If your an American this will make you both proud, and angry

[ChristinaM 0]

You are familiar with the phrase "two wrongs don't make a right" I assume, Kaydee?

[Carol&Marc 0]

how many sides are in a circle?

Draw one and start counting! ...........................Let me know when you get the answer!

You are familiar with the phrase "two wrongs don't make a right" I assume, Kaydee?

How about 180,000 wrongs?

[DeadPoolX 9]

You are familiar with the phrase "two wrongs don't make a right" I assume, Kaydee?

So...maybe I don't understand, but if someone comes at you with a gun (or some other weapon) with the intent to kill you on the battlefield (or even off it), what are you supposed to do? Just calmly talk to him? Explain the concept of moral relativity? I'm not quite sure I get what some of you are aiming at here.

[Ban Hammer 13,340]

You are familiar with the phrase "two wrongs don't make a right" I assume, Kaydee?

So...maybe I don't understand, but if someone comes at you with a gun (or some other weapon) with the intent to kill you on the battlefield (or even off it), what are you supposed to do? Just calmly talk to him? Explain the concept of moral relativity? I'm not quite sure I get what some of you are aiming at here.

[xjennyinstereox 0]

I find it hard to applaud murder. No matter who it is .

Perhaps we can persuade you to stay in Canada?

Well I am not in Canada so that would be a no. You sound like Bush....if you are not with us you are against us. Like a child in a sandbox. If you don't do what I want you can't play with me.

I agree with you Cristy!

[kaydee457 13]

You are familiar with the phrase "two wrongs don't make a right" I assume, Kaydee?

Lemme see....

We should not be there. We (the USA) are the problem and that's why they are there.

If we leave them alone, they will leave us alone.

We should immediately leave IRAQ, as well as Afghanistan as we have no business in either country.

We should ignore Islamist fascists as they pose no threat to us, or our way of life. They have demonstrated that to us many times in the past.

Yes, I see now. You're a liberal.

[ChristinaM 0]

Of course, one then gets back to the concept of whether we should be in there at all, and my feeling is that going into an un-UN-sanctioned war (a rather large wrong) was not the answer to 9/11 (also a pretty damn large wrong).

They may be murdering our troops over there, but if our troops were not there, they would not be. We may be murdering them over there, but there are surely better ways.

The comparison has been made to Vietnam (by either Marc or Charles on another thread on the front page today, so not by a flaming lefty ) - when does it become appropriate to admit that matching their wrongs with our own is not the answer? How many Allied troops have to be lost before those in charge realise that we're not having the desired effect?

Don't get me wrong - I'm not anti-troop. I admire them for their bravery. I believe they should be appropriately equipped to do their jobs; it's not fair to send them out without enough body armour and the like. But don't forget that they are doing a job - a job they have chosen to do. I also understand the principle of "kill or be killed" - and damn straight, if someone's shooting at me, I'm shooting back. But that doesn't make either of us right.

[Ban Hammer 13,340]

The comparison has been made to Vietnam (by either Marc or Charles on another thread on the front page today, so not by a flaming lefty )

to put it in proper perspective, my comparison to vietnam was in regards to the attention paid to those who deserted from the war

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.ph...=40608&st=0 post #2

[kaydee457 13]

They may be murdering our troops over there, but if our troops were not there, they would not be. We may be murdering them over there, but there are surely better ways.

The U.N. is a joke. We, the U.S.A. do not need U.N. approval to act in our interests.

I'm listening......What are the "better ways"?

[Ban Hammer 13,340]

They may be murdering our troops over there, but if our troops were not there, they would not be. We may be murdering them over there, but there are surely better ways.

The U.N. is a joke. We, the U.S.A. do not need U.N. approval to act in our interests.

I'm listening......What are the "better ways"?

get approval from france?

[ChristinaM 0]

You are familiar with the phrase "two wrongs don't make a right" I assume, Kaydee?

Lemme see....

We should not be there. We (the USA) are the problem and that's why they are there.

If we leave them alone, they will leave us alone.

We should immediately leave IRAQ, as well as Afghanistan as we have no business in either country.

We should ignore Islamist fascists as they pose no threat to us, or our way of life. They have demonstrated that to us many times in the past.

Yes, I see now. You're a liberal.

Since when has the word "Liberal" been a derogartoy term, Kaydee?! All it means to be "liberal" is to disagree with views such as yours - and I can live with that. As it happens, I'm neither a liberal nor a right-wing fanatic; since I'm the immigrant and not in a position to vote, I'm free to make up my own mind about things without feeling that I have a party line to follow.

The USA is part of the problem, whether you like it or not. Since "mission [is] accomplished", why are we still fighting? Why are we not in the reconstructive phase? Is it because the US and it's allies (namely my home country - of which I'm not proud) took the most heavy-handed approach possible in dealing with a problem without thinking it through, and as a result have angered many and spawned a new generation of terrorists?

I don't believe that we should ignore the threat of terrorism, but neither do I believe that we will ever rid the world of terrorists through the application of war. Violence simply begets more violence. Yes, regime change would be beneficial in certain countries, but who the hell gives the US the right to make that change? The United States of America is just that - it is not the United States of The World. You may not like the way that other countries operate, but they are sovereign entities, and have the right to govern themselves as they see fit. That is their right. The US has the right to govern the US and to protect herself, but not the right to become an occupation force and impose a government. There are increasing numbers of Iraqis who believe that they were better off under Saddam - and that is not a glowing indictment of the way that the US and her allies have behaved.

There is no sense in my continuing this discussion - my views are simply too far opposed to those of the far right wing as represented by you Kaydee, and also Charles and Marc. We're never going to meet in the middle. But that's ok; this is the land of the free, we're allowed not to agree with each other.

But do me a favour - treat my opinions with the same respect you want for yours. "Different" is not synonymous with "wrong".

[Ban Hammer 13,340]

There is no sense in my continuing this discussion - my views are simply too far opposed to those of the far right wing as represented by you Kaydee, and also Charles and Marc.

ah i'm in the far right wing?

so tell me then why i an pro choice then?

[ChristinaM 0]

The U.N. is a joke. We, the U.S.A. do not need U.N. approval to act in our interests.

However, by being a permanent member of the UN, the USA has the obligation to follow procedure and protocol. With rights (such as the power of veto) come responsibilities (such as following the rules).

There is no sense in my continuing this discussion - my views are simply too far opposed to those of the far right wing as represented by you Kaydee, and also Charles and Marc.

ah i'm in the far right wing?

so tell me then why i an pro choice then?

Because you have half a brain in your head?!

As far as war politics go, you're in the right wing hon. I'm sorry to break it to ya.

[Ban Hammer 13,340]

As far as war politics go, you're in the right wing hon. I'm sorry to break it to ya.

maybe that's cause i've been on that side of the fence, and i've got some experience there rather than talking outta my ####### about something i have no clue about

[Cristy 4]

The U.N. is a joke. We, the U.S.A. do not need U.N. approval to act in our interests.

wow. just wow.