Planning Ahead to Marry Algerian Man

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

At 44, with a life full of experience, I can tell you that the amount of time you spend trying to know someone before marriage doesn't mean diddley-squat. I dated someone for 8.5 years before we set our wedding date, and caught him cheating on me for the first time (that I know of!) only three weeks before the wedding!! The sad reality is...you NEVER really know what someone is capable of, no matter HOW long you take trying to figure them out.

We all do the best we can with the experience that we have, and of course nothing in life is guaranteed. No one can read what is in another person's mind.

But that doesn't mean you shouldn't be careful, take your time, and learn more about what you're getting into, including considering the experiences of other women who went through what you're going through and planning to go through. 2 months isn't a very long time to get to know someone, even if you had spent it together in real life with a man from your own culture here in the US. Do you have any experience with MENA culture, or with Algeria ? Are you Muslim ? Do you know how to recognize what is considered appropriate or "normal" in Algeria, and what is considered inappropriate or "not normal" ?

I realize that you feel like you've met the man of your dreams and we're all raining on your parade. It's a pretty common reaction. But the advice is sincere and comes from years of experience, not only with our own relationships with a spouse from MENA, but with other actual women on this board who did what you are doing. What we're saying is not meant to insult you or your intelligence in any way, or to conclude that your guy must be a fraud. Some significantly older women-younger man couples manage to succeed. Even some involving MENA men. But they are very few and far between. Read some of the threads here - both the success stories as well as some of the horror stories. You may find helpful information on the specific factors that often affect these couples, as well as some of the red flags that you might not notice, but should not be ignored.

I wish you the best !

[American Woman 75 21]

We all do the best we can with the experience that we have, and of course nothing in life is guaranteed. No one can read what is in another person's mind.

But that doesn't mean you shouldn't be careful, take your time, and learn more about what you're getting into, including considering the experiences of other women who went through what you're going through and planning to go through. 2 months isn't a very long time to get to know someone, even if you had spent it together in real life with a man from your own culture here in the US. Do you have any experience with MENA culture, or with Algeria ? Are you Muslim ? Do you know how to recognize what is considered appropriate or "normal" in Algeria, and what is considered inappropriate or "not normal" ?

I realize that you feel like you've met the man of your dreams and we're all raining on your parade. It's a pretty common reaction. But the advice is sincere and comes from years of experience, not only with our own relationships with a spouse from MENA, but with other actual women on this board who did what you are doing. What we're saying is not meant to insult you or your intelligence in any way, or to conclude that your guy must be a fraud. Some significantly older women-younger man couples manage to succeed. Even some involving MENA men. But they are very few and far between. Read some of the threads here - both the success stories as well as some of the horror stories. You may find helpful information on the specific factors that often affect these couples, as well as some of the red flags that you might not notice, but should not be ignored.

I wish you the best !

Thank you...and please believe me, I do understand the words of caution. In fact, if I fly there and things seem ok, I would stay for several months, to get to know him better. And no, I absolutely do not know a single thing about what is considered 'normal' in Algeria. Can you help me with this? You know what I really wish I could do? I wish I could compare emails with other women who fell for Algerian men....the ones who turned out to be BS, and the ones who turned out to be true - so I can know what to look for.

Z.

[Mithra 1,185]

Yes, we've been married for over 7 years and he's been in the states almost 6 years (May 2nd will be 6 years). Biggest things for him to adjust to was mostly due to employment. Not finding work easily and then not making all that much money and therefore, not being the "head of the household" like he wanted to be. We could live on his income alone now which he would prefer but we'd have to really cut corners and I don't like cutting corners lol. It took years for him to find a decent job paying a wage that he was satisfied with.

Are you both still together now, living here in the US? Can I ask you...what were the biggest things for him to adjust to? And what type of work was he able to get?

[Mithra 1,185]

Take everything you hear about Algerians/MENA people, in general, with a grain of salt. There will be women who have been scorned who will say the most outrageous things and there will be scorned women who will be honest. There will be women in "good" marriages who will make their marriages sound heaven sent and maybe that won't be entirely true and there will be women in good marriages who will be honest. MENA culture is different for sure. Some guys will come here and fit right in and others will struggle with culture shock forever.

Just because you're in your 40s doesn't mean you have to rush into a marriage to lock things down. Go there and stay awhile and see. If things are cool, get married. If not, don't. Nothing will be lost. Be very aware of little signs that maybe things will be difficult. I'm not even saying signs of him being scammy. I mean signs of maybe he'll be lazy or maybe he'll be domineering. Stuff like that. Look and listen carefully. There were so many signs that I ignored when I look back on it all. I love my husband and he's a good guy but things weren't always so great when he first got here. He's lazy and I saw that in Egypt but I ignored it. It's better now but for years we had issues because of it. He can be domineering or at least try to be. There were hints of that in Egypt that I overlooked. We had issues in the beginning with that coupled with insecurities and lack of self confidence due to not finding work easily and not being able to do things on his own in the beginning. Ugh that insecurity ####### is the worst.

Thank you...and please believe me, I do understand the words of caution. In fact, if I fly there and things seem ok, I would stay for several months, to get to know him better. And no, I absolutely do not know a single thing about what is considered 'normal' in Algeria. Can you help me with this? You know what I really wish I could do? I wish I could compare emails with other women who fell for Algerian men....the ones who turned out to be BS, and the ones who turned out to be true - so I can know what to look for.

Z.

Edited March 25, 2013 by Mithra

[milimelo 4,481]

Some more background info on OP here: http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/244119-25-year-age-differenceolder-women-marrying-younger-men/page__view__findpost__p__6077393

Maybe someone can answer some of her questions.

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

Thank you...and please believe me, I do understand the words of caution. In fact, if I fly there and things seem ok, I would stay for several months, to get to know him better. And no, I absolutely do not know a single thing about what is considered 'normal' in Algeria. Can you help me with this? You know what I really wish I could do? I wish I could compare emails with other women who fell for Algerian men....the ones who turned out to be BS, and the ones who turned out to be true - so I can know what to look for.

Z.

I think staying there for a few months is an excellent idea.

At the top of every VJ page there is a blue banner - click the button for "Portals." There, you can see a list of all the members processing through Algeria, and you can search their posts.

[Mithra 1,185]

Interesting. Yeah having a sexual relationship with an older woman doesn't mean he's Western thinking nor does it mean he prefers older women. It means he likes sex (totally normal) and had to find a non-virgin to do it with.

Some more background info on OP here: http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/244119-25-year-age-differenceolder-women-marrying-younger-men/page__view__findpost__p__6077393

Maybe someone can answer some of her questions.

[American Woman 75 21]

Thanks so much for your reply and helpful information. I wonder about a few other things...how long did it take him to be able to have a fluent and easy conversation with other Americans, and also...somebody from Italy told me it took them 4 years to get their green card after marrying a legal US immigrant....and in the meantime, she couldn't work or get a driver's license. That doesn't sound right to me. Was your husband able to get a driver's license and work right away? Also, how long did it take him to make friends...and was he able to find people of his own kind in your city?

Take everything you hear about Algerians/MENA people, in general, with a grain of salt. There will be women who have been scorned who will say the most outrageous things and there will be scorned women who will be honest. There will be women in "good" marriages who will make their marriages sound heaven sent and maybe that won't be entirely true and there will be women in good marriages who will be honest. MENA culture is different for sure. Some guys will come here and fit right in and others will struggle with culture shock forever.

Just because you're in your 40s doesn't mean you have to rush into a marriage to lock things down. Go there and stay awhile and see. If things are cool, get married. If not, don't. Nothing will be lost. Be very aware of little signs that maybe things will be difficult. I'm not even saying signs of him being scammy. I mean signs of maybe he'll be lazy or maybe he'll be domineering. Stuff like that. Look and listen carefully. There were so many signs that I ignored when I look back on it all. I love my husband and he's a good guy but things weren't always so great when he first got here. He's lazy and I saw that in Egypt but I ignored it. It's better now but for years we had issues because of it. He can be domineering or at least try to be. There were hints of that in Egypt that I overlooked. We had issues in the beginning with that coupled with insecurities and lack of self confidence due to not finding work easily and not being able to do things on his own in the beginning. Ugh that insecurity ####### is the worst.

[LaL 418]

Thanks so much for your reply and helpful information. I wonder about a few other things...how long did it take him to be able to have a fluent and easy conversation with other Americans, and also...somebody from Italy told me it took them 4 years to get their green card after marrying a legal US immigrant....and in the meantime, she couldn't work or get a driver's license. That doesn't sound right to me. Was your husband able to get a driver's license and work right away? Also, how long did it take him to make friends...and was he able to find people of his own kind in your city?

Depends on what the status of the "legal US immigrant" was (H1B maybe?) . It's entirely possible. Heck I am a USC and it took nearly 4 years for my husband to get his greencard based on his marriage to me. And as a result some things were a bit more of a hassle (license expired every year, etc). Of course this was back a few years ago now.

[American Woman 75 21]

Thanks for the heads up on the 'portals' - I'll check it out.

I think staying there for a few months is an excellent idea.

At the top of every VJ page there is a blue banner - click the button for "Portals." There, you can see a list of all the members processing through Algeria, and you can search their posts.

[Mithra 1,185]

My husband was fluent in English before I met him. His accent was thicker and people had a harder time understanding him when he first got here but it's gotten a lot better.

We got married in Cairo in January 2006. He got here in May 2007. He got his 10 year greencard in July 2008. Because we waited to apply for his greencard he got his 10 year instead of his 2 year. He came here on a K3 which is obsolete now. When he first got here we applied for his EAD (employment authorization) and he got it about 4 months later. He couldn't work for those 4 months. We waited until we were married for two years to apply for the greencard that is why we applied for the EAD seperately. He got his driver's license in October 2007 so about 5 months after he got here. He could drive but wasn't very good at it so I had to teach him.

He met a few people at a mosque shortly after coming here. He's not in contact with them anymore. He's met people at various jobs. Some he keeps in contact with, some he doesn't. The people he keeps in contact with the most are the ones he knew in Egypt. He has a couple friends who came here on a DV visa after my husband got here. They live in NY. He has mostly work friends, like myself. We're homebodies. We don't go out much unless it's out to dinner with just us or the kids (I have two from a previous and we have one together) or to the movies. We don't really go out with friends. He works a lot so he doesn't have time to go out with friends even if he wanted to.

[American Woman 75 21]

Does that mean he wasn't able to legally work in the US for the first four years??

[/size]

Depends on what the status of the "legal US immigrant" was (H1B maybe?) . It's entirely possible. Heck I am a USC and it took nearly 4 years for my husband to get his greencard based on his marriage to me. And as a result some things were a bit more of a hassle (license expired every year, etc). Of course this was back a few years ago now.

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

OK here are the OP's questions from the other thread:

Hello fellow 'older women' -

I am still in the 'online romance' stage with a man from Algeria, although I plan to fly to Constantine at the end of this year. Even though we haven't met, yet, I'm the type of person who likes to think ahead...especially because I already feel like I'm falling for this one, big time. Ok, so here's the deal; I'm 44, and he's 27.

A little more background:

I am an American atheist. He is, of course, a Muslim. We've talked at great length about religion, and even had a lot of good debates about it, but in the end, we both respect each other's individual choices, and agree to disagree.

He once had a long-term (secret) sexual affair with a woman 16 years older than him, which lasted for 3 years. (This makes me think he's more Western-minded)

I once had a long-term relationship with a man 10 years younger than me.

I am divorced (for over five years, and the marriage itself lasted less than one year) with no children.

He has never been married and of course has no children.

He loses a great deal of sleep to stay online and talk with me - faithfully, every night, from 2 to 6 hours each time, nearly from the start.

He works at a court house, and has a degree in Criminal Law, as well as one in Banking (all together 5.5 years of university)...although he told me he is not able to get the position he wants because of 'nepotism' (his English vocabulary is quite advanced - I had to look this word up in the dictionary, hahaha! He is also fluent in French, as well as his native language of Arabic) So, let me ask this to all of you: Even though a significant age difference may appear suspicious and raise a red-flag....wouldn't the fact that he spent 5.5 years working hard to earn degrees in Algerian law and Banking cancel out any suspicion, since that field of study was a choice that could never be used outside of Algeria. So if leaving the country were some big plan he's fostered all along, wouldn't he have chosen something that would be useful in another country, like the medical field?)

He's tried very hard to convince me that if things continue to develop between us, it would be better for me to move to Constantine, and also describes with great emotion how close he is to his family and friends. He also worries that if he came here, he would face bigotry against Muslims, and would not know how to interact with Americans. He shows no hatred toward Americans, but feels distraught that he will not fit in, and will have difficulty 'taking care of me' in a country he knows nothing about. I am the first American he's spoken to on a personal level.

He told me that he's already mentioned me to his family, and he wants me to meet them right away when I come. He told me that his mother and brother told him that he's 'lost his mind' - and said, "Why would an American woman be interested in YOU?" - and the brother telling him, "Don't trust everything on the stupid internet. It's not real."

On MY end, almost all of my family has died. I remain only in contact with a few cousins, and they have no concern over how I live my life. So no problems or interference here whatsoever. Although my best friend told me the same thing as the Algerian's brother: "Don't trust the internet!" But also tells me that because of the age difference, it is a disaster waiting to happen.

All in all, I am painfully aware of the many obstacles and difficulties that lie ahead...for a plethora of reasons. However, despite it all, I feel we share the same 'spirit.' Our conversations have been broad, deep, serious, playful, and in a very short time, I feel like I've known him for years! And when we spoke on the phone, he sounded closer to my age than myself!

We have both suffered a lot of personal tragedy in our lives; me with all the people who have raised me dead from cancer (and having to take care of them as they slowly died, one by one over the years) and him with watching his brother (only one year older than him) die before his eyes in a major earthquake that collapsed the family home on all of them, and left them with nothing. And also, six months before that time, he and the brother who died had to take care of their grandmother while she was dying. We talk about these things, these experiences, and feel an understanding about it that we can't get from others who haven't lived through this type of sorrow.

Ok, so here's what I want to know from you guys:

1) I want to be prepared ahead of time, in case this really does turn into marriage. So, with this in mind at this early stage, what should I be doing to prepare? I'm already saving all of our Yahoo chats and emails and call logs. Is there anything more I should do?

Good - save all that stuff. Also save any cards and letters sent by actual mail, if applicable. You don't really have anything else at this point.

2) If I married him in Algeria, would this marriage be valid in the US? Or would we have to also get married here?

Yes, if you have a legal marriage in any other country, it is legal here, as long as it does not violate any US law (such as polygamy, etc.)

3) What kind of interview questions would he face...and especially with this big age difference between us?

Consulates are known for asking all kinds of things, but they might focus on this specific topic with questions that may come off as quite rude - why he wants to marry a woman who is technically old enough to be his mother, why he doesn't want to have any children, why he doesn't marry a woman his own age in Algeria, etc. They will probably ask about other things like the religious difference, and what he expects to do in the US.

3) Since he works at one of their court houses, and he's on friendly terms with all the judges there, would they be able to do anything to help the situation? Letters of recommendation, perhaps?

Not really. Affidavits are secondary evidence, and not nearly as persuasive as primary evidence such as your chats and emails, photographs, etc. Since you have a red flag case, it's better to present as much primary evidence as you can.

4) Who are these people who decide our fate? Are they Americans, are they local Algerians? Who does the interview?

The consulate official who will interview your husband (or fiance) will be an American citizen, but they will be very familiar with Algerian customs.

5) If I wanted to spend six months to a year living in Constantine to get to know him, am I allowed to do this? Does it have to be approved by someone?

You will need to get permission for residence from the Algerian government. I'm not sure of the specific requirements, or the timeframe involved, but someone will likely be along soon to explain (maybe Henia ?)

6) How would I access my American Bank Account from Algeria? And if they don't use credit cards over there the way that we do over here...what am I supposed to do, walk around with a year's worth of cash in my pocket? How is this done?

Sorry - I don't know. There may be ATMs available in some of the bigger hotels in the bigger cities. Or you may be able to wire money. Someone with Algeria experience will be able to answer that (or perhaps your guy may know ?)

The rest of your questions are specific to Algeria - need someone with experience there to answer.

7) What can I expect as far as food and personal products over there? If I stay for an extended period of time, I'd like to bring all of my American products with me. Would this be allowed? How is the quality of their food? (Here I buy my meat from Whole Foods - organic)

8) Would I be able to earn money there by helping people to practice their English?

9) How strange would it be for an American woman to live in an apartment alone? And how safe??

10) Please lay it on me, all your advice, the good, bad and ugly. I can take it. But..of course....I prefer to hear the most positive stories!!

Thanks...and That's All, Folks!

Zoletta

[LaL 418]

Does that mean he wasn't able to legally work in the US for the first four years??

No, no, he had an EAD & AP. He could work and travel.

[jpaula 20]

I will try to PM you later with some logistical info. But, quickly, you will need a visa to visit Algeria and as you are not currently married this will mean a tourist visa for now. IF you were to get married there you could then apply for residency but it is a capricious process, sometimes no problem, sometimes takes forever. It would be very odd and, in my opinion, not safe for a woman--any woman--to live in an apartment alone. There are almost no Americans there and your presence will be known immediately. You'll want to be either in a hotel or with his family. There may be a few ATMs by now but there were none when I was there (2005-2007). A few big hotels take credit cards, otherwise all is cash. You will need to bring it with you or have someone send it via Western Union. Black market foreign x rates are much better than bank rates though, so best to bring USD and exchange on the black market as needed. My best advice as first steps: apply for a tourist visa, go visit. I would not recommend a single American woman live in Algeria alone, nor will it be easy to get the papers to do so. Visit. Take some time.

Trying not to step into the relationship side of this, but do know that it is a place many many people, even educated and employed people, want out of. It is a place many many families want their sons out of. It is also pretty fascinating and you should be all mean go visit and learn as much as you can.

Not on here much, but happy to PM on basic Algeria stuff.

PS Food, products etc will not be what you are used to at Whole Foods. Get rid of expectations and comparisons to US life. Totally different. You'll be fine.