214b rejection and reapplication

[easymack63 0]

I am a Peace Corps Volunteer living in Ukraine and my boyfriend just applied for a B2 visa to visit my family in America. He was rejected because he did not prove strong ties to Ukraine. Unfortunately, we feel that this is not true but that he did not understand at the interview that he had to make a strong case for himself. He has the following ties:

FAMILY - a son (the officer knew about this), a large extended family in his hometown*, and he lives with his elderly aunt in order to help her out*

WORK - he is a building contractor (the officer knew this) and he already has a contract for when he returns from America, along with a letter from that employer*

PROPERTY - he has a house and car, which the officer knew but did not see documents for

(Things marked * were not mentioned in the first interview)

Also, at the first interview, the consular officer wanted to see a letter from me, his American girlfriend, inviting him to America. We had an invitation from my father (his financial sponsor) but no letter from me. Apparently they asked him for this letter 3 times and he had nothing to give.

At this point, we want to reapply and present all the arguments and evidence that we left out the first time, along with a letter of invitation from me. We plan to do this about a month after the first interview. Does this make sense? Does he stand a chance or are we just going to waste $160?

Thanks!

[himher 634]

They are looking for ties to the US as well to Ukraine

Your letter of invitation should include (background) proof of your status in Ukraine and if this is just a visit (the two of you) SOMETHING that shows that not only he but you are coming back. Not submitted, just available at interview.

With the additional proof of ties to the Ukraine this MAY put you over the top.

Is it possible to attend the interview with him? Some embassies/consulates allow and some do not..

Edited November 17, 2012 by himher

[C-ma'am 684]

Your father cannot be his financial sponsor for this visit. He needs to prove that he has sufficient funds to cover his own trip and expenses.

[jaycali 415]

I am a Peace Corps Volunteer living in Ukraine and my boyfriend just applied for a B2 visa to visit my family in America. He was rejected because he did not prove strong ties to Ukraine. Unfortunately, we feel that this is not true but that he did not understand at the interview that he had to make a strong case for himself. He has the following ties:FAMILY - a son (the officer knew about this), a large extended family in his hometown*, and he lives with his elderly aunt in order to help her out*WORK - he is a building contractor (the officer knew this) and he already has a contract for when he returns from America, along with a letter from that employer*PROPERTY - he has a house and car, which the officer knew but did not see documents for(Things marked * were not mentioned in the first interview)Also, at the first interview, the consular officer wanted to see a letter from me, his American girlfriend, inviting him to America. We had an invitation from my father (his financial sponsor) but no letter from me. Apparently they asked him for this letter 3 times and he had nothing to give. At this point, we want to reapply and present all the arguments and evidence that we left out the first time, along with a letter of invitation from me. We plan to do this about a month after the first interview. Does this make sense? Does he stand a chance or are we just going to waste $160?Thanks!

Whether it'll be approved or not, no one here can tell you. However, if you have additional evidence, as it seems that you do this time, it's not a long shot.

If you live in Ukraine, it may help if you can go along with him too, as you seem to be his strongest tie to the US. If you actually live in Ukraine and can prove your own ties there, it'll be difficult to use that against him.

[aaron2020 11,651]

I am a Peace Corps Volunteer living in Ukraine and my boyfriend just applied for a B2 visa to visit my family in America. He was rejected because he did not prove strong ties to Ukraine. Unfortunately, we feel that this is not true but that he did not understand at the interview that he had to make a strong case for himself. He has the following ties:

FAMILY - a son (the officer knew about this), a large extended family in his hometown*, and he lives with his elderly aunt in order to help her out*

WORK - he is a building contractor (the officer knew this) and he already has a contract for when he returns from America, along with a letter from that employer*

PROPERTY - he has a house and car, which the officer knew but did not see documents for

(Things marked * were not mentioned in the first interview)

Also, at the first interview, the consular officer wanted to see a letter from me, his American girlfriend, inviting him to America. We had an invitation from my father (his financial sponsor) but no letter from me. Apparently they asked him for this letter 3 times and he had nothing to give.

At this point, we want to reapply and present all the arguments and evidence that we left out the first time, along with a letter of invitation from me. We plan to do this about a month after the first interview. Does this make sense? Does he stand a chance or are we just going to waste $160?

Thanks!

You have to look at his situation through the eyes of the consular officer who is charged with filtering out potential illegal immigrants.

While you feel that your boyfriend has strong ties to the Ukraine. Those same points can lead to a different conclusion.

For example; He and his son lives with his aunt because he cannot afford his own place. You don't make enough as a Peace Corp Volunteer to petition for a fiancee or spouse to immigrate to the US. There is willingness on your father's part to support him. A job in the Ukraine is easy to give up if he perceives he has better financial opportunities in the US. It's not impossible to sell property in the Ukraine while he is in the US.

I am not saying that is the conclusion made by the CO. All I am saying is that general statements without details can be reasonably interpreted many ways. It will be the details that matters.

Yes, this is a very cynical look at his situation. However, it does occur and the officer has to be on the look out for it. If it wasn't for the high fraud level in the Ukraine, visitor visas would not be a problem. You can blame the difficulties of getting a visitor visa on the high fraud committed by Ukrainians.

There is high fraud in Vietnam too. That's why it's almost impossible for my relatives to visit the US too. My relatives are measured up against other Vietnamese who have had visitor visas. If people who are similar to them who have abused the visitor visas, they are less likely to be get them. That's just the reality of life.

Edited November 17, 2012 by aaron2020

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

I am a Peace Corps Volunteer living in Ukraine and my boyfriend just applied for a B2 visa to visit my family in America. He was rejected because he did not prove strong ties to Ukraine. Unfortunately, we feel that this is not true but that he did not understand at the interview that he had to make a strong case for himself. He has the following ties:

FAMILY - a son (the officer knew about this), a large extended family in his hometown*, and he lives with his elderly aunt in order to help her out*

WORK - he is a building contractor (the officer knew this) and he already has a contract for when he returns from America, along with a letter from that employer*

PROPERTY - he has a house and car, which the officer knew but did not see documents for

(Things marked * were not mentioned in the first interview)

Also, at the first interview, the consular officer wanted to see a letter from me, his American girlfriend, inviting him to America. We had an invitation from my father (his financial sponsor) but no letter from me. Apparently they asked him for this letter 3 times and he had nothing to give.

At this point, we want to reapply and present all the arguments and evidence that we left out the first time, along with a letter of invitation from me. We plan to do this about a month after the first interview. Does this make sense? Does he stand a chance or are we just going to waste $160?

Thanks!

Not gonna work.

Best bet? Apply for a Shengen visa, take a short trip to an EU country. Poland works. Come back and apply for the US visa again referencing the Shengen visa.

[Noah Lot 391]

(a) you will not be able to accompany him to a new interview because the interview is for the applicants only, no one else. You cannot 'vouch' for him. All those things you mentioned are not absolute proof of his return. The job is a nebulous letter that has no legal hold over him nor the 'employer.' A house can be sold, same for a car. Taking care of an aunt...well....seems she can do just fine while he visits, so why can't she do just fine if he doesn't?

Also, the first interview, with you not being mentioned (but no doubt somebody figured it out) now makes it look at though he is trying to conceal something (your presence/relationship)....and that will likely cause doubt. Doubt will sink most visa requests.

(b) if he lacks the resources to finance his own trip, that is generally not a good thing from a working age adult. And of course, the CO was seeing through the 'sponsorship' letter....why would a total stranger shell out $$$ for a trip for someone he doesn't even know? (or at least, that's probably what it looked like at the interview since they kept asking for something about you but it was never produced)...

Edited November 17, 2012 by Noah Lot

[Moomin 292]

Not gonna work.

Best bet? Apply for a Shengen visa, take a short trip to an EU country. Poland works. Come back and apply for the US visa again referencing the Shengen visa.

I've seen this advise before. To elaborate, it's to demonstrate that the applicant returns to home country and is more likely to be trusted with a tourist(NON-immigrant) visa to other countries.

[easymack63 0]

They are looking for ties to the US as well to Ukraine

Your letter of invitation should include (background) proof of your status in Ukraine and if this is just a visit (the two of you) SOMETHING that shows that not only he but you are coming back. Not submitted, just available at interview.

With the additional proof of ties to the Ukraine this MAY put you over the top.

Is it possible to attend the interview with him? Some embassies/consulates allow and some do not..

Thanks for the response. I submitted a letter from the Peace Corps explaining that Im a PCV and that I am obligated to stay in this country until January 2014. I thought since we were travelling together, and in combination with the multitude of documents from my dad, that would prove he would come back with me.

I dont know if its possible to attend the interview - I believe not, but I will definitely try the second time around.

Thanks!

[easymack63 0]

Thanks for the responses, everybody.

Your letter of invitation should include (background) proof of your status in Ukraine and if this is just a visit (the two of you) SOMETHING that shows that not only he but you are coming back. Not submitted, just available at interview.

I submitted a letter from the Peace Corps explaining that Im a PCV and that I am obligated to stay in this country until January 2014. I thought since we were travelling together, and in combination with the multitude of documents from my dad, that would prove he would come back with me.

Is it possible to attend the interview with him? Some embassies/consulates allow and some do not..

I dont know if its possible to attend the interview - I believe not, but I will definitely try the second time around.

Your father cannot be his financial sponsor for this visit. He needs to prove that he has sufficient funds to cover his own trip and expenses.

At the first interview, they didnt say anything like this. They accepted all the documents from my father as his sponsor and had no questions or problems. Does anyone else have experience with this?

You have to look at his situation through the eyes of the consular officer who is charged with filtering out potential illegal immigrants.

While you feel that your boyfriend has strong ties to the Ukraine. Those same points can lead to a different conclusion.

For example; He and his son lives with his aunt because he cannot afford his own place. You don't make enough as a Peace Corp Volunteer to petition for a fiancee or spouse to immigrate to the US. There is willingness on your father's part to support him. A job in the Ukraine is easy to give up if he perceives he has better financial opportunities in the US. It's not impossible to sell property in the Ukraine while he is in the US.

I understand that this is their job, but I dont know how to explain things so that it looks good. For example, he lives with his aunt in order to help her out because she is elderly - he also owns his own home and is fixing it up. We DO plan to go to the US on a fiance visa but only much later, when I am done with my Peace Corps service. He just wants to meet my family and return with me, since my return is obligatory. How can we change the way they look at these facts? Ugh Its so frustrating.

Not gonna work.

Best bet? Apply for a Shengen visa, take a short trip to an EU country. Poland works. Come back and apply for the US visa again referencing the Shengen visa.

Yes, that would be ideal but we dont have time or money for that. We had planned to travel together to America in February. If he cant get this tourist visa, we will just have to wait until I return to America for good and do a fiancee visa. And why do you feel that it wont work?

Taking care of an aunt...well....seems she can do just fine while he visits, so why can't she do just fine if he doesn't?

She also has an elderly brother in this town and he will be helping her on a temporary basis for the month we are in America. Since he was rejected on the basis of not having connections here, I cant believe that a large extended family that relies on him is not a connection.

Also, the first interview, with you not being mentioned (but no doubt somebody figured it out) now makes it look at though he is trying to conceal something (your presence/relationship)....and that will likely cause doubt. Doubt will sink most visa requests.

He definitely did mention me at the first interview. We were honest about everything. I just didnt give him a letter because I thought it was enough to get one from my father. He did, however, have my passport and documents about me from the Peace Corps.

If he lacks the resources to finance his own trip, that is generally not a good thing from a working age adult. And of course, the CO was seeing through the 'sponsorship' letter....why would a total stranger shell out $$$ for a trip for someone he doesn't even know? (or at least, that's probably what it looked like at the interview since they kept asking for something about you but it was never produced)...

Of course its not ideal that he doesnt have enough money, but he lives and works in Ukraine where the average monthly income is a little under $200. The sponsorship letter came from my father and we presented evidence, including documents and pictures, that my boyfriend knows me and my father is the sponsor. It wasnt just some random person. That said, I do understand that the letter would have been an important document and I hope it will help next time.

So now, having hopefully explained myself a bit better, what do you all think? Do we stand a chance? Thanks!

[Stressed Out 81]

If you decide to reapply the most important thing is of course to give the officer the impression that you are financially stable in Ukraine and that you both have work waiting for you when you return. A formal letter from his company showing proof of vacation (or bringing a copy of the work contract you said he has for when he's back home) shows that he's not the only one aware of his travel plans. Even if your father is paying his way, don't bring anything that shows that he himself cannot afford the trip. We made that huge mistake the first time my husband applied for a tourist visa when we were just engaged...he told/showed the officer proof of his father paying for his trip. Last week when we reapplied we didn't even have to show documentation.

Perhaps you can also write to a state Congressman's constituent division like I did. They will want to hear your case of course and if they find it legitimate (as your case appears to be) then they can fax a letter to the Consulate to note his case and to take care with him. That's all that they can do for you, but I strongly believe it makes a difference when you're dealing with the average consular officer.

[Noah Lot 391]

If you decide to reapply the most important thing is of course to give the officer the impression that you are financially stable in Ukraine and that you both have work waiting for you when you return. A formal letter from his company showing proof of vacation (or bringing a copy of the work contract you said he has for when he's back home) shows that he's not the only one aware of his travel plans. Even if your father is paying his way, don't bring anything that shows that he himself cannot afford the trip. We made that huge mistake the first time my husband applied for a tourist visa when we were just engaged...he told/showed the officer proof of his father paying for his trip. Last week when we reapplied we didn't even have to show documentation.

Perhaps you can also write to a state Congressman's constituent division like I did. They will want to hear your case of course and if they find it legitimate (as your case appears to be) then they can fax a letter to the Consulate to note his case and to take care with him. That's all that they can do for you, but I strongly believe it makes a difference when you're dealing with the average consular officer.

letters from congressmen have NO influence over a CO's decision....remember, Congress is in the Legislative branch of government; State Dept is in the Executive branch...thus, no congressman is empowered to tell someone from another branch of govt what to do.

One of the things COs look at is the nature of one's compelling economic reasons to return to one's country...a salary of a whopping $200 a month is not a compelling economic reason to head back to Ukraine....not having enough $$ to even pay for the taxi from the airport will not impress the CO...letters from the Peace Corps are NOT binding upon your BF....as I mentioned before, you cannot vouch for him, they cannot vouch for him nor can any congressman vouch for him....imagine how many young Ukranian adults have conveniently forgotten to return to their $200 a month job, their elderly aunt or a home in a state of disrepair....

you have already given a reason why the elderly aunt is not a tie...there is another relative on hand to care for her, so why is your BF required to return to do so?

The case is very very weak...and you cannot make it stronger yourself, nor can any other third party.

Edited November 18, 2012 by Noah Lot

[easymack63 0]

letters from congressmen have NO influence over a CO's decision....remember, Congress is in the Legislative branch of government; State Dept is in the Executive branch...thus, no congressman is empowered to tell someone from another branch of govt what to do.

One of the things COs look at is the nature of one's compelling economic reasons to return to one's country...a salary of a whopping $200 a month is not a compelling economic reason to head back to Ukraine....not having enough $$ to even pay for the taxi from the airport will not impress the CO...letters from the Peace Corps are NOT binding upon your BF....as I mentioned before, you cannot vouch for him, they cannot vouch for him nor can any congressman vouch for him....imagine how many young Ukranian adults have conveniently forgotten to return to their $200 a month job, their elderly aunt or a home in a state of disrepair....

you have already given a reason why the elderly aunt is not a tie...there is another relative on hand to care for her, so why is your BF required to return to do so?

The case is very very weak...and you cannot make it stronger yourself, nor can any other third party.

So basically what youre telling me is that its impossible for the average Ukrainian, who makes a small amount despite working full time, to travel to the United States even if they have someone who is paying for everything? That seems wrong. I know a number of people who have left my small village and gone to America on tourist visas.

[Boiler 45,995]

Not impossible, unlikely.

[Noah Lot 391]

So basically what youre telling me is that its impossible for the average Ukrainian, who makes a small amount despite working full time, to travel to the United States even if they have someone who is paying for everything? That seems wrong. I know a number of people who have left my small village and gone to America on tourist visas.

What I said is that the odds are against it, because of all the factors I mentioned...and that's just the way it is....and how many of those same people returned? 1? 4? (of course, you will say they all did, but then, you cannot prove it).

Or are you saying that no Ukranian citizen has ever overstayed? (since you wish to use extremes)

So basically what youre telling me is that its impossible for the average Ukrainian, who makes a small amount despite working full time, to travel to the United States even if they have someone who is paying for everything? That seems wrong. I know a number of people who have left my small village and gone to America on tourist visas.

And it's not the 'going to America' that matters....it's the 'returning to their village' afterwards that matters.