Official Does access to Guns cause Gun Crime Thread

[Bad_Daddy 2,209]

tell me what percentage of the swiss population is immigrant, please...

Go getem shooter !

[Usui Takumi 1,562]

1. Heller VS DC adn MacDonald VS Chicago obviate such

2. Same deal as 1

3.HR 822

4. egregious. i buy 20-30 firearms in a good month, adn know lots of people who do. half are handguns.

5. no need or validation with NICS

6. extension of federal rights over state rights. outside of federal purview. jim crow. ban by taxation

7. same as 6

8. BS. special class not under common law

9. ambivalent on this one, but credible

4-8 would impair commerce for law abiding and increase taxation, etc.

No. 4 - you shouldn't have a problem since you are a dealer, nor should anyone else not involved in a straw purchase. In fact, I would not even include dealers in such a system.

No. 5 - I am aware of a few cases where a person who may legally purchased a large quantity of firearms, the ATF noticed it was a straw purchase and with the waiting period they could have intercepted them in time. Therefore 4 & 5 are to work in tandem.

As to the general overview of 4-8, the way to go about it is allow voluntary inclusion by states but force them through other means...there are a few examples I can think of like this. Regarding taxation, if I'm not mistaken current states that require a transfer do so by not setting a fee...ie it could be done for free but its up to private businesses.

I don't quite understand your reference to Jim Crow in the context of number 6.

Finally with regards to my "give a little" comment, I believe you took that backwards to what I actually meant. I was referring to the state giving a little on current laws that restrict the type of firearms legal owners may possess.

Edited December 4, 2012 by Sousuke

[Penny Lane 8,159]

Go getem shooter !

Aw, a bromance.

[justashooter 430]

It almost felt like someone was telling me, "Go back to your country, immigrant!" lol.

I was almost speechless.

Thanks. I take things too personally, sometimes. I just need to learn to take it in stride I suppose.

don't be speachless, buddy, but do learn a little about the country you have immmigrated to before trying to "fix it".

the Declaration of Independence (1776) was written by 4 men and established a set of ideal realities.

the Constitution of the United States was written by many men, after much argument, and established a set of limitations on our government that protected the ideals. one of those limitations had to do with the federal government being prohibited from restricting gun ownership or use. most State Constitutions have very similar language. look it up.

the Ten Amendments (since expanded) place limitations on government to preserve our ideals. the Amendments are interrelated and interdependent in such a way that when you tinker with one, you risk all others.

it is interesting that the phrase "of the people" is used 6 times in the Ten Amendments, and has been identified as "of the national guard" only in one application by leftist liberals. it is interesting that most rights under the Ten Amendments are regarded as held under the "privileges and immunities" clause of the 14th Amendment. only in case of 5th and 2nd Amendment is the right subject to "due process". these deviations show us how far we already are "down the slippery slope". how much further down do you want to go? your right to free speach is only guaranteed by my right to go toe to toe with government military force.

be grateful that men suffered and died to protect for you a system of government that still serves the people, to one degree or another. in most countries people serve government. learn the value of a right before blithely throwing it away.

if you are geographically close and are uneducated about firearms and would like to become comfortable with them, send me a note. if you are too far away then look for someone experienced in the field to teach you how to handle a gun, how to make it a tool that serves you, instead of a mystery and fear. just look around. shooters are like that. they are good people, and take newbies under wing all the time. join the club, instead of feeling like you can't belong.

[Penny Lane 8,159]

don't be speachless, buddy, but do learn a little about the country you have immmigrated to before trying to "fix it".

Since when does having an opinion on an issue mean that someone is trying to change an entire country's belief system?

[justashooter 430]

No. 4 - you shouldn't have a problem since you are a dealer, nor should anyone else not involved in a straw purchase. In fact, I would not even include dealers in such a system.

No. 5 - I am aware of a few cases where a person who may legally purchased a large quantity of firearms, the ATF noticed it was a straw purchase and with the waiting period they could have intercepted them in time. Therefore 4 & 5 are to work in tandem.

I don't quite understand your reference to Jim Crow in the context of number 6.

i buy most of my business and personal guns at auction. lots of people do. at these auction houses an FFL processes NICS and 4473. lots of people buy up to 20 guns in a single day at these events, for personal use, or for resale.

if straw purchase occurs a crime has been committed. a paper trail is established by 4473 that ties to a drivers liscense or other state ID. law enforcement is simple from there on. why inconvenience 10,000 people to stop 1 crime in process that can be resolved after the fact?

jim crow laws are laws that effectively disenfranchise segments of the population by economic or other means. maryland's $250 CCW application process costs are jim crow. their "may issue" only to really well connected people policy is jim crow. the NFA 1938 Act is jim crow. so is any unreasonable scheme designed to keep a certain portion of the populace disenfranchised.

california's restrictive CCW laws go back to Reagan's governorship. they were designed to keep militant black panthers from carryign guns in public assembly. this is historical fact. it is also jim crow. laws already existed to deal with people who engaged in crimes of violence or intimidation in Ca. the CCW restriction was just designed to make kali police work easier...

[Penny Lane 8,159]

lots of people buy up to 20 guns in a single day at these events, for personal use, or for resale.

Genuinely curious - why would anybody need 20 guns for personal use?

[justashooter 430]

Since when does having an opinion on an issue mean that someone is trying to change an entire country's belief system?

opinions should be based on fact and reason. not on emotion. when a person speaks in public they should realise that they will be called on to rationalise their opinion, or let it fall by the wayside, with all the other rubbish produced in daily life.

as far as changing a country's belief system, well, we already have a political party that openly buys votes by promise of individual entitlement...this is how laws are made in any 3rd world $hithole. promise them "gas for they SUV", "obamaphones" and any other trinket it takes to get the power over the world's largest economy...obamaphones are a drop in the bucket, young friend. they are the smoke that enables the real "magic" to happen.

[^_^ 5,021]

Genuinely curious - why would anybody need 20 guns for personal use?

Same reason some women have 50 vibrators for personal use.

as far as changing a country's belief system, well, we already have a political party that openly buys votes by promise of individual entitlement...

awww, someone's still butthurt about the election

[Penny Lane 8,159]

opinions should be based on fact and reason. not on emotion. when a person speaks in public they should realise that they will be called on to rationalise their opinion, or let it fall by the wayside, with all the other rubbish produced in daily life.

as far as changing a country's belief system, well, we already have a political party that openly buys votes by promise of individual entitlement...this is how laws are made in any 3rd world $hithole. promise them "gas for they SUV", "obamaphones" and any other trinket it takes to get the power over the world's largest economy...obamaphones are a drop in the bucket, young friend. they are the smoke that enables the real "magic" to happen.

You say opinions should be based on fact and reason and then you go and make a statement like that? Seems a bit hypocritical to me.

[lostinblue 1,989]

$250 CCW application.... I never thought of this being racist liberals never brought this up. It is racist just to have to show a drivers licence to vote...Or any ID for that matter.It MUST be racist to need 250 for a CCW application.Where is the outrage from the libnuts.

[justashooter 430]

Genuinely curious - why would anybody need 20 guns for personal use?

gun are like women's shoes. nobody needs 20 different kinds and colors, but they do want them.

lots of people buy them for sentimental, historical, or mechanical interest. some people collect guns, some collect porcelain dolls, some collect comic books, some collect coins, stamps, snow globes, whatever they like.

this is America. you can do that here. revel in it!

[Penny Lane 8,159]

$250 CCW application.... I never thought of this being racist liberals never brought this up. It is racist just to have to show a drivers licence to vote...Or any ID for that matter.It MUST be racist to need 250 for a CCW application.Where is the outrage from the libnuts.

Who is talking about race in this thread? Other than you, I mean.

[^_^ 5,021]

$250 CCW application.... I never thought of this being racist liberals never brought this up. It is racist just to have to show a drivers licence to vote...Or any ID for that matter.It MUST be racist to need 250 for a CCW application.Where is the outrage from the libnuts.

IMO fees should be pegged to actual administrative cost of doing background checks, they shouldn't be punitive.

also - lower income households should be able to write those fees off.

[Penny Lane 8,159]

gun are like women's shoes. nobody needs 20 different kinds and colors, but they do want them.

lots of people buy them for sentimental, historical, or mechanical interest. some people collect guns, some collect porcelain dolls, some collect comic books, some collect coins, stamps, snow globes, whatever they like.

this is America. you can do that here. revel in it!

I only have five pairs of shoes. I must be missing something.

Oh, so America lets you collect things. What an amazing country this is.

Edited December 4, 2012 by Evylin