More kids with second marriage?

[sarah and hicham 3]

One more assumption that is taken as a "given" - that an ME/NA man who marries a young woman isn't using her, even if she can have kids.

I have never seen this assumption made. I think everone realizes there is a risk in these relationships regardless of how "normal" one may seem on the surface. I do think people feel that when there is a large age difference, the risk may be higher but not that it is exclusive to those relationships. I also think that people would say the same if the guy is Muslim and the women shows disdain for Islam (as has been debated here in the past).

I agree with this.

Alright, I'll be totally honest. I'll admit I do hold some stereotypes when it comes to relationships with large age differences, particularly through Morocco. It's a combination of different things of course. When I see a young Moroccan male (who typically, though not always will want to have children) meet an older USC female (often online because that's the easiest way) and marry her within a short time, I can't help but be suspicious. Call me narrow minded, that's just how it is.

Jenn I'm with ya there.

It's amazing to me how many responses there were this morning when I woke up. The sensitivity speaks volumes!!!

I was wondering what would happen if everyone asked their husband what they think about a man from their country marrying a woman 20 years older. How about we all ask and then post their responses?

Anyways I think some people have assumed that I think it's "abnormal" for ALL couples which is not the case. I said some men just don't want to have kids and are happy having a loving wife. I think it's interesting to see just who is getting defensive with this conversation.

Have a good one!

Sarah

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Defensiveness is in the eye of the beholder. I don't see the discussion as defensive vs. offensive, but an examination of the thought process behind certain assumptions presented in certain comments. If speaking of what we see is being called defensive, then the other side is deemed to be called offensive, and I doubt very much that that is their intent.

I was wondering what would happen if everyone asked their husband what they think about a man from their country marrying a woman 20 years older. How about we all ask and then post their responses?

And this would accomplish what since we have already determined that a proportion of the men we are with are liars out to use the woman they are with?

Edited October 29, 2006 by szsz

[sarah and hicham 3]

Defensiveness is in the eye of the beholder. I don't see the discussion as defensive vs. offensive, but an examination of the thought process behind certain assumptions presented in certain comments. If speaking of what we see is being called defensive, then the other side is deemed to be called offensive, and I doubt very much that that is their intent.

I was wondering what would happen if everyone asked their husband what they think about a man from their country marrying a woman 20 years older. How about we all ask and then post their responses?

And this would accomplish what since we have already determined that a porportion of the men we are with are liars out to use the woman they are with?

I agree with you that it is a discussion of different assumptions presented in different comments but just seeing how many replies there are seems somewhat defensive to me.

I am in no way being offensive. I find it interesting to see who replies and what they have to say.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Ok, but categorizing replies as defensive sets a tone that implies hostility between us, Sarah, when the discussion could also be characterized as sharing and instructive. Do you not see that?

Edited October 29, 2006 by szsz

[Caladan 19]

Couple points:

1) There's a difference between noting or understanding that an age gap is unusual for a culture and endorsing the mindset that goes behind it. I could explain the mindset of a 12th-century monk without endorsing it, and I could use it to predict his behavior. I could learn about what motivates a serial killer, and use that knowledge to lay a trap for him. Same sort of thing here. I don't have to believe that young pure women are highly valued in order to recognize that it's important in some cultures.

2) While it's true that menopause doesn't happen till much later in life, fertility starts to decline much sooner. My mom, for example, is still only perimenopausal at age 50, but started having problems with her pregnancies at age 33. Celebrity women still pump out babies in their late forties and fifties, but it's probably worth keeping mind that there's a fair amount of assisted reproductive therapies going on. The rough line is around 35 for peak fertility. It all depends on the individual after that, but it's just not true that a 47 year old woman is just as fertile as a 22 year old.

[morocco4ever 63]

Ok, but categorizing replies as defensive sets a tone that implies hostility between us, Sarah, when the discussion could also be characterized as sharing and instructive. Do you not see that?

True, it does have the ring of implying hostility, but I assume that wasn't Sarah's intention. She is just a tad mischevious, nothing more nothing less. I don't feel defensive about it at all, just rather amused, and I find the discussion quite interesting. I have known since I got married that most everyone that doesn't know my husband and I personally are going to assume it was for the golden green card.

The one I didn't guess is that people would assume he is a boy toy. Again, no offense taken, just amused.

[Together4ever 1]

Defensiveness is in the eye of the beholder. I don't see the discussion as defensive vs. offensive, but an examination of the thought process behind certain assumptions presented in certain comments. If speaking of what we see is being called defensive, then the other side is deemed to be called offensive, and I doubt very much that that is their intent.

I was wondering what would happen if everyone asked their husband what they think about a man from their country marrying a woman 20 years older. How about we all ask and then post their responses?

And this would accomplish what since we have already determined that a porportion of the men we are with are liars out to use the woman they are with?

I agree with you that it is a discussion of different assumptions presented in different comments but just seeing how many replies there are seems somewhat defensive to me.

I am in no way being offensive. I find it interesting to see who replies and what they have to say.

Assuming defensiveness, and I agree with szsz I have seen none, is taking an offensive stance even if only slightly so.

I am with szsz in her opinions and I think that there are women on this board who are just weary of the implication and assumptions. That's the only defensiveness I've seen, if it can even be called that. But as is human nature, people will find whatever it is they are looking for, and not necessarily that which is the truth.

This has been a great discussion and I've enjoyed reading most of the posts. Its good to be reminded that this is not a cookie cutter world, that a generalization is flimsy at best, and we are all individuals.

I also find it interesting to note how rigidly some attitudes hold that what was a cultural standard cannot change, and if it does, then it is fraudelent intention that changes it. There is one universal constant... and that is change. It's inevitable, and it will always meet with equal resistance.

Edited October 29, 2006 by just_waiting

[sarah and hicham 3]

Ok, but categorizing replies as defensive sets a tone that implies hostility between us, Sarah, when the discussion could also be characterized as instructive. Do you not see that?

Can you explain to me how it is instructive ?

Also I don't think I am being hostile in any way? Why would I be? I am curious to read your answers and others who are married to younger men, is that bad?

Ok, but categorizing replies as defensive sets a tone that implies hostility between us, Sarah, when the discussion could also be characterized as sharing and instructive. Do you not see that?

True, it does have the ring of implying hostility, but I assume that wasn't Sarah's intention. She is just a tad mischevious, nothing more nothing less. I don't feel defensive about it at all, just rather amused, and I find the discussion quite interesting. I have known since I got married that most everyone that doesn't know my husband and I personally are going to assume it was for the golden green card.

The one I didn't guess is that people would assume he is a boy toy. Again, no offense taken, just amused.

Thank you, this is exactly it. I am not being hostile I am a curious person by nature.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

It's seems to be believed that it's unusual for older women to marry much younger men, but people are ignoring it's unusualness and doing anyway it in many cultures. I remember about 6 years ago after my first husband died and I started going out alone, I noticed how many younger men, Arab and otherwise, hit on me day after day. I began to do searches online re the issue of older women/younger men, but got nearly nothing positive or without an "ick" factor. Now, it's all the "rage" and not only in the west. Even in Morocco, there are factions of society where divorced and widowed older women are beginning to be seen as desirable partners. Things change in societies faster than that change in your mind.

[morocco4ever 63]

Couple points:

2) While it's true that menopause doesn't happen till much later in life, fertility starts to decline much sooner. My mom, for example, is still only perimenopausal at age 50, but started having problems with her pregnancies at age 33. Celebrity women still pump out babies in their late forties and fifties, but it's probably worth keeping mind that there's a fair amount of assisted reproductive therapies going on. The rough line is around 35 for peak fertility. It all depends on the individual after that, but it's just not true that a 47 year old woman is just as fertile as a 22 year old.

Valid point, and yes it is true that I am not as fertile now as I was when I was younger. I go in every month even though he isn't here yet, to test my ovulation. It is high for my age, but not quite at peak level. Fertility pills come into play at that time. The first test he did before he agreed to untie my tubes was to test where I was at in the stage of menopause. Luckily I haven't started yet, which is key to getting pregnant.

Although it hasn't started yet, it could happen any day, so one can't take these things for granted when deciding to try for a child. This is the reason my doctor and I decided to go with fertility drugs...can't take chances when you don't know whats on the horizon.

It's seems to be believed that it's unusual for older women to marry much younger men, but people are ignoring it's unusualness and doing anyway it in many cultures. I remember about 6 years ago after my first husband died and I started going out alone, I noticed how many younger men, Arab and otherwise, hit on me day after day. I began to do searches online re the issue of older women/younger men, but got nearly nothing positive or without an "ick" factor. Now, it's all the "rage" and not only in the west. Even in Morocco, there are factions of society where divorced and widowed older women are beginning to be seen as desirable partners. Things change in societies faster than that change in your mind.

I would say that Morocco is one of the most progressive of the Arabic countries. Not surprising that the culture is changing to more of a western way of thinking.

[honeyblonde 0]

Caladan,

I agree with your first point, however I wonder what profession you are in when reading your second point.

I am 44. In July I had exploratory laparoscopy and while my doctor (OBGYN) was in there looking around I asked him to look at my tubes to see if they were a good candidate to be "untied". He looked and even gave me a full-color picture of them (anybody wanna see!?) and told me that they look great. He said he will recommend me to a specialist when I'm ready to have them untied. When I mentioned to him that we would probably wait a couple of years he only stressed that the older I get the riskier it gets that the child will have birth defects, but mentioned none of the other things you talk about.

I had my tubes tied when I was 23, and the doctor that did it back then told me that it could put me into early menopause. When I told my current doctor that, he said that was nonsense. He's been my doctor now since about 1992, and has been recognized as one of the best in his field in this city. I think there can be a lot of misinformation floating around and each woman should talk to her own doctor instead of listening to what she hears on here.

[Bosco 1]

Caladan,

I agree with your first point, however I wonder what profession you are in when reading your second point.

I am 44. In July I had exploratory laparoscopy and while my doctor (OBGYN) was in there looking around I asked him to look at my tubes to see if they were a good candidate to be "untied". He looked and even gave me a full-color picture of them (anybody wanna see!?) and told me that they look great. He said he will recommend me to a specialist when I'm ready to have them untied. When I mentioned to him that we would probably wait a couple of years he only stressed that the older I get the riskier it gets that the child will have birth defects, but mentioned none of the other things you talk about.

I had my tubes tied when I was 23, and the doctor that did it back then told me that it could put me into early menopause. When I told my current doctor that, he said that was nonsense. He's been my doctor now since about 1992, and has been recognized as one of the best in his field in this city. I think there can be a lot of misinformation floating around and each woman should talk to her own doctor instead of listening to what she hears on here.

Actually her second point is right on. Women generally experience a drop in fertility in their late 20's. There is a sort of plateau effect for a number years, and a more significant drop around age 35.

[~Jackie~ 30]

In order for Mohammed to have a second wife he would have to be support us equally. In this day and age, I don't know too many men that can afford 2 wives.

Also, he would have to be breathing I don't see him having a long life if he suggested a second wife.

Jackie

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Fertility for western women as a whole is declining at earlier ages. That means those of us who are still fertile in our "later" years rule!

[Veiled Princess 1]

And this would accomplish what since we have already determined that a proportion of the men we are with are liars out to use the woman they are with?

Good point