Woman in the Infantry?

[BaBamSam 239]

The equation of equality of men and women is an unbalanced equation. I do believe there are things women can do that men can't. Like delivering a baby. There is just not a whole lot of time for that on a battlefield.

Didn't I just write that I was waiting for a guy to point out the baby thing?

I have a question for you, then. If a man and a woman complete training and conditioning, are verifiably equal in their competencies and qualified for their duties, why should the woman not be allowed to serve?

[Iraqvet 68]

Didn't I just write that I was waiting for a guy to point out the baby thing?

I have a question for you, then. If a man and a woman complete training and conditioning, are verifiably equal in their competencies and qualified for their duties, why should the woman not be allowed to serve?

Women are allowed to serve, let's not forget that. Just not in the infantry. A woman may be able to pass a physical test, but no way would women survive and graduate SOI. But like a said before, a woman is not going to carry an 80 pound rucksack for 20 miles while also holding a m-16 and a 50cal barrel. Your desire for equality in the military is commendable but it is also futile. I served in the infantry. You didn't. I was there. You weren't. Women would genetically weaken the US infantry. Not the military. The infantry.

Edited March 8, 2013 by Iraqvet

[BaBamSam 239]

Women are allowed to serve, let's not forget that. Just not in the infantry. A woman may be able to pass a physical test, but no way would women survive and graduate SOI. But like a said before, a woman is not going to carry an 80 pound rucksack for 20 miles while also holding a m-16 and a 50cal barrel. Your desire for equality in the military is commendable but it is also futile. I served in the infantry. You didn't. I was there. You weren't. Women would genetically weaken the US infantry. Not the military. The infantry.

I am just saying that we should allow women the chance to try. What could happen? Best case for you, all women are incapable of meeting the graduation requirements and cannot serve in the military due to failure to meet the competencies requires - and you get to say "I was right, see?!". Worst case for you, some women prove you wrong and are verifiably qualified and serve in the infantry and everyone wins - and you concede that there are some women who can and want to do this tremendously difficult duty.

Right now your argument sounds just so ignorant because you aren't willing to allow for a contest. You are just insisting that women can't and refusing to allow them a chance.

EDIT: Of course, if guys are worried that a woman actually succeeding to graduate and serve in the infantry will lessen the commendable and admirable service he has provided, well, that is a deep sexism that I hope is not an actuality. Since you've been so willing to debate this topic, I would like to assume that this is not the case as you've demonstrated a willingness to listen to other perspectives - which I wholeheartedly appreciate (I've noticed it's rare here).

Edited March 8, 2013 by BaBamSam

[JensJrny2Ray 367]

The equation for equality of men and women is an unbalanced equation. I do believe there are things women can do that men can't. Like delivering a baby. There is just not a whole lot of time for that on a battlefield.

Well see now instead of having a rational argument you're bringing up silly arguments; all that women are good at is having babies and wearing lingerie, and that's what set us apart. You're just being ridiculous at this point.

I don't think there are a lot of women who would want to, or that could handle being side by side with men in combat, but if they are able and want to, then all the more power to them.

[Iraqvet 68]

I am just saying that we should allow women the chance to try. What could happen? Best case for you, all women are incapable of meeting the graduation requirements and cannot serve in the military due to failure to meet the competencies requires - and you get to say "I was right, see?!". Worst case for you, some women prove you wrong and are verifiably qualified and serve in the infantry and everyone wins - and you concede that there are some women who can and want to do this tremendously difficult duty.

Right now your argument sounds just so ignorant because you aren't willing to allow for a contest. You are just insisting that women can't and refusing to allow them a chance.

EDIT: Of course, if guys are worried that a woman actually succeeding to graduate and serve in the infantry will lessen the commendable and admirable service he has provided, well, that is a deep sexism that I hope is not an actuality. Since you've been so willing to debate this topic, I would like to assume that this is not the case as you've demonstrated a willingness to listen to other perspectives - which I wholeheartedly appreciate (I've noticed it's rare here).

Ignorant? No, no it's not ignorance. I have served in the infantry. I have been apart of deployments and served in a forward area in Iraq. So when it comes to the infantry there is no lack of knowing on my part. I say this respectfully. If you served in the military and specifically a combat support unit then your position would likely change. I met many female marines while serving and have asked most of them if they would want to be in the infantry. Their experienced answer was "Hell No". Your argument comes from a safe well guarded home and has never experienced the physically and psychological effect of serving in the infantry. Women have succeeded way before my time. That is not the issue. But women also have not been put on the front lines expected to keep up either. I don't think your argument of equality is ignorant at, but it is when it comes to the infantry because you have never been there. But I welcome your argument. It would penetrate if you served, especially in a forward area in a combat support MOS.

Edited March 8, 2013 by Iraqvet

[Iraqvet 68]

Well see now instead of having a rational argument you're bringing up silly arguments; all that women are good at is having babies and wearing lingerie, and that's what set us apart. You're just being ridiculous at this point.

I don't think there are a lot of women who would want to, or that could handle being side by side with men in combat, but if they are able and want to, then all the more power to them.

Excuse me????? I never said all women are good for is making babies and wearing lingerie. Why don't you read the whole thread first before ridiculously accusing me of saying something that I didn't say.

Edited March 8, 2013 by Iraqvet

[X Factor 1,112]

I am not against women trying out. Just don't water down the standards to accommodate them A woman just tried out for the Jets and failed miserably

[decocker 7,198]

Women are great at many things! Singing, acting, sports, business, love, making sandwichs, helping people.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

I don't think there are a lot of women who would want to, or that could handle being side by side with men in combat, but if they are able and want to, then all the more power to them.

By all means, no problem. And I wouldn't let size be the sole decider. Big targets are easy targets. That clever little girl that moves carefully from cover to cover, will survive a lot longer than that big lummox that thinks he is John Wayne.

Women make good sammichs. Nothing like going home for a box lunch.

[elmcitymaven 9,712]

Women make good sammichs. Nothing like going home for a box lunch.

I love seeing Liechtenstein pastiches repurposed for feminism.

[Iraqvet 68]

By all means, no problem. And I wouldn't let size be the sole decider. Big targets are easy targets. That clever little girl that moves carefully from cover to cover, will survive a lot longer than that big lummox that thinks he is John Wayne.

She would. But what happens when the company has to move to the next town 20 miles down the road?

[decocker 7,198]

She would. But what happens when the company has to move to the next town 20 miles down the road?

they move 20 miles down the road?

[BaBamSam 239]

Ignorant? No, no it's not ignorance. I have served in the infantry. I have been apart of deployments and served in a forward area in Iraq. So when it comes to the infantry there is no lack of knowing on my part. I say this respectfully. If you served in the military and specifically a combat support unit then your position would likely change. I met many female marines while serving and have asked most of them if they would want to be in the infantry. Their experienced answer was "Hell No". Your argument comes from a safe well guarded home and has never experienced the physically and psychological effect of serving in the infantry. Women have succeeded way before my time. That is not the issue. But women also have not been put on the front lines expected to keep up either. I don't think your argument of equality is ignorant at, but it is when it comes to the infantry because you have never been there. But I welcome your argument. It would penetrate if you served, especially in a forward area in a combat support MOS.

I was not calling you ignorant - you have much more experience with the military than I do, but I have much more experience as a woman and growing up facing much gender discrimination. Hence why I am enjoying our debate as it is two different perspectives that are equally relevant to this topic. Hence why it is not a requirement that you have the experience of being a woman, nor I have the experience of being in the infantry or experiencing combat.

I have not faced the impact of serving infantry, and I would not like to. I have dealt with other traumatic events, so my argument is not coming from a purely safe environment. But some women would like the opportunity to serve in the infantry. I know a female Marine who is hungry to do so. I am just not willing to forbid someone who is capable and willing the opportunity to serve as he or she chooses. Again, it is up to the individual to decide his or her goals and desires, and it is the military's and infantry's job to objectively evaluate and ensure that only those who are capable are put there. Gender should not be a prohibiting factor.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

She would. But what happens when the company has to move to the next town 20 miles down the road?

I always caught a ride, myself. The days of the foot soldiers only existed in the minds of the service school cadres, when I was in the service, and that was more than twenty years ago.

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

Ah, you've misunderstood what privilege is. You may have busted your ####### and worked hard your entire life - I do not say anything to the contrary. However, your privilege is that you were born to a sex with a superior gender in today's society. You have never been told that your gender limits what you can do (unless it's have a baby, which I'm sure you'll retort with something similar other than reflecting on this).

Because females are discouraged from playing football even as kids? I was one of three girls in a FLAG football league as a kid. I played two years of contact before I was no longer allowed to play in the league due to being female. So. Look at society for that answer before jumping to the assumption that it is only physical limitations.

I was waiting for someone to tell me I am discredited due to my lack of military experience. Points for you for being the first. I have already admitted my disinterest in military life and careers, and if me admitting that discredits me in your eyes then that is your loss for a healthy debate. But you lack a ####### and I'm sure you've weighed in on everything from abortion rights, to birth control, to gender based affirmative action.

I'm beginning to question your reading comprehension. The average man to become a soldier completes training. Hence they are no longer your average man off the street. As I've said twice now, training and conditioning are necessary for both men and women.

You telling me women in a Infantry squad would not reduce the comabt effectiveness for a host of different reasons, including sexism by the men, would be like me telling Tiger Woods how to play golf.

You are correct I have weighed in on several women's issues. I am pro abortion, Pro Birth Control, and detest affirmative action of any kind. I am all for a woman's control of her own Uterus. It's not place to tell her what to do with it,, or her place to ask me to fund her choices.