My Final ROC List ready to go!

[ChelseaKate 3]

• Completed I-751 JOINT Petition to Remove Conditions on Residence.

• Check for $590 to the U.S. Department of Homeland Security.

• Photocopy of both sides of my Permanent Resident Card.

• Copy of our Son's Birth Certificate.

• Copies of our Mortgage Contract.

• Copies of our Construction Account.

• Printed Copies of our joint bank Statement- 24 Months, all pages. And a letter from the Bank.

• Original Tax Return Transcripts for 2010 and 2011 filed jointly.

• Copy of my husband's Life Insurance Policy showing our Son and I, as beneficiary.

• Copy of Homeowner's Insurance.

• Copy of Auto Policy Insurance.

• Dental and Medical Bills.

• Two Original Affidavits. Notarized.

• 7 Pictures with family and friends.

• Immunization Record of our Son, showing my husband and I as his parents.

• Copies of our Driver's License.

[Martyshk 137]

Looks pretty good to me.

[ChelseaKate 3]

Looks pretty good to me.

Thank you, Martyshk!

[Villanelle 4,122]

The point of ROC is to prove the marriage is legitimate. Its more then just we are still married at the two year mark, if thats all it was all you would have to do is submit proof you are not divorced. Its also a bit more then just showing you reside together and co-mingle finances- which dont get me wrong is a huge part of it.

But if you want to get approved w/o an interview, which is the preferred method, youre going to have to submit more then just dry evidence of cohabitation and commingling finances.

Who are the affidavits from? Family? friends? Neighbors? Are they strongly written? Stating they were present at your wedding and know you and your spouse to be a legitimate couple/loving family unit?

Do you have anything from your wedding you can include? Pictures? Copy of the wedding menu?What else do you and your husband have jointly? memberships to a gym or a club? Perhaps something you saved from a trip you took or a show you saw? A photo you took attached with the stubs would be a plus. Remember theyre looking for proof of a relationship. Because your son is so young perhaps you have records where you and your husband attended a Lamaze class together. Thats a joint activity. Or you attended Dr visits together. A statement from the Drs office saying you both attended is strong evidence of a relationship (they dont have to be notarized) You can even go as far to include proof of large purchases you made jointly. You bought a crib right? Do you have the receipt? If your husband paid with his credit/debit card, submit that. Its your ROC, dont worry about overdoing it. More is always better. Send them junk mail, Xmas cards, and Valentines day cards you and your spouse exchanged. Make it clear you have a personal relationship with your spouse and not just a cohabitation agreement.

[Martyshk 137]

The point of ROC is to prove the marriage is legitimate. Its more then just we are still married at the two year mark, if thats all it was all you would have to do is submit proof you are not divorced. Its also a bit more then just showing you reside together and co-mingle finances- which dont get me wrong is a huge part of it.

But if you want to get approved w/o an interview, which is the preferred method, youre going to have to submit more then just dry evidence of cohabitation and commingling finances.

Who are the affidavits from? Family? friends? Neighbors? Are they strongly written? Stating they were present at your wedding and know you and your spouse to be a legitimate couple/loving family unit?

Do you have anything from your wedding you can include? Pictures? Copy of the wedding menu?What else do you and your husband have jointly? memberships to a gym or a club? Perhaps something you saved from a trip you took or a show you saw? A photo you took attached with the stubs would be a plus. Remember theyre looking for proof of a relationship. Because your son is so young perhaps you have records where you and your husband attended a Lamaze class together. Thats a joint activity. Or you attended Dr visits together. A statement from the Drs office saying you both attended is strong evidence of a relationship (they dont have to be notarized) You can even go as far to include proof of large purchases you made jointly. You bought a crib right? Do you have the receipt? If your husband paid with his credit/debit card, submit that. Its your ROC, dont worry about overdoing it. More is always better. Send them junk mail, Xmas cards, and Valentines day cards you and your spouse exchanged. Make it clear you have a personal relationship with your spouse and not just a cohabitation agreement.

You are going about two steps beyond nutty there...

I'm not sure you understand what exactly USCIS is looking for in ROC.... it's exactly what you think will not get you approved (to quote you - " just showing you reside together and co-mingle finances").

That's pretty much the essence of it. The rest you describe? - Soft evidence that you use if you don't have the primary evidence.

Because according to you, about 85% of VJers here have fraudulent marriage and would have never been approved for ROC because people either don't have or do not send the concrete evidence (according to you) like a receipt for a crib (I imagine you live in the world where it's just not possible to manufacture such evidence, since it's much much harder to do than to have a bank account for 2 years!)

I guess I should go take couple of pictures next to a theater too, attach it to the stubs and then close our joint accounts, remove my spouse from my insurance and forget about everything since USCIS would have no doubt whatsoever with the stubs+pictures combo. That's just genius.

---------------

To the OP: don't listen to this. You have an excellent package for ROC (that goes beyond the evidence that USCIS seeks). Send it out!

Edited January 17, 2013 by Martyshk

[naomi55 0]

I also think Capri is going over board. A list of what I sent in as evidence for ROC and was approved:

3 pictures of our family

Birth cert of our son

Photocopies of our DL showing the same address

Copy of our insurance cards

That's it. No affidavits or cards or anything.

[Martyshk 137]

I also think Capri is going over board. A list of what I sent in as evidence for ROC and was approved:

3 pictures of our family

Birth cert of our son

Photocopies of our DL showing the same address

Copy of our insurance cards

That's it. No affidavits or cards or anything.

You must have sent something else, cmon

There's no middle ground in these proceedings. Everyone sends what they send and each petition is reviewed on its own merit.

There're some uniform things (bank statements, DL showing same address, designated beneficiaries, and such) that are more flinty evidence then other stuff.

People have sent everything and beyond and got RFE. People sent almost nothing and got approved without RFE/Interview.

I think each person should send what they think is right (while trying to adhere to the guidelines) and that's that.

Capri is going well beyond overboard though...

[aayitrun 66]

read this: http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/220440-i-751-evidence/

also a crib isnt a big purchase.. and getting a receipt for a crib means absolutely nothing because i can go buy a crib right now and return it and show the purchase receipt.

think for yourself what evidence is convincing and what is fluff.

[Martyshk 137]

also a crib isnt a big purchase.. and getting a receipt for a crib means absolutely nothing because i can go buy a crib right now and return it and show the purchase receipt.

[Navyk 78]

You triggered interesting inter-action. I think you have great evidence - copy of Son's Birth Certifcate in my opinion is number one evidence (not to say that a couple who didn't have a child in this period is not genuine) and random copies of joint bank statement (one earliest and one latest), tax returns, along with other evidence of financial mixing are excellent. All the best.

[Villanelle 4,122]

Lol, sorry if the crib comment was overkill. Since I dont know the couple and am not privy to the intimate details of their life I was trying to think of creative suggestions as to things they might have that they could use...

The whole point of ROC or removing conditions is to prove you have a bonafide marriage. The evidence you submit falls into are 3 basic categories.

A Evidence of Cohabitation

B Evidence of Financial Co-mingling

C Evidence of a Personal Relationship

So lets look at the OPS evidence list again and see where her evidence fits

Copy of our Son's Birth Certificate. C (a child is proof of a personal relationship)

Copies of our Mortgage Contract B and A (both an asset and proof of residence)

Copies of our Construction Account. B (business so an asset)

Printed Copies of our joint bank Statement B

Original Tax Return Transcripts for 2010 and 2011 filed jointly. B

Copy of my husband's Life Insurance Policy showing our Son and I, as beneficiary. B

Copy of Homeowner's Insurance. A (residence proof) B (financial document)

Copy of Auto Policy Insurance. B (financial doc)

Dental and Medical Bills. A (proof of address) Unless it was a hospital record that showed husband brought wife in

Two Original Affidavits. Notarized. C (proof of relationship)

7 Pictures with family and friends. C (proof of relationship)

Immunization Record of our Son, showing my husband and I as his parents C (proof of relationship)

Copies of our Driver's License. A (proof of residence)

So tallying it up they have

A- 4

B- 7

C- 4

Thats 12 items that are proof of cohabitation and commingling of assets and only 4 that are proof of a relationship, and 4 is stretching it as the childs birth certificate and immunization record listing them as parents are pretty much duplicate (Ie two documents both stating the same thing- they are the child parents)

So IMO she has more then enough evidence for A and B and should strengthen C. Does she have to? No. Its just my opinion and she asked for opinions.

The way the ROC process works, you mail in your application. Its luck of the draw who you get to review it. Based on the evidence you submitted they will decide if you met the burden of proof of establishing a bonafide marriage. If they feel you didnt you will receive a RFE to submit further evidence. If theyre still not satisfied with youre response to the RFE youll be called in for a face to face interview so they can evaluate your relationship for themselves. An experienced ROC adjuster can tell rather quickly in an interview if the relationship is legitimate. Heck an ordinary person can tell rather quickly by observing the couple next to them in a restaurant if they are on a date or on a business meeting.

For most people their goal is to get ROC approval w/o an interview. To do so you need to round out your application and include things from all three categories. A lot of people do this unintentionally by including things like joint gym memberships or holiday cards addressed to both of them, thinking they are category A items, not realizing they also count towards category C, so theres a general misconception that category C is only for people that cant prove categories A and B.

[Navyk 78]

Visajourney provided the following documents to be good. Hope this helps.

1.

A deed, showing co-ownership of your property or a lease agreement with both of your names on the

lease.

2.

Utility bills, credit card bills, and other types of bills which have both of your names on them. Since many utilities will only put a bill in one person's name, some bills in one name and other bills at the same address but in the other spouse's name serve the same purpose: showing your financial & social lives intermingled.

3.

Copies of actual credit cards, health insurance cards, or other "joint" cards that you have together,

showing same account number.

4.

Car, health, or life insurance that has both of your names on the policy or the other spouse listed as the

beneficiary.

5.

401K or other retirement plan with spouse listed as beneficiary (right to survivorship is the technical term)

6.

Bank or stock accounts with both of your names on them.

7.

A copy of your joint tax returns. Tax transcripts from the IRS are still the preferred method.

8.

A car title or other titles to property showing joint ownership with your spouse.

9.

Birth certificate of any children that have been born to your marriage.

10.

Documentation of any vacations that you have taken, including flight itineraries, hotel bills, pictures of you

together on vacation.

11.

Other family pictures of you together.

12.

Documentary proof showing evidence of your children together (Copy of Birth Certificate, photos, etc)

13.

Copies of Christmas cards and other holiday cards addressed to you both

[Martyshk 137]

Lol, sorry if the crib comment was overkill. Since I dont know the couple and am not privy to the intimate details of their life I was trying to think of creative suggestions as to things they might have that they could use...

The whole point of ROC or removing conditions is to prove you have a bonafide marriage. The evidence you submit falls into are 3 basic categories.

A Evidence of Cohabitation

B Evidence of Financial Co-mingling

C Evidence of a Personal Relationship

So lets look at the OPS evidence list again and see where her evidence fits

Copy of our Son's Birth Certificate. C (a child is proof of a personal relationship)

Copies of our Mortgage Contract B and A (both an asset and proof of residence)

Copies of our Construction Account. B (business so an asset)

Printed Copies of our joint bank Statement B

Original Tax Return Transcripts for 2010 and 2011 filed jointly. B

Copy of my husband's Life Insurance Policy showing our Son and I, as beneficiary. B

Copy of Homeowner's Insurance. A (residence proof) B (financial document)

Copy of Auto Policy Insurance. B (financial doc)

Dental and Medical Bills. A (proof of address) Unless it was a hospital record that showed husband brought wife in

Two Original Affidavits. Notarized. C (proof of relationship)

7 Pictures with family and friends. C (proof of relationship)

Immunization Record of our Son, showing my husband and I as his parents C (proof of relationship)

Copies of our Driver's License. A (proof of residence)

So tallying it up they have

A- 4

B- 7

C- 4

Thats 12 items that are proof of cohabitation and commingling of assets and only 4 that are proof of a relationship, and 4 is stretching it as the childs birth certificate and immunization record listing them as parents are pretty much duplicate (Ie two documents both stating the same thing- they are the child parents)

So IMO she has more then enough evidence for A and B and should strengthen C. Does she have to? No. Its just my opinion and she asked for opinions.

The way the ROC process works, you mail in your application. Its luck of the draw who you get to review it. Based on the evidence you submitted they will decide if you met the burden of proof of establishing a bonafide marriage. If they feel you didnt you will receive a RFE to submit further evidence. If theyre still not satisfied with youre response to the RFE youll be called in for a face to face interview so they can evaluate your relationship for themselves. An experienced ROC adjuster can tell rather quickly in an interview if the relationship is legitimate. Heck an ordinary person can tell rather quickly by observing the couple next to them in a restaurant if they are on a date or on a business meeting.

For most people their goal is to get ROC approval w/o an interview. To do so you need to round out your application and include things from all three categories. A lot of people do this unintentionally by including things like joint gym memberships or holiday cards addressed to both of them, thinking they are category A items, not realizing they also count towards category C, so theres a general misconception that category C is only for people that cant prove categories A and B.

You are really way out there in the never-never land when it comes to grasping the concept of what the evidence for ROC is.

As I've said - it's a personal preference on what to send and all that jazz.

I'm not even arguing here, I'm merely baffled anymore.

[Villanelle 4,122]

Im out in never-never land?

Okay well heres another user who has a similar view on it-

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/406516-i-751-reguest-for-more-evidence/

The poster who he took the layout from is here -

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/366538-evidence-stressing/-

SO if Im nuts Im not the only one. Also I have been through the ROC process before. This isnt my first rodeo.

Even the 'official VJ list of evidence' includes items from all 3 categories.

Im going to speculate that the OP and her spouse work in construction. Its a tough job, full time hours and lots of deadlines. Im going to further speculate that not having an interview is important because of such, which is why she posted this thread- because they dont want an interview. So my advice remains the same. Round out the application by boosting category C.

Heres a rather old thread where the poster was divorced, filed on his own and submitted 26 pieces of evidence. 13 were A and B, 13 were C. He got approved with no interview.

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/330303-removal-of-condition-and-evidence/page__pid__4909529#entry4909529

So to the OP, you can choose to take my advice or not. Its not going to effect me, so it really doesnt matter to me at all. But I would advise you to do your own research. Look through the ROC thread. Youll see those who got RFEs or called in for interviews to show proof of a bonafide marriage did so because they were lacking category C items. (A RFE for additional pages of bank statements or incomplete tax returns is not the same, thats just poor submission on the applicants part) Consequently, youll see people reporting successful ROC applications w/o interviews had equal or strong numbers of items in all categories.

[ChelseaKate 3]

Thank you, for all your input, suggestion and advise, I appreciate you taking time replying and sharing your opinion and experience. The evidence I'm about to mail is probably enough for now. My affidavit is from my neighbor who knows us personally and the other is from a Minister who officiated our Wedding and our Baby Dedication and he is our close friend. Our biggest purchase is our house which I included. I have tons of wedding pics but not sending those, sent them for AOS but not for ROC. I also have cards and letters addressed to both of us, might include those. We opened a Bank Account for our Son and we are listed there as his parents and also, I could just easily get a copy of my son's medical record from our Pediatrician but I'm not sending EVERYTHING in case I get RFE, I'll have something else to send them. Once again, thank you, should have replied earlier but my son is teething and having fever and kept awake all night! Glad he felt better today :-)