The systematic extermination of Hazaras (Taliban-led genocide of a Shia ethnic minority in Pakistan)

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

Sandi commented on the drones and then opined something to the effect that the drones were in some manner the reason for Radical Islamic terrorists doing the voodoo that they do so well.

Australia is not offering asylum to protect the victims of drone strikes. No victims of drone strikes were in the OP.

I am not Sandi.

[ready4ONE 5,400]

I am not Sandi.

No you're not, but you were certainly running with her effort to divert the topic of this thread from Muslim killing and attacking other Muslims, Muslim children no less, while both of you were studiously trying to do so without ever mentioning that inconvenient fact, to the topic of drone strikes.

[^_^ 5,021]

Pakistan is in the midst of a particularly brutal period of their history. The Taliban are creating a real atmosphere of fear for Shias in the border areas. India is seeing the benefit from this, terrorism (they call it freedom fighting) in the Kashmir Valley is low since the animals are busy eating each other for the time being.

So no worries, there will be other threads along these lines. WoM can't eat them all.

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

No you're not, but you were certainly running with her effort to divert the topic of this thread from Muslim killing and attacking other Muslims, Muslim children no less, while both of you were studiously trying to do so without ever mentioning that inconvenient fact, to the topic of drone strikes.

Ready, I've said more times than you can count that the killing of children and other innocent civilians is always horrible, no matter who does it - even in this very thread. That's what you "studiously" ignore and try to divert attention from: that you invariably justify the killings of innocent Muslim children and other civilians when it's the US and Israel committing the killings (and not even in their own land - they invade foreign lands to do so.) But when Muslims kill anyone at all - whether non-Muslim or Muslim - then it's suddenly the most outrageous evil in the world, which of course must be confronted with violent and widespread force which will require the killing of even more innocent Muslim people.

Does anyone really wonder what you'd have to say if it were, for instance, Jordan or Lebanon or Syria using drones to neutralize Israeli Kahanist terror cells in the West Bank, and "accidentally" wiping out a few hundred or a few thousand non-terrorist Israelis in the process. Yeah, I bet you'd be all about their "do-gooder intentions," making smug pronouncements about how innocent lives sometimes have to be sacrificed for the general betterment of the world.

Unfortunately, the oppression, even attempted genocides of the Hazara in Afghanistan predates the Taliban by several centuries. It's a horrible problem, and it's horrible that the Taliban takes part in it. But once the Taliban is gone, the Hazara's problems of brutal oppression against them in Afghanistan will still be there. However, you won't care about their plight, will you ? Just as you didn't care before the Taliban.

Edited February 24, 2013 by wife_of_mahmoud

[sandinista! 1,816]

For right now, the drones Australia deploys are not weaponized.

They do participate in other forms of carnage that are unfortunate, and I wish they wouldn't. Letting in a few trickles of refugees here and there doesn't abate either countries' guilt :-(

Yes, they are. But you should disabuse yourself of the illusion that Australia is all angels when it comes to deploying drones.

In other news, Australia moves to buy $3b spy drone fleet.

And let's not forget the large numbers of refugees the US accommodates each and every year - close to 100,000. Now what?

[sandinista! 1,816]

You obviously didn't read my post, but chose to just spew ####### all over the place. I said nothing about cause and effect in relation to attacks on the Hazara. I was comparing/contrasting Australian intervention for a group of people in crisis in AfPak with what has been the most prevalent response for the US in the greater area-drones. Drones used on people in AfPak for the purported goal of "helping them".   I've used nothing but condemning language in regards to anybody who would oppress or slaughter anybody in the region. Unfortunately you can't say the same, cheerleading as it were in defense of blowing up other people's kids for their own good, and then talking about "intent" like a sociopath. If it were your wife, your mother, you wouldn't give a ####### about intent, but these people, they should just suck it up. Gross. 

Sandi commented on the drones and then opined something to the effect that the drones were in some manner the reason for Radical Islamic terrorists doing the voodoo that they do so well. 

Australia is not offering asylum to protect the victims of drone strikes. No victims of drone strikes were in the OP.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

For right now, the drones Australia deploys are not weaponized.

They do participate in other forms of carnage that are unfortunate, and I wish they wouldn't. Letting in a few trickles of refugees here and there doesn't abate either countries' guilt :-(

I think the country most responsible for these minorities being massacred in Pakistan is, well, Pakistan. We can certainly go around pretending otherwise but the massacres against these minorities are happening there and the Pakistani government is doing precisely jack about it. But sure, it's America's fault.

[Karee 4,191]

I think the country most responsible for these minorities being massacred in Pakistan is, well, Pakistan. We can certainly go around pretending otherwise but the massacres against these minorities are happening there and the Pakistani government is doing precisely jack about it. But sure, it's America's fault.

Nail meet head.

[james&olya 1,121]

#2.) The killing of children, either by militant groups or by state military forces - no matter who does it or why they claim they do it or whatever excuses they have about collateral damage - is all equivalent in evilness; no matter if they kill by car bomb or by drone or by cluster bombs or by depleted uranium; the only tangible difference is the numbers dead. And the US would be one of the major state actors in the killing of children over the past several decades.

I disagree. It is horrible for children to die, no matter the circumstance. But when the subject is the mechanism of that death rather than the fact of the death itself than intent is very much involved in a determination of evil! It is said that the end does not justify the means. A corollary might be that the end does not damn the means either.

[james&olya 1,121]

What are you babbling about ? I responded to comments about drones in this thread. I haven't made any justifications for any bombings by anyone; I'm against bombings. I'm against children and other innocent civilians being killed, I'm against extra-judicial assassinations, and I'm especially sickened when it's my own country doing these things.

War is hell! Sometimes reality presents individuals and nations with no good options and you are forced to choose the least evil one. Yes, it sucks!

[ready4ONE 5,400]

I think the country most responsible for these minorities being massacred in Pakistan is, well, Pakistan. We can certainly go around pretending otherwise but the massacres against these minorities are happening there and the Pakistani government is doing precisely jack about it. But sure, it's America's fault.

Don't forget Israel! America doesn't do anything without guidance and direction from Israel!

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

I disagree. It is horrible for children to die, no matter the circumstance. But when the subject is the mechanism of that death rather than the fact of the death itself than intent is very much involved in a determination of evil! It is said that the end does not justify the means. A corollary might be that the end does not damn the means either.

The problem with the US use of drones is that it's conducted behind a curtain of secrecy, with no accountability or transparency. US officials publicly claim that US drones have caused either "no" or "single digit" civilian casualties - even though the US hasn't even bothered to create any mechanisms to track, analyze, or investigate civilian deaths and injuries.

However, human rights groups have documented hundreds of civilians killed, including 176 children, and more than a thousand others injured.

At the very least, the lack of accountability could be considered "criminal negligence" in legal terms, or even "a culture of negligence." Nor does it comply with US obligations to international laws and conventions regarding human rights and the use of force against non-combatants.

War is hell! Sometimes reality presents individuals and nations with no good options and you are forced to choose the least evil one. Yes, it sucks!

I'm not so convinced that the choices the US government makes (including drones) are always the "least evil" choices.

[Karee 4,191]

The problem with the US use of drones is that it's conducted behind a curtain of secrecy, with no accountability or transparency. US officials publicly claim that US drones have caused either "no" or "single digit" civilian casualties - even though the US hasn't even bothered to create any mechanisms to track, analyze, or investigate civilian deaths and injuries.

Yeah good point. The military should make all of their decisons and policies public and transparent.

[^_^ 5,021]

Yeah good point. The military should make all of their decisons and policies public and transparent.

When Muslims attack, we should be pacifist. Nothing else will make WoM happy.

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

[quote name=' timestamp='1361804127' post='6002712]

When Muslims attack, we should be pacifist. Nothing else will make WoM happy.

The civilian casualties of these drones didn't attack anyone.

But nothing makes you happy like more Muslim deaths.