Question on marrying in pi

[GaryKO 49]

The Embassy consuls also know that you can't pick up your marriage license until the 11th day after your application. If your travel documents show you were not even in the country at that time you should have applied someone could cause a lot of trouble for you. It sounds like you found a rare spot of luck in a country rife with corruption in the civil offices and no one called you out on it. You are the first person I have heard of that didn't use bribes or favors and successfully bypassed the queue. I do wonder though about how you 'asked the right people'. Did your fiance or someone in her family know someone in the municipality that used their influence to bypass the waiting time? That's the type of favors and nepotism I am talking about as well. Using anything, whether it is money, charm, or influence to bypass the daily bureaucracy is what makes any sort of reform in the Philippines so difficult. Everyone seems to overlook it and expect people to break the rules just to get anything done.

I am curious, did you also manage to bypass the mandatory Family Planning seminar required to apply for the marriage license as well?

Getting around the 10 day waiting period is not the normal process, but it is done sometimes for one reason of another. I know of a few other couples that had to get married early because their timeline would just not work with waiting 10 days after applying for the marriage license, or they decided to get married instead going the K1 visa route on the first meeting. Yes we had the family planning seminar, but that was done a few days before getting married. In my case we were married 3 days early because of weather, a typhoon was arriving on our planned wedding day and would have messed up the outside wedding. The same people who issue the marriage license, are the same people who fill out the papers and report the marriage. Yeah everyone knows everyone there, it is a small municipality. The waiting time sucks, but in the only country in the world that does not allow divorce I can understand this, so reforming this will never happen.

Of course the Philippines is corrupt, if you put money in the right hands, or if you know the right people you can get about anything, just like in the USA.....

[JoBri 548]

Well, me and my wife married in the Philippines on my 3rd day there and we didnt pay any bribes to anyone. If you research what needs done in advance, get the appropriate forms and mail them back and forth across the ocean with all the correct info in advance, and get all the people to sign off on it in the USA too, then you can do it rather quickly...as we did, as well. Five years ago this coming January 15.

Someone must have paid some heavy bribes in that case. Manila City Hall is especially harsh these days in enforcing the 10 day waiting period before you can pick up the license.

If you are planning on a civil marriage in the Philippines you need to make sure you plan enough time. You can do it in the 21 days a tourist visa allows, but it's not much trouble to spend the extra money to apply for a visa extension. Just visit the Bureau of Immigration when you get a chance before your 21 day visa expires and pay P3030 for an additional 38 days.

If however you are planning on a Catholic wedding you will need a LOT more paperwork. You will need Baptismal certificates for you and your fiance, a dispensation from the Bishop if you are not Catholic, and you will have to wait at least three weeks AFTER you have acquired the marriage license for the posting of the banns (you can get married on the fourth week after the banns are posted).

As others have said, once you marry your K-1 application is immediately null and void. You will have to start all over with a CR-1 visa application. The time to complete a CR-1 usually takes around the same time as a K-1.

Edited November 16, 2012 by Brijo

[JoBri 548]

No family planning seminar if both are old enough, as my wife and I were.

The Embassy consuls also know that you can't pick up your marriage license until the 11th day after your application. If your travel documents show you were not even in the country at that time you should have applied someone could cause a lot of trouble for you. It sounds like you found a rare spot of luck in a country rife with corruption in the civil offices and no one called you out on it. You are the first person I have heard of that didn't use bribes or favors and successfully bypassed the queue. I do wonder though about how you 'asked the right people'. Did your fiance or someone in her family know someone in the municipality that used their influence to bypass the waiting time? That's the type of favors and nepotism I am talking about as well. Using anything, whether it is money, charm, or influence to bypass the daily bureaucracy is what makes any sort of reform in the Philippines so difficult. Everyone seems to overlook it and expect people to break the rules just to get anything done.

I am curious, did you also manage to bypass the mandatory Family Planning seminar required to apply for the marriage license as well?

[Artisan 138]

No family planning seminar if both are old enough, as my wife and I were.

False, all couples regardless of age are legally required to attend the seminar to acquire a marriage license. Having someone sign off that you attended because they are not following procedure is not the same. The only thing age gets you out of is the parental permission/advisory requirement. Attendance in a pre-marital counseling and family planning seminar has no age limitations and signing off on a marriage license without the certification is illegal.

I would also like to point out that acquiring a marriage license cannot be done legally without being able to physically swear in front of the civil registrar and having the license application posted for 10 days in public. Anyone that has somehow bypassed those requirements is breaking the law. Despite that fact, it happens all the time and the problem is compounded by foreigners that use money and charm to skirt the rules. This makes it even more frustrating for people that want to follow the rules but are pestered by officials that assume everyone wants to avoid the queue and don't mind paying for the privilege.

The simple fact is that if you somehow managed to avoid either the 10 day waiting period and/or the family planning seminar you encountered people that didn't do their jobs properly and broke numerous laws to accommodate you.

Edited November 16, 2012 by Artisan

[Tahoma 2,292]

Here is my understanding of a legal way to speed up the process:

1. You can inquire at your local civil registry about the process. You can either get a marriage license application form from the local civil registrar or, in some cases, you can download a marriage license application form. I believe Quezon City is one of the cities that has the form online.

2. The U.S. citizen fills out the form and takes it to a Philippines Consulate in the U.S. for authentication.

3. The U.S. citizen sends the authenticated marriage license application form to his fiancée in the Philippines along with a photocopy of his passport, a certified copy of any divorce papers, and any of the other usual requirements. The fiancée submits everything to the local civil registrar.

4. When the fiancée submits the paperwork to the local civil registrar, she informs them that the U.S. citizen will submit his Affidavit in Lieu of Certificate of Legal Capacity to Contract Marriage when he arrives in the Philippines.

5. The U.S. citizen books an appointment with the U.S. Embassy Manila in order to get his Affidavit in Lieu of Certificate of Legal Capacity to Contract Marriage. When the U.S. citizen arrives in the Manila, he immediately picks up the Affidavit at the Embassy.

6. The couple proceeds to the local civil registrar and submits the Affidavit. The marriage license is granted. They can get married immediately.

It's my understanding that those over 25 years old do not have to attend the family planning class. I can't find anything in the Philippines Family Code to verify this. However, it's been posted here on VJ more than once.

I hope those who have used this shortcut will chime in and add corrections or details based upon their experience.

[JoBri 548]

Hmm, well, ok. I guess Quezon City and us broke the law. At the time we got married we asked about the family planning and Quezon City City Hall told us that we could attend the family planning, nothing prohibitted us from doing so. But that as long as we both were over 24 years old it wasnt required to do so to get married. So the judge at Quezon City City Hall married us. I guess he doesnt know the law as well as you do... So sad. I think someone needs to inform Quezon City City Hall of their error. At any rate, we never personally were required to attend family planning, at least not by the judge at City Hall, and he married us. I guess we got lucky.

"*(There is no age limit for Family Planning, however couples 24 years and below need to attend Family Planning Sessions, and Marriage counseling. "

http://www.quezoncity.gov.ph/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=261%3Acivilregguide&catid=79&Itemid=305

False, all couples regardless of age are legally required to attend the seminar to acquire a marriage license. Having someone sign off that you attended because they are not following procedure is not the same. The only thing age gets you out of is the parental permission/advisory requirement. Attendance in a pre-marital counseling and family planning seminar has no age limitations and signing off on a marriage license without the certification is illegal.

I would also like to point out that acquiring a marriage license cannot be done legally without being able to physically swear in front of the civil registrar and having the license application posted for 10 days in public. Anyone that has somehow bypassed those requirements is breaking the law. Despite that fact, it happens all the time and the problem is compounded by foreigners that use money and charm to skirt the rules. This makes it even more frustrating for people that want to follow the rules but are pestered by officials that assume everyone wants to avoid the queue and don't mind paying for the privilege.

The simple fact is that if you somehow managed to avoid either the 10 day waiting period and/or the family planning seminar you encountered people that didn't do their jobs properly and broke numerous laws to accommodate you.

[JoBri 548]

But maybe Quezon City neglected to update their web site in these 5 years since we got married. At any rate, you can congratulate us on our 5 year anniversary, in spite of my ignorance. It is coming up soon!

"*(There is no age limit for Family Planning, however couples 24 years and below need to attend Family Planning Sessions, and Marriage counseling. "

http://www.quezoncit...d=79&Itemid=305

Hmm, that is from quezoncity.gov.ph. Sounds sort of official, dont you think? I guess they gave us a break (somehow?). Lucky us

Edited November 16, 2012 by Brijo

[CJ8611 6]

No family planning seminar if both are old enough, as my wife and I were.

Same here! Also know a few couples who weren't required to attend the seminar at the municipal office, as deemed "old enough" already.

[Artisan 138]

Hmm, that is from quezoncity.gov.ph. Sounds sort of official, dont you think? I guess they gave us a break (somehow?). Lucky us

Yes, lucky you. Nothing in Philippine law has changed Presidential Decree 965. The law specifically requires ALL couples seeking a marriage license "to receive instructions and information on family planning and responsible parenthood from the Family Planning Office". If you look at the Manila Civil Registry they list the requirements for anyone above the age of 21 as:

A Birth Certificate (Local copy if born in Manila or an NSO copy if born outside Manila, a Baptismal Certificate may be used in lieu of a birth certificate if at least one of the people being married is a resident of Manila)

A Valid ID (Original and Xerox)

Parental Advice if required necessitates the presence of the parent with ID

Marriage Counselling Certificate (provided by the Manila Health Department or the DSWD)

Neither the Quezon City or Manila Civil Registry lists a CENOMAR as a requirement for a marriage license, but that's required as well by both offices.

Perhaps Quezon City civil servants like to bend the rules because they can often get away with it. Claiming that because a judge went ahead with the ceremony makes it legal doesn't make him any less responsible for breaking Philippine law. It is often common for people to just not care about the rules, it doesn't invalidate the rules it just means when people might not expect them to be enforced it can come back to haunt them. Count yourself lucky that the bureaucrats in Quezon City are so nonchalant compared to the ones in Manila and Catanduanes (where I obtained my marriage certificate and was married respectively).

The point I am making in all of this is that too often in this forum people spread their tales of breaking the rules as if it is what others should expect. What people need to be told is the precise procedures to follow without shortcuts so they won't find themselves in trouble if they actually come across bureaucrats that actually do their jobs correctly.

[apple21 953]

When two people decide to get married, they do so because apart from their desire to become husband and wife, they want the state to fully recognize their marital union, so do it correctly. No to bribery, no shortcuts!

[Tahoma 2,292]

Let's explore the Quezon City link a bit further. Here's what it says:

Requirements:

I.FOR MARRIAGE LICENSES (Counter 10)

Birth or Baptismal Certificates of both applicants. If widowed, death certificate of demise spouse, if previous marriage was annulled, copy of Court Decision and absolute Decree of Finality from the Court,

Community Tax Certificates of both applicants, male and female;

One ID photo (colored or black and white) of each applicant, male and female;

Certificate of Family Planning and Marriage Counseling*

*(There is no age limit for Family Planning, however couples 24 years and below need to attend Family Planning Sessions, and Marriage counseling. These sessions are scheduled for one-half day within the premises of the City Hall. (Inquire from any of the office clerks at Counters 8, 9, & 10 about the details)

If applicant is a Foreigner, requirements are:

Valid Passport;

Certificate of legal capacity to marry issued by their respective diplomatic or consular officials;

If divorced, copy of Final Decree of Absolute Divorce;

Certificate of Family Planning & Marriage Counseling & Responsible Parenthood.

Quezon City link.

[JoBri 548]

Well, I just sit here and smile. Life is good to me, what can I say? Tah tah

[Tahoma 2,292]

Well, I just sit here and smile. Life is good to me, what can I say? Tah tah

Thank you for acknowledging that you misquoted your link.

[JoBri 548]

I never "misquoted" any link. I saw 5 years ago there was an asteric there in that link about needing a family planning seminar if 24 years old or below. I also saw that the asteric wasnt there for those under the category of foreigner. When I arrived in the Philippines I was prepared to do whatever was required legally to do to get married. My thoughts were that I would probably have to do the family planning. So I called the appropriate phone number to make the arrangements for family planning seminar. Of course I was a foreigner, I am an American, for Pete's sake! So I am ignorant about a lot of things pertaining to Filipino law. But I was doing the best I knew how to do. And when I called that number, the person on the other end told me that I didnt need to go to the family planning, that it was required for only those 24 and younger. And so we didnt go, since the person in authority told us that. We went to the judge the following day, and he married us, without the family planning. And I am just stating all of the above, because that is how it worked out in our case. So get off my back. there was no deception, no bribery, no trying to get around anything. . Just me trying to do the right thing and depending on people in the Philippines to help me. And I relayed my story here of what happened for us.

Thank you for acknowledging that you misquoted your link.

[Louis and Aya 17]

Thank you all for your input. I decided to just go the K1 route.

Thanks again.