that they have accepted him into our family. But maybe my family is a tad too protective?

All in all, I am painfully aware of the many obstacles and difficulties that lie ahead...for a plethora of reasons. However, despite it all, I feel we share the same 'spirit.' Our conversations have been broad, deep, serious, playful, and in a very short time, I feel like I've known him for years! And when we spoke on the phone, he sounded closer to my age than myself!

We have both suffered a lot of personal tragedy in our lives; me with all the people who have raised me dead from cancer (and having to take care of them as they slowly died, one by one over the years) and him with watching his brother (only one year older than him) die before his eyes in a major earthquake that collapsed the family home on all of them, and left them with nothing. And also, six months before that time, he and the brother who died had to take care of their grandmother while she was dying. We talk about these things, these experiences, and feel an understanding about it that we can't get from others who haven't lived through this type of sorrow.

It may very well be that you've found your kindred spirit in a younger Algerian. Stranger things have certainly happened. I see no harm in pursuing this relationship and seeing where it leads. But taking a step back once in a while to evaluate will be good for both of you. I speak from experience.

As for the rest of your questions posed, WOM and jpaula's answers are spot on.

Spending time in your boyfriend's home country and getting to know him and his family are all good things. But you just have to be a bit careful these days. Foreigners stick out like sore thumbs and the more of a public presence you have, the more likely someone or some people with bad intentions could try something. When I visit my fiance I dress like local women, speak a little Arabic and we don't travel much. I am really opinionated at home, but in Yemen I keep my trap shut around people other than my fiance and his direct relatives because you never know who you might insult. It's a very different way of life but there is a lot to be appreciated. Expect delicious spicy food! Wishing you the best of luck on your journey.

[SaharaSunset 165]

I'm a teacher so I can't help myself, my best advice would be: Do some SERIOUS homework. You mentioned you don't know anything about what's normal in Algeria. So hit the web, or the library, and research the culture of Algeria. Research the history of Algeria. Learn as much as you can about the world of this man you are swept away by.

Is he a practicing Muslim? If he is a practicing Muslim, marrying an atheist is going to be a hard pill for his family to swallow, if they can accept it at all. And even if he is not currently practicing, people often circle back to the faith of their upbringing. Would you really be okay with that? It could potentially become a painful rift in your marriage. Basically just learn as much as you can.

And if he is a practicing Muslim, research the religion and culture of Islam (specifically when it comes to marriage.) I'm not sure how much you know, but If you want to marry this man, I would recommend getting a book and reading up. And talk to people, not just him (there are lots of people here you could talk to). Keep in mind, the version of Islam you may be interpreting from your "religious debates" with this guy, is most likely VERY tempered...even if it doesn't feel like it. Meaning - don't make the mistake of thinking you understand Islam because of how you interpret what he's said, he may not want to overwhelm you. And by the way, the only reason I'm mentioning this stuff is because as an Atheist, you've got to understand that Islam can be a life encompassing religion - and you may not pick that up in your romantic internet chats

Love is a wonderful thing - but marrying someone from another country is so much more than just the romantic cloud nine you're on right now. And that's not to discourage you. I met my husband while traveling in Morocco - it was the most romantic experience of my life...and now 3 years later, he is exactly the man I knew he was that first time I met him. But still, do your homework!

Edited March 26, 2013 by SaharaSunset

[sarsorti 36]

At 44, with a life full of experience, I can tell you that the amount of time you spend trying to know someone before marriage doesn't mean diddley-squat. I dated someone for 8.5 years before we set our wedding date, and caught him cheating on me for the first time (that I know of!) only three weeks before the wedding!! The sad reality is...you NEVER really know what someone is capable of, no matter HOW long you take trying to figure them out.

And statistically in the US couples who date or stay engaged the longest are the one who end up divorced. I knew my husband of 17 years for 10 months before we were married. Now I am a widow for the last 9.5 years and I am 1 year into a relationship with my 22 year younger fiance. Love can happen anytime,anywhere, to anyone. I agree with some here though, ask questions, investigate, be a bit skeptical and take your time. One thing I can pretty much tell you for sure is right now you say 'agree to disagree' about religion, but here is a HUGE reality check for you. If he is a Muslim who truly practices Islam values and traditions(and it sounds like he is) he will expect or believe that you will become a Muslim soon after you are married. It's true they can marry outside their religion but it would be a very hard life for both of you if you continue your life as usual(which will never happen if you plan to stay in Algeria(99.9% Sunni) and he is practicing Islam. You need to do some homework. Another red flag is you are near past child bearing years and he can still have a family. This doesn't mean you cannot be the mother of his children but ask him how he want's to raise his children. I bet the farm he will say as a Muslim. How hard would that be for you to watch your child raised into something you don't believe in? Being raised a Muslim has a lot to do with the man he is today, the man you are in love with, no matter how western minded you think he is. All the best to you in your journey.

[sarsorti 36]

Thank you...and please believe me, I do understand the words of caution. In fact, if I fly there and things seem ok, I would stay for several months, to get to know him better. And no, I absolutely do not know a single thing about what is considered 'normal' in Algeria. Can you help me with this? You know what I really wish I could do? I wish I could compare emails with other women who fell for Algerian men....the ones who turned out to be BS, and the ones who turned out to be true - so I can know what to look for.

Z.

Trust your gut and don't compare, just listen and take advice, Do your homework, research US state dept and government websites, I am an American woman too and let me tell you just hopping on a plane and flying there is not as easy as you think. In fact I have NEVER been to Algeria we had to meet in Tunisia(which is now in political unrest) because a visa is required for YOU to enter Algeria and they are very strict. I applied for my visa to visit him in January, I just got it approved 2 days ago and Fed Ex delivered it in my hand yesterday. So now I am for the first time going to his homeland. There are so many steps involved, too many to type here and if you get too many opinions you will just become confused, BTW the visa is only valid for 90 days and you can only stay there for 30 days, and of course you must have a valid US passport to obtain a visa. Edited March 27, 2013 by sarsorti

[sarsorti 36]

Thank you...and please believe me, I do understand the words of caution. In fact, if I fly there and things seem ok, I would stay for several months, to get to know him better. And no, I absolutely do not know a single thing about what is considered 'normal' in Algeria. Can you help me with this? You know what I really wish I could do? I wish I could compare emails with other women who fell for Algerian men....the ones who turned out to be BS, and the ones who turned out to be true - so I can know what to look for.

Z.

you wont be allowed to stay for several months and it would not be safe for you in an apartment there alone, do you speak Arabic? Work would be hard if possible at all, internet is half -axxed. Even if you could get a place for a month they are expensive they expect an annual pymt no monthly pymt for rent, unfurnished, no appliances. I am sure there may be a hotel but Constantine is 4 hours from the US Embassy in Algiers and you will need lots and lots of extra $.

[sarsorti 36]

Thanks for the heads up on the 'portals' - I'll check it out.

it's not even possible, not on one visa and no muti-entry visas allowed

[American Woman 75 21]

Trust your gut and don't compare, just listen and take advice, Do your homework, research US state dept and government websites, I am an American woman too and let me tell you just hopping on a plane and flying there is not as easy as you think. In fact I have NEVER been to Algeria we had to meet in Tunisia(which is now in political unrest) because a visa is required for YOU to enter Algeria and they are very strict. I applied for my visa to visit him in January, I just got it approved 2 days ago and Fed Ex delivered it in my hand yesterday. So now I am for the first time going to his homeland. There are so many steps involved, too many to type here and if you get too many opinions you will just become confused, BTW the visa is only valid for 90 days and you can only stay there for 30 days, and of course you must have a valid US passport to obtain a visa.

Thank you, Sarsorti....I've read all the different replies you've given me. It's really a lot of good information. Thank you so much! I am, in fact, feeling a little overwhelmed and a bit bummed out at how difficult it would be. I mean, I haven't even met him, yet, but my mind just tends to wander and think farrrrr in advance of all the different ways something can go. And I think, after reading all the replies from everyone on here, even if I do meet him and think he's the best thing in all the world, my god....there are so many obstacles...I don't know if we'd be able to overcome them all.

So far, I see three BIG huge flags in the eyes of immigration. Our difference in age, the reduced chance of having a baby because of my age, and our different views on religion. I feel defeated, already. I mean, even my 'dream' of things working out with him face to face feels like a balloon with a stickpin in it.

And even though this may sound crazy to some - when I talk with him live, I feel more in tune with him, and feel a deeper connection, than I did with either my ex-husband, who I knew for three years, or my ex-boyfriend from my youth, who I dated for 8.5 years. We've even started doing that thing where we say the same words at the same time, predicting each other's answers.

I don't FEEL all these differences when I'm talking with him. I just feel like I'm talking with somebody I've known for all my life, somebody who understands me on a deeper level than almost anyone I've ever known, somebody who lights up my whole day with a playful sense of humor, and somebody who gives my mind an interesting battle by debating politics and religion in the most respectful but candid way possible for these two topics.

This is part of why I don't sense any type of scam at all - because he doesn't just go along with everything I say; he challenges me, and he's not afraid to speak his mind on any subject, even if he knows it'll rile me up! He also answers anything I ask him (about the girls of his past) with very candid details - which sometimes, quite frankly, are even more than I wanted to hear. So I see he's not just trying to butter me up - oh god, no - he has a very strong mind with a lot of deep thoughts, and discusses everything with me no holds barred. He tells me over and over that if I want to know something, just ask...but be careful, he says, because he will give me the real answer, even if it's something he thinks I won't like. And, of course, he asked me to do the same.

Also - can anybody tell me where to go on here to upload my profile picture?? I added a picture...but I have no idea where it went!

[American Woman 75 21]

A positive story! Yea!! Did you also meet online? And can I ask you...with the big age difference, plus the difference in religion, how hard was it to make it through the interview?? I should say...HOW did you make it through the interview? How do you convince total strangers that something is genuine, despite how it looks on paper?

Edited March 29, 2013 by Kathryn41
to remove quoted TOS violating post

[momof1 205]

I love how people have such strong opinions about Algeria and Algerians yet they've never set foot in the country.

[American Woman 75 21]

I am really grateful for EVERYBODY'S input, here. This is really the only place where I can find other women who have any understanding of what I'm experiencing...even though it's still very new for me. Really, I don't yet know how this Algerian man will be, in regards to his religion. It is something I need to talk to him more about. So far, I know that he has lived in a way that is against Islam, having relations with other women, and some other things that are considered totally normal in the Western world. In fact, that makes me like him even more! But, at the same time, he does say that Allah is something big and very real for him. So, in this case, I think I should hear all sides, and get as much information as possible.

Thanks everybody! You are all really good people!!

Edited March 29, 2013 by Kathryn41
to remove quoted TOS violating post

[sarsorti 36]

name='Zoletta' timestamp='1364407788' post='6086314']

Thank you, Sarsorti....I've read all the different replies you've given me. It's really a lot of good information. Thank you so much! I am, in fact, feeling a little overwhelmed and a bit bummed out at how difficult it would be. I mean, I haven't even met him, yet, but my mind just tends to wander and think farrrrr in advance of all the different ways something can go. And I think, after reading all the replies from everyone on here, even if I do meet him and think he's the best thing in all the world, my god....there are so many obstacles...I don't know if we'd be able to overcome them all.

So far, I see three BIG huge flags in the eyes of immigration. Our difference in age, the reduced chance of having a baby because of my age, and our different views on religion. I feel defeated, already. I mean, even my 'dream' of things working out with him face to face feels like a balloon with a stickpin in it.

And even though this may sound crazy to some - when I talk with him live, I feel more in tune with him, and feel a deeper connection, than I did with either my ex-husband, who I knew for three years, or my ex-boyfriend from my youth, who I dated for 8.5 years. We've even started doing that thing where we say the same words at the same time, predicting each other's answers.

I don't FEEL all these differences when I'm talking with him. I just feel like I'm talking with somebody I've known for all my life, somebody who understands me on a deeper level than almost anyone I've ever known, somebody who lights up my whole day with a playful sense of humor, and somebody who gives my mind an interesting battle by debating politics and religion in the most respectful but candid way possible for these two topics.

This is part of why I don't sense any type of scam at all - because he doesn't just go along with everything I say; he challenges me, and he's not afraid to speak his mind on any subject, even if he knows it'll rile me up! He also answers anything I ask him (about the girls of his past) with very candid details - which sometimes, quite frankly, are even more than I wanted to hear. So I see he's not just trying to butter me up - oh god, no - he has a very strong mind with a lot of deep thoughts, and discusses everything with me no holds barred. He tells me over and over that if I want to know something, just ask...but be careful, he says, because he will give me the real answer, even if it's something he thinks I won't like. And, of course, he asked me to do the same.

Also - can anybody tell me where to go on here to upload my profile picture?? I added a picture...but I have no idea where it went!

Any obstacle can be overcome, eventually.

Edited March 29, 2013 by Kathryn41
to correct quoting format

[Sarah Elle-Même 660]

[

Oh I don't know, as someone said before in this thread there are religious people who tend to push back or pull towards their faith at different parts of their lives. Just because one's spouse doesn't make such demands early on, it is always a possibility somewhere down the line that he may wake up one day and say to himself he needs to be married to a woman with his same beliefs. It's something inter-religious couples just have to grapple with.

This is not something just affecting Muslims and those married to them. I know an ex-couple, the wife is in my church and the husband used to be. He converted to Judaism and gradually became more and more traditional and Orthodox until she could barely recognize the man she married. He gave her the ultimatum of join his faith or it's over and she refused, so they divorced. Really the same thing can happen to people of the same religion if one is less devout than the other.

No marriage is safe from the spectre of divorce. People change, and sometimes those changes are so great that you can't stand to stay together. This is a fact of life. It's good to be discerning about who you enter a relationship with and who you choose to marry. Especially if you have children. It's good to take your time, reflect honestly, and try your hand at compromising (the foundation of all marriages). But it's possible to go overboard on the cynicism that leads you to never find any happiness. Sometimes well researched risks are worth taking.

Edited March 29, 2013 by Kathryn41
to remove quoted TOS violating post

[sarsorti 36]

I love how people have such strong opinions about Algeria and Algerians yet they've never set foot in the country.

I am on my way, when I get back I will be sure to report if my opinions were way off base.

[momof1 205]

I am on my way, when I get back I will be sure to report if my opinions were way off base.

Please walk around BabelOued or El harrach and then go to Babezzouar mall. Compare those people. Go to Le Grande Poste and then go to club les pins at the Sheraton or any other public beach near Algiers. Compare those people. Algerians are diverse religiously..even though most may identify as being muslim but not everyone is practicing. If you go out at night with your fiancé(which I don't recommend) you will see crack heads all over public spaces...Le Grande Poste or Rue Larbi Ben Mhidi. You'll find a thriving alcohol shop on the backside of many shopping strips. My husband is religious. HIs family is culturally conservative but not necessarily religious. You're learning what your fiance tells you from what he knows. Algerians are very diverse and don't fit one stereotype. And if you think you know anything from reading dept of state warnings then you're wrong.