Woman in the Infantry?

[N-o-l-a 7,168]

I think the strength of women would surprise you, as your sweeping generalization reflects gender roles and beliefs constructed by society and is not related to actual biology. My personal competencies are not relevant as I neither would like to serve in the military, nor have I done that specific task. I do, however, know women who could do just that and many men who could not.

My husband has never worked out a day in his life and carried about 140 lbs up 3 flights the first time we met without breaking a sweat.

Know many women who can do that?

Men are clearly physically different than women. I don't know who would debate such a thing.

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

Please, do not imply or question my mental ability just for voicing a different opinion and perspective from your own. Thank you.

I am under the belief that the infantry would function best when it was comprised of those who demonstrate that they are sufficiently capable and sufficiently trained regardless of gender. This is not a "make it half and half" thing. This is allow women the opportunity to at least prove themselves.

I think the strength of women would surprise you, as your sweeping generalization reflects gender roles and beliefs constructed by society and is not related to actual biology. My personal competencies are not relevant as I neither would like to serve in the military, nor have I done that specific task. I do, however, know women who could do just that and many men who could not.

EDIT: Also your belief in the lesser effect of women stems from a social norm to perceive women as the lesser gender and sex. Another construct.

Why does a man have to run 2 miles in 15:53 and a female in 18:54 to be admitted to Airborne school. ???? I mean everything is equal right ? If running 2 miles in under 16 miles is important to the mission why do women get 18+. Could it be they are different ?

[BaBamSam 239]

I have served in the Infantry of this great country. I have also served as a commander of a mixed sex combat support unit. . The OP is spot on. Women have no business in the Infantry. As much as we may all want to prretned it would change and everything would be fine it would not. Your average woman is not going to strap on a 60lb ruck with mortor base plate on her back and hump 20 miles thru the FT. Benning bonnies. Are there some that may could.Probably.

Let's face it men and women are different. As much as it may pain some of you libs to admit it. Men and women are not meant to be the same. Women as a rule of thumb can not do everything a man can do and men are not good at strengths that women have. It's fact no matter how much you may not want it to be.

I am not a "lib", but thanks for making assumptions that using that term would be a degradation to my credibility.

You sound like another white cisgender male who has chosen not to recognize his privilege. Apologies if that is not accurate. Women have proven and re-proven that they can do things that men can and men have proven the same in various ways. We still have a very long way to go, obviously, so that people from your perspective recognize that.

Your average woman cannot do that. You're right. Neither can your average man. Neither can do that without proper training and condition, but both can once they receive those.

I am not saying we force-feed women into the infantry, but we offer those who want to join a chance to do so and serve as equals with the men. As you said, some women probably could handle it.

[elmcitymaven 9,712]

Have you received your CABA membership package yet?

It's in the post!

[BaBamSam 239]

Why does a man have to run 2 miles in 15:53 and a female in 18:54 to be admitted to Airborne school. ???? I mean everything is equal right ? If running 2 miles in under 16 miles is important to the mission why do women get 18+. Could it be they are different ?

I have two counter-points to that.

One, that is a reflection of the fact that women and men can be equal but different. This theory argues that women are just as capable as men to do something, but that they have been given permission to attain the equality in a different matter - a reflection on forgiveness for the oppression of the gender.

Two, fine. Change it. I myself can run two miles in well under that and many women can. It is possibly an out-dated reference of measure.

[X Factor 1,112]

I have served in the Infantry of this great country. I have also served as a commander of a mixed sex combat support unit. . The OP is spot on. Women have no business in the Infantry. As much as we may all want to prretned it would change and everything would be fine it would not. Your average woman is not going to strap on a 60lb ruck with mortor base plate on her back and hump 20 miles thru the FT. Benning bonnies. Are there some that may could.Probably.

Let's face it men and women are different. As much as it may pain some of you libs to admit it. Men and women are not meant to be the same. Women as a rule of thumb can not do everything a man can do and men are not good at strengths that women have. It's fact no matter how much you may not want it to be.

Spot on. In my tank platoon, during Desert Storm, a typical woman couldn't handle the physical demands

[BaBamSam 239]

Spot on. In my tank platoon, during Desert Storm, a typical woman couldn't handle the physical demands

But neither could a typical man! Not without training and conditioning. What is the problem with letting would test themselves for qualification? If she is qualified from training and conditioning and verifiably so, how does that make her different from a qualified man?

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

I am not a "lib", but thanks for making assumptions that using that term would be a degradation to my credibility.

You sound like another white cisgender male who has chosen not to recognize his privilege. Apologies if that is not accurate. Women have proven and re-proven that they can do things that men can and men have proven the same in various ways. We still have a very long way to go, obviously, so that people from your perspective recognize that.

Your average woman cannot do that. You're right. Neither can your average man. Neither can do that without proper training and condition, but both can once they receive those.

I am not saying we force-feed women into the infantry, but we offer those who want to join a chance to do so and serve as equals with the men. As you said, some women probably could handle it.

Guess I am privileged. The fruits of a lifetime of hard work and busting my ####### for everything I have ever gotten.

Anyway... So why are there not Female running backs in the NFL ?

So tell me. How much experience have you had serving in a rifle platoon in the Armed services.

But neither could a typical man! Not without training and conditioning. What is the problem with letting would test themselves for qualification? If she is qualified from training and conditioning and verifiably so, how does that make her different from a qualified man?

If your average man could not handle it, then how do we get soldiers. To be quite frank you have no clue what you are talking about

[BaBamSam 239]

My husband has never worked out a day in his life and carried about 140 lbs up 3 flights the first time we met without breaking a sweat.

Know many women who can do that?

Men are clearly physically different than women. I don't know who would debate such a thing.

I encourage you to investigate the real physical difference between men and women. Look up the article "Throwing Like a Girl', which examines how we are socially influenced to hold and handle our bodies differently due to our gender and you will see that the scientific difference, while they are present, are not as different as many would believe.

And I have done that. I know other women who have and can.

[BaBamSam 239]

Guess I am privileged. The fruits of a lifetime of hard work and busting my ####### for everything I have ever gotten.

Anyway... So why are there not Female running backs in the NFL ?

So tell me. How much experience have you had serving in a rifle platoon in the Armed services.

If your average man could not handle it, then how do we get soldiers. To be quite frank you have no clue what you are talking about

Ah, you've misunderstood what privilege is. You may have busted your ####### and worked hard your entire life - I do not say anything to the contrary. However, your privilege is that you were born to a sex with a superior gender in today's society. You have never been told that your gender limits what you can do (unless it's have a baby, which I'm sure you'll retort with something similar other than reflecting on this).

Because females are discouraged from playing football even as kids? I was one of three girls in a FLAG football league as a kid. I played two years of contact before I was no longer allowed to play in the league due to being female. So. Look at society for that answer before jumping to the assumption that it is only physical limitations.

I was waiting for someone to tell me I am discredited due to my lack of military experience. Points for you for being the first. I have already admitted my disinterest in military life and careers, and if me admitting that discredits me in your eyes then that is your loss for a healthy debate. But you lack a ####### and I'm sure you've weighed in on everything from abortion rights, to birth control, to gender based affirmative action.

I'm beginning to question your reading comprehension. The average man to become a soldier completes training. Hence they are no longer your average man off the street. As I've said twice now, training and conditioning are necessary for both men and women.

[Iraqvet 68]

Please, do not imply or question my mental ability just for voicing a different opinion and perspective from your own. Thank you.

I am under the belief that the infantry would function best when it was comprised of those who demonstrate that they are sufficiently capable and sufficiently trained regardless of gender. This is not a "make it half and half" thing. This is allow women the opportunity to at least prove themselves.

I think the strength of women would surprise you, as your sweeping generalization reflects gender roles and beliefs constructed by society and is not related to actual biology. My personal competencies are not relevant as I neither would like to serve in the military, nor have I done that specific task. I do, however, know women who could do just that and many men who could not.

EDIT: Also your belief in the lesser effect of women stems from a social norm to perceive women as the lesser gender and sex. Another construct.

Your post is as intelligent as it is irrelevant. You said it in your post. You would not like to serve in the military, nor have you done the specific task. Women are great at many things! Singing, acting, sports, business, love, making sandwichs, helping people. There are millions of things. I have served in combat and i would not even want to see hillary clinton in that environment.

[BaBamSam 239]

Your post is as intelligent as it is irrelevant. You said it in your post. You would not like to serve in the military, nor have you done the specific task. Women are great at many things! Singing, acting, sports, business, love, making sandwichs, helping people. There are millions of things. I have served in combat and i would not even want to see hillary clinton in that environment.

I, personally, would not choose military life. That is not based on my gender, but based on my personal beliefs and other interests in life. My argument is not irrelevant because of this. I am sorry you feel that way, but there are many women who are willing to be trained and will proudly serve this country in combat or in various other military careers. I don't believe anyone, veteran or not, has the authority to tell someone who is trained properly and verifiably that he or she cannot serve in the military because of their gender. Or any arbitrary reason of the like.

[Iraqvet 68]

I, personally, would not choose military life. That is not based on my gender, but based on my personal beliefs and other interests in life. My argument is not irrelevant because of this. I am sorry you feel that way, but there are many women who are willing to be trained and will proudly serve this country in combat or in various other military careers. I don't believe anyone, veteran or not, has the authority to tell someone who is trained properly and verifiably that he or she cannot serve in the military because of their gender. Or any arbitrary reason of the like.

Then based on your argument we should let females compete against men at the UFC. Do you know a woman that could take out Brock Lesnar? Let women run the football down the field against dudes that are 6' 6 300 pounds wanting to rip their head off. I am a big fan of the lingerie football league and wish I was a season ticket holder but it is not the same.

[BaBamSam 239]

Then based on your argument we should let females compete against men at the UFC. Do you know a woman that could take out Brock Lesnar? Let women run the football down the field against dudes that are 6' 6 300 pounds wanting to rip their head off. I am a big fan of the lingerie football league and wish I was a season ticket holder but it is not the same.

Well, we add drugs like steroids into the equation, the unnatural effects of those things skew the equation and change arguments.

[Iraqvet 68]

Well, we add drugs like steroids into the equation, the unnatural effects of those things skew the equation and change arguments.

The equation for equality of men and women is an unbalanced equation. I do believe there are things women can do that men can't. Like delivering a baby. There is just not a whole lot of time for that on a battlefield.

Edited March 7, 2013 by Iraqvet