Venezuela's Chavez bans gun ownership and firearms sales

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

You must prove 2005 to 2010 demographics and the documented changes to invalidate my point. I posted and linked the census data.

Anything less and you are only something to be scraped off my boot ...

Your wasting time

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

I posted the demographic change.

You posted the demographic change that tells us that Compton - an area encompassing almost 100,000 people gained 55 Asians and lost 267 Pacific Natives. Then you called that a turf change. Not sure why you would think that 55 people would have such a huge influence on a community of 100,000 but whatever.

That is aside from the fact that these demographic changes may or may not have occurred inside the 5 year window that was subject to the discussion - that would be 2005 - 2011. You cannot demonstrate that the shift away from African American and towards a more Hispanic and White population - the only relevant shift discernible from the census data - has occurred in that relevant time frame. It may have and it may not have and you can't tell one way or the other.

That makes you the king of irrelevant data but not much more. Now, you either present back-up that is relevant to the discussion at hand - which is the reduction in crime in Compton between 2005 and 2011 - or you pack up and hit the road.

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

You posted the demographic change that tells us that Compton - an area encompassing almost 100,000 people gained 55 Asians and lost 267 Pacific Natives. Then you called that a turf change. Not sure why you would think that 55 people would have such a huge influence on a community of 100,000 but whatever.

That is aside from the fact that these demographic changes may or may not have occurred inside the 5 year window that was subject to the discussion - that would be 2005 - 2011. You cannot demonstrate that the shift away from African American and towards a more Hispanic and White population - the only relevant shift discernible from the census data - has occurred in that relevant time frame. It may have and it may not have and you can't tell one way or the other.

That makes you the king of irrelevant data but not much more. Now, you either present back-up that is relevant to the discussion at hand - which is the reduction in crime in Compton between 2005 and 2011 - or you pack up and hit the road.

Seems we disbanded the corrupt politicians and police force in 2000 and doubled police presence in 2007. You got anything to add besides your usual, your source is wrong bull.

http://en.wikipedia....ton,_California

Compton's violent reputation was popularized in the late 1980s by the rise to prominence of local gangsta rap groups Compton's Most Wanted and especially N.W.A, who released the famous album Straight Outta Compton in 1988. The city used to be notorious for gang violence, primarily caused by the Bloods and Crips. Crime rates had been falling for years following the crack epidemic of the 1980s and early 1990s.

Crime, though present in lesser degrees beforehand, worsened significantly with the introduction of crack cocaine in the latter part of the 20th century. The neighborhood lost wealthy residents, with the worsening safety problems, and, after the 1992 riots in the Los Angeles metropolitan area, many African Americans left the city. Meanwhile, many Latino and other immigrant families moved into Compton, including Samoans, Tongans, Koreans, Filipinos, Belizeans and East Africans.^[32]

During 2006, Compton deployed twice as many sheriff's deputies and the murder rate has steadily decreased in the last decade.^[33] Recent reports show that Compton's violent crime rate has been reduced by 30% over the last ten years, and is continuing to be reduced.^[34]

Although the U.S. News & World Report does not even list Compton in the "The 11 Most Dangerous Cities" for overall crime rates in the United States,^[35] it contrasts the CQ Press, using data from the FBI's annual report of crime statistics "Crime in the United States 2010," ranked Compton as the 8th most dangerous city in the country.^[36]

In 2010, Compton Station area homicides declined by about 38 percent, with 26 homicides in 2010, in comparison to the 42 homicides in 2009.^[37] This number is a 53 percent decrease from five years ago, and was the lowest number of homicides since 1972. The sheriff's department reported: Taking into consideration the population changes, last year showed the lowest homicide rate since 1965. Property crimes also decreased.^[37] These figures demonstrate a 67.2 percent decrease over the five-year period from 2005 to 2010.^[38]

Edited January 28, 2013 by The Nature Boy

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Seems we disbanded the corrupt politicians and police force in 2000 and doubled police presence in 2007.

2006, actually, per your own source. Anyway, are we now saying that changing demographics as another poster has insisted ain't it? More police and fewer guns? That is what caused violent crimes to decrease? That's what it boils down to per the source you offered. And I don't disagree. Fewer guns and effective police work will do the trick. NYC has demonstrated that as well.

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

2006, actually, per your own source. Anyway, are we now saying that changing demographics as another poster has insisted ain't it? More police and fewer guns? That is what caused violent crimes to decrease? That's what it boils down to per the source you offered. And I don't disagree. Fewer guns and effective police work will do the trick. NYC has demonstrated that as well.

In your wildest most absurd fantasies do you really think a violent felon is going to turn in his gun for a 50-100 dollar gift card. I mean even for you

You've got anger issues. I posted a link to the crime states for the relevant years. You have posted bupkus for that time frame. And you have suggested that an increase of 55 Asians in a community of 100,000 constitutes a turf change.

You accusing people of anger issues, That's funny. Of all people.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

In your wildest most absurd fantasies do you really think a violent felon is going to turn in his gun for a 50-100 dollar gift card. I mean even for you.

I see. The LAPD crediting the program with crime reduction and expanding it because it was such a success knows nothing and you - filling soap bottles for a living - know everything about law enforcement. Jesus H Christ. You people are so detached from reality it's worrying that you get to have guns.

Edited January 29, 2013 by Mr. Big Dog

[natty bumppo 297]

1359419417[/url]' post='5946644']

I see. The LAPD crediting the program with crime reduction and expanding it because it was such a success knows nothing and you - filling soap bottles for a living - know everything about law enforcement. Jesus H Christ. You people are so detached from reality it's worrying that you get to have guns.

Lets see ... A change in demographics resulted in a reduction in crime.

Prove me wrong ... With supporting docs.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Lets see ... A change in demographics resulted in a reduction in crime.

Prove me wrong ... With supporting docs.

Let's see... There were fewer guns in the community causing crime to drop. Prove me wrong. With supporting docs.

[natty bumppo 297]

1359420876[/url]' post='5946705']

It's not how it works. First you prove your theory. You have yet to do that.

I requested 2005 data ... Still waiting ...

Show us all your 2005 census data ....

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

I requested 2005 data ... Still waiting ...

Requested that from who? Me? I am not your data warehouse. Get your own if you need it. I have not made any claims as to demographics. You have. The burden of proof is thus on you not on me.

[natty bumppo 297]

1359422057[/url]' post='5946761']

Requested that from who? Me? I am not your data warehouse. Get your own if you need it. I have not made any claims as to demographics. You have. The burden of proof is thus on you not on me.

I gave you data over a 10 year period. You went microscopic.... Prove your point .... Or stay home.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

At least all the Americans that want this have a place they can go and be safe when our congress refuses to deliver

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

I gave you data over a 10 year period. You went microscopic.... Prove your point .... Or stay home.

My point is simply that the 10 year period for which you provided data is not sufficient to draw any conclusion on what the changes may have been in the time period relevant to the discussion. There's nothing to prove from my end. The demographics changes between 2005 and 2011 cannot be derived in any meaningful way from the demographics changes between 2000 and 2010 unless one wants to assume that these changes occurred steadily over that 10 year window and continued beyond it. Absent of such assumption, we do not know whether there were any significant demographics changes in Compton between 2005 and 2011 or whether the changes were perhaps even more dramatic than the census data recorded between 2000 and 2010.

You want to attribute the decline in crimes to changing demographics. If that is true, then demographic changes must ahve been different between 2000 and 2005 as opposed to 2005 and 2010 because in the fist part of that decade, crime was on the rise while over the last half of that decade crime dropped rapidly. So if demographic changes account for the drop in crime over the last 5 years, then would they also account for the rise in crime in the first 5 years? If you'd want to validate that then you'd have to have a bit more granular data than you presented - maybe more granular than is available. It's your argument, though, so you are going to have to make it and substantiate it. Don't sit there looking for a handout - i.e. don't expect me to substantiate your argument for you.

[natty bumppo 297]

1359424545[/url]' post='5946852']

My point is simply that the 10 year period for which you provided data is not sufficient to draw any conclusion on what the changes may have been in the time period relevant to the discussion. There's nothing to prove from my end. The demographics changes between 2005 and 2011 cannot be derived in any meaningful way from the demographics changes between 2000 and 2010 unless one wants to assume that these changes occurred steadily over that 10 year window and continued beyond it. Absent of such assumption, we do not know whether there were any significant demographics changes in Compton between 2005 and 2011 or whether the changes were perhaps even more dramatic than the census data recorded between 2000 and 2010.

You want to attribute the decline in crimes to changing demographics. If that is true, then demographic changes must ahve been different between 2000 and 2005 as opposed to 2005 and 2010 because in the fist part of that decade, crime was on the rise while over the last half of that decade crime dropped rapidly. So if demographic changes account for the drop in crime over the last 5 years, then would they also account for the rise in crime in the first 5 years? If you'd want to validate that then you'd have to have a bit more granular data than you presented - maybe more granular than is available. It's your argument, though, so you are going to have to make it and substantiate it. Don't sit there looking for a handout - i.e. don't expect me to substantiate your argument for you.

1359405441[/url]' post='5946177']

Why not? It did in Compton. They took 7K guns off the streets and the murder rate dropped an astonishing 75% over the 6 years following the gun reduction initiative. I know certain people like to pretend this isn't so but fewer guns actually do translate into safer streets.

You crowed a claim ...support it given more of the picture than the microcosm you proposed or go home ....

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

You crowed a claim ...support it given more of the picture than the microcosm you proposed or go home ....

There are fewer guns in Compton in 2011 than there were in 2005 and there is less crime. It happened in Compton same as it did in NYC, for example. I see a little pattern developing - maybe because I want to see it. But I surely see the gun nut theory shot to pieces that more safety is accomplished by increasing the number of guns. Safety can be achieved by reducing the number of guns. And in a country where we already have more guns than people, decreasing the number of guns would appear the way to go.