Pearl Harbor 71st. Anniversary

[kytwell 179]

[Teddy B 17,252]

Today marks the 71st anniversary of the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor, perhaps the biggest world changing event in recent history. The attack on Pearl Harbor began the US military involvement in WW2. Many of my relatives fought in this war including my Grandfather and 4 Uncles, thankfully they all came home. My Grandfather received a Purple Heart when he was injured on a battle ship in the South Pacific.

Their are not many WW2 veterans still alive today. If you happen to know one, shake their hand and say thank you.

Edited December 7, 2012 by Teddy B

[Ban Hammer 13,346]

sadly, this topic/thread hasn't even gotten a reply all day until now

[lostinblue 1,989]

Some of us have said a prayer for the brave souls that died that day.

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

Today marks the 71st anniversary of the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor, perhaps the biggest world changing event in recent history. The attack on Pearl Harbor began the US military involvement in WW2. Many of my relatives fought in this war including my Grandfather and 4 Uncles, thankfully they all came home. My Grandfather received a Purple Heart when he was injured on a battle ship in the South Pacific.

Their are not many WW2 veterans still alive today. If you happen to know one, shake their hand and say thank you.

Amen.. They were our greatest generation.

[TBoneTX 45,309]

Some of us have said a prayer for the brave souls that died that day.

Si, man.

sadly, this topic/thread hasn't even gotten a reply all day until now

Perhaps partly because the thread title is missing the final letter of "Pearl," s ma.

[rlogan 2,036]

Robert Stinnett, in his book, Day of Deceit: The Truth About FDR and Pearl Harbor, proved with Freedom of Information Act inquiries that Roosevelt not only knew the attack was coming, but made sure to have the entire fleet in port so the bombing would be more successful, more lives would be lost, and enraged the public more.

This is hardly news, and the machinations of Roosevelt engineering us into war have long been well known.

The surprising thing revealed in the book is not that he knew, but how LONG before the attack he and other top officials knew, how much detail they had, and still some of the radio communications we had intercepted and decoded remain sealed. It's even worse than we know about.

That is indeed a lesson to remember, but the Sneak Attack myth is probably too deeply impressed on the public to dislodge.

[TBoneTX 45,309]

*** Thread moved from Off Topic to P&R. ***

[Bad_Daddy 2,209]

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

Robert Stinnett, in his book, Day of Deceit: The Truth About FDR and Pearl Harbor, proved with Freedom of Information Act inquiries that Roosevelt not only knew the attack was coming, but made sure to have the entire fleet in port so the bombing would be more successful, more lives would be lost, and enraged the public more.

This is hardly news, and the machinations of Roosevelt engineering us into war have long been well known.

The surprising thing revealed in the book is not that he knew, but how LONG before the attack he and other top officials knew, how much detail they had, and still some of the radio communications we had intercepted and decoded remain sealed. It's even worse than we know about.

That is indeed a lesson to remember, but the Sneak Attack myth is probably too deeply impressed on the public to dislodge.

And the movie final countdown was true and two F-14's could have stopped it. Gezzz

[Pooky 3,786]

And the movie final countdown was true and two F-14's could have stopped it. Gezzz

Doubt it all you want. The Japanese communications code was cracked very early on, well before Pearl Harbour.

Oh, and two F-14's would run out of ammunition shooting down less than 20% of the Japanese strike force.

[rlogan 2,036]

And the movie final countdown was true and two F-14's could have stopped it. Gezzz

Thanks! Perfect example of blind patriotism by a person who watches fiction movies as opposed to reading certified documents from his own government under the Freedom of Information Act. I've never seen this movie because I don't watch fiction like you do, nor read fiction.

What's so funny or tragic about this is the ignorati who operate on the basis of fictional movies immediately refer to that fiction as their knowledge base instead of history and facts - while accusing the historian of that very thing.

Patriotism is not blindly following leaders that lie to us and betray us. Occasionally we catch them in the act and do the right thing like Nixon in Watergate. Exposing them is our patriotic duty - not being their ignorant dupes. The book has hundreds of supporting documents, supplied by our own government. And it has been a long time coming with many precursors leading the way.

Admiral James O. Richardson objected to the entire fleet being bottled up as a sitting duck in Pearl Harbor, and he was summarily fired. Henry Stimson’s diary (Secretary of War) for November 25, 1941 recorded a meeting of FDR’s top advisors, stating: "The question was how we should maneuver them into firing the first shot without allowing too much danger to ourselves."

The most appalling information though is in the radio communications that had been decoded by the U.S. There was a Japanese spy attached to the Japanese Consulate in Hawaii that was making regular reports to his commander, all of which were interecepted and read by top U.S. officials. The original attack was scheduled for Dec. 8 according to the intercepts from Japanese Admiral Osami Nagano. They had been watching the attack unfold for a couple of weeks.

Naturally you are quite proud of your knowledge about fictional movies. I imagine you are also knowledgable in television programming like sitcoms and probably professional sports too, right? That's a lot to be proud of and ranks right up there with Jefferson, Madison, Franklin et al. They didn't blindly trust their government and were avid students of history and science. But there's the problem. Instead of having a country full of those kinds of people we have a country full of people watching the movies you watch, the television programs, the sports, and scoffing at history and science as if it were the fiction you are watching yourself.

[rlogan 2,036]

Please merge the two threads.

The greatest generation turned over Eastern Europe to the dictator Joseph Stalin, the greatest mass murderer of all time: 43 million people.

Long before Roosevelt happily turned over so many to this world record monster at Potsdam, Stalin had already undertaken massive purges and genocides - probably the most ghastly of which was perpetrated upon the Ukraine. In 1932-33 he stole their grain by force and caused an intentional famine of 6-7 million. Think about what a monster Hitler is portayed to be with his holocaust of similar numbers to that one single incident of Stalin's - yet Stalin was lovingly referred to as "Uncle Joe".

We need to be sober about what actually happened, how many of our people died in order to turn so many tens of millions over to one dictator instead of another. We still haven't learned, with Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, Syria now and wherever else we just enter wars without thinking through the consequences of the wars we have already fought. You can trace the origins of WWII back to WWI on behalf of the Germans and with respect to the Japanese there is a very good book called "Imperial Cruise" which traces Teddy Roosevelt's dispatching of Vice President Taft to encourage the Japanese to embark upon a hostile takeover of Manchuria and expand its empire by force - which they did, and the blowback was eventually more expansion than we had urged them to undertake.

My relatives fought too, and some died. Others fought in the Civil War, Korea, or have served in our modern permanent war establishment. I don't think we do them justice by failing to learn from our mistakes.