dam hoi

[GREEN/TRAN 0]

Here is what I understand the true meaning of Dam Hoi. This is NOT your typical american's "engagement" party. There are so much much works and thoughts put into this ceremony. I'm speaking based on my understanding and the expectation of my families here: Dam Hoi is where my family (the big clan: uncles, aunts, grandparents, nieces, nephews, relatives etc.) meet and greet Kim's family (her clan) for the "FIRST" time. I am not just engaged to Kim, but her family, and vice versa. This is the time where both families would OFFICIALLY accept both of us into the BIG FAMILY, as new member of the House of NGUYEN/LE/TRAN (whatever your wife's family name may be). Before the engagement date was even set and announced to the "clans", my family and Kim's had the "unofficial" meetings and long distance phone calls just to break the ice, discussing the requirement and to define and decide what is "the proper things" to do for Kim and I at our engagement. Long long process! At that time, family's pride runs very high, I don't know why, but if my parents or hers speak the wrong words or say the wrong thing, it could trigger a sense of "disrespectful" to each "clans". Thank God, that didn't happen, but my parents and Kim's were very aware of it! So, I don't know if I can fully explain and stretch how important Dam Hoi is to the vietnamese, but it is MORE important then Dam Cuoi (wedding). Once your girl has the Dam Hoi, it is a sign for all the boys in the "village" to stay away from her, she won't be hanging out with other single boys, the parents of these single boys should stop thinking or coming over to her parents to ask for marrying her for their boys. It's a protection and promise between the two families which their social network and communities highly value and also extremely critical of it if something goes wrong!

For the level of expense and budget... wait, that's not the question here in my opinion. The question is: why do we want to have this engagement. who is it for: the consulate or my families? I say: I want to marry my wife and do ALL the right things for they are culturally acceptable and expected. I do the Dam Hoi for ME and her, not for the Consulate to look at my photos at the interview. That's the bottom line. I careless what the consulate say or criticize my engagement photos. It is what it is, I can't recreate the moment at my engagement to the level of satisfaction that the consulate deems to be acceptable. With that in mind, I would have a DAM HOI that fit my needs. Ask your fiancee how many members of her family her FATHER and MOTHER would like to invite!!!! This is NOT your call, consider this is also her family's chance to SHOW-OFF you and her (as 3AD mentions - social status is a big deal there). With that in mind, you will find Dam Hoi is less overwhelming than it actually is, let her family run the show, it is their show after all. Let the "elders" speak and provide the wisdoms we do not have, no matter how old you may be, this is old school cultures and traditions from the back-country, traced back many centuries, I admit, it was fascinating and interesting event for me.

Back to the question of how much how big Dam Hoi should be: Bring the basic jewelries: diamond ring, matching set of necklace, bracelets, earings, "RED ENVELOPE" (contains cash) in the RED boxes. Don't worry, her family will first "accept" your gift and who the whole families how much you give them for her (old school's tradition), THEN to be generous and showing to your family that they (her family) are also generous and "wealthy", in return, they will give you ALL your gift and MORE gift to you. But at that moment, the gifts are returned to BOTH of you and the extra gifts from her parents are the "sending" gift for their daughter. At that point, both families (yours and hers) are equally respected and fulfilled the "MISSION", nobody loses face! GREAT happy party is await! Let's eat and drink until we can't feel our legs! We had 80 people at our engagement party, plenty of foods and drinks. I can't imagine anyone would spend more than a couple grands for this type of event, any more than that is just a waste and crossing the line into "showing off" land which could cause "envy and unneccessary jealousy" among the families and guests at the party, then they will talk "craps" about your girl and stuff. That's just how we are, the vietnamese. Do it graciously and grace is returned. Humbleness should not be translated into "cheap".

Good luck and I say: do the DAM HOI.

well chuck i cant

im not in vietnam now and wont be going back anytie soon her kom didnt mind about the dam hoi coz im not vietnamese and are dirt poor and all the other facters such as she was labled a cold blood for leaveing her first husband and her family being so far a way i didnt know about that custom so to us it wasnt a big deal.the main thing i wonder if its a big deal to the interview.thanks

[chuckandkim 0]

I can only give you what is considered Propers to vietnamese people. The exception is always expected in this type of marriage, in your case, having a Dam Hoi can only help your case for more evidence of the relationship. I am not talking about being poor or what not, what is being expected of us, when we are married or engaged to a vietnamese woman.

In your case, her mother doesn't care, or doesn't expect to have her daughter to have an engagement ceremony, it's good and bad. Good because of your statement of being "dirt poor", no expense needed. Bad news, HCMC Consulate Officer is not your typical american who believes the american's style of engagement is "Would you marry me, here is the ring" and BAM you two are now engaged. The Consulate Office expects to see an actual Engagement ceremony in most case, in my opinion. Therefore, by giving them the "dirt poor" reason will cause more attention from them during your visa process, they may get tough on your Affidavit of Support evidence and more.

I am not sure I understand the following statement: "and all the other facters such as she was labled a cold blood for leaveing her first husband and her family being so far a way "...

As far as whether or not if it is as big of a deal as everyone has been saying, IT IS A BIG DEAL if you do not have at least a small ceremony and reception. If you search, you will find folks actually being asked about the ceremony and the reception, how many people were there, what kind of foods were served, who were there? Why don't you have an engagement? Why didn't his parents come back for the engagement? Just avoid these questions simply having an engagement, you can't go back for an engagement is something I am not sure it will be deemed as "good reason" in HCMC's typical case.

I hope things work out for you. Yes, it is big deal to have the engagement.

[GREEN/TRAN 0]

I can only give you what is considered Propers to vietnamese people. The exception is always expected in this type of marriage, in your case, having a Dam Hoi can only help your case for more evidence of the relationship. I am not talking about being poor or what not, what is being expected of us, when we are married or engaged to a vietnamese woman.

In your case, her mother doesn't care, or doesn't expect to have her daughter to have an engagement ceremony, it's good and bad. Good because of your statement of being "dirt poor", no expense needed. Bad news, HCMC Consulate Officer is not your typical american who believes the american's style of engagement is "Would you marry me, here is the ring" and BAM you two are now engaged. The Consulate Office expects to see an actual Engagement ceremony in most case, in my opinion. Therefore, by giving them the "dirt poor" reason will cause more attention from them during your visa process, they may get tough on your Affidavit of Support evidence and more.

I am not sure I understand the following statement: "and all the other facters such as she was labled a cold blood for leaveing her first husband and her family being so far a way "...

As far as whether or not if it is as big of a deal as everyone has been saying, IT IS A BIG DEAL if you do not have at least a small ceremony and reception. If you search, you will find folks actually being asked about the ceremony and the reception, how many people were there, what kind of foods were served, who were there? Why don't you have an engagement? Why didn't his parents come back for the engagement? Just avoid these questions simply having an engagement, you can't go back for an engagement is something I am not sure it will be deemed as "good reason" in HCMC's typical case.

I hope things work out for you. Yes, it is big deal to have the engagement.

I can only give you what is considered Propers to vietnamese people. The exception is always expected in this type of marriage, in your case, having a Dam Hoi can only help your case for more evidence of the relationship. I am not talking about being poor or what not, what is being expected of us, when we are married or engaged to a vietnamese woman.

In your case, her mother doesn't care, or doesn't expect to have her daughter to have an engagement ceremony, it's good and bad. Good because of your statement of being "dirt poor", no expense needed. Bad news, HCMC Consulate Officer is not your typical american who believes the american's style of engagement is "Would you marry me, here is the ring" and BAM you two are now engaged. The Consulate Office expects to see an actual Engagement ceremony in most case, in my opinion. Therefore, by giving them the "dirt poor" reason will cause more attention from them during your visa process, they may get tough on your Affidavit of Support evidence and more.

I am not sure I understand the following statement: "and all the other facters such as she was labled a cold blood for leaveing her first husband and her family being so far a way "...

As far as whether or not if it is as big of a deal as everyone has been saying, IT IS A BIG DEAL if you do not have at least a small ceremony and reception. If you search, you will find folks actually being asked about the ceremony and the reception, how many people were there, what kind of foods were served, who were there? Why don't you have an engagement? Why didn't his parents come back for the engagement? Just avoid these questions simply having an engagement, you can't go back for an engagement is something I am not sure it will be deemed as "good reason" in HCMC's typical case.

I hope things work out for you. Yes, it is big deal to have the engagement.

well hopefully i have enough other evidence of a relationship i got her name tattooed on my arm in big inch and half letters and about a year and half worth of western union recepits where i send her 300 dollars amonth maybe that will be enough

thanks for the advice on the dam hoi we didnt preplan every thing before i went

[Mike n Huong 1]

I totally agree with ChuckandKim. I really do think that the Dam Hoi is very important to the consulate, as well as her family saving face. Even if her parents say it is ok not to have one, I would still go for it. This is a tradition in Vietnam.

I know when my fiancee had her interview she was asked if we had the ceremony, which she replied yes. Then she was asked more specific details about it. It would definately in your best interest to have this ceremony.

Good Luck!!!!

I can only give you what is considered Propers to vietnamese people. The exception is always expected in this type of marriage, in your case, having a Dam Hoi can only help your case for more evidence of the relationship. I am not talking about being poor or what not, what is being expected of us, when we are married or engaged to a vietnamese woman.

In your case, her mother doesn't care, or doesn't expect to have her daughter to have an engagement ceremony, it's good and bad. Good because of your statement of being "dirt poor", no expense needed. Bad news, HCMC Consulate Officer is not your typical american who believes the american's style of engagement is "Would you marry me, here is the ring" and BAM you two are now engaged. The Consulate Office expects to see an actual Engagement ceremony in most case, in my opinion. Therefore, by giving them the "dirt poor" reason will cause more attention from them during your visa process, they may get tough on your Affidavit of Support evidence and more.

I am not sure I understand the following statement: "and all the other facters such as she was labled a cold blood for leaveing her first husband and her family being so far a way "...

As far as whether or not if it is as big of a deal as everyone has been saying, IT IS A BIG DEAL if you do not have at least a small ceremony and reception. If you search, you will find folks actually being asked about the ceremony and the reception, how many people were there, what kind of foods were served, who were there? Why don't you have an engagement? Why didn't his parents come back for the engagement? Just avoid these questions simply having an engagement, you can't go back for an engagement is something I am not sure it will be deemed as "good reason" in HCMC's typical case.

I hope things work out for you. Yes, it is big deal to have the engagement.

[martindart 0]

Here is what I understand the true meaning of Dam Hoi. This is NOT your typical american's "engagement" party. There are so much much works and thoughts put into this ceremony. I'm speaking based on my understanding and the expectation of my families here: Dam Hoi is where my family (the big clan: uncles, aunts, grandparents, nieces, nephews, relatives etc.) meet and greet Kim's family (her clan) for the "FIRST" time. I am not just engaged to Kim, but her family, and vice versa. This is the time where both families would OFFICIALLY accept both of us into the BIG FAMILY, as new member of the House of NGUYEN/LE/TRAN (whatever your wife's family name may be). Before the engagement date was even set and announced to the "clans", my family and Kim's had the "unofficial" meetings and long distance phone calls just to break the ice, discussing the requirement and to define and decide what is "the proper things" to do for Kim and I at our engagement. Long long process! At that time, family's pride runs very high, I don't know why, but if my parents or hers speak the wrong words or say the wrong thing, it could trigger a sense of "disrespectful" to each "clans". Thank God, that didn't happen, but my parents and Kim's were very aware of it! So, I don't know if I can fully explain and stretch how important Dam Hoi is to the vietnamese, but it is MORE important then Dam Cuoi (wedding). Once your girl has the Dam Hoi, it is a sign for all the boys in the "village" to stay away from her, she won't be hanging out with other single boys, the parents of these single boys should stop thinking or coming over to her parents to ask for marrying her for their boys. It's a protection and promise between the two families which their social network and communities highly value and also extremely critical of it if something goes wrong!

For the level of expense and budget... wait, that's not the question here in my opinion. The question is: why do we want to have this engagement. who is it for: the consulate or my families? I say: I want to marry my wife and do ALL the right things for they are culturally acceptable and expected. I do the Dam Hoi for ME and her, not for the Consulate to look at my photos at the interview. That's the bottom line. I careless what the consulate say or criticize my engagement photos. It is what it is, I can't recreate the moment at my engagement to the level of satisfaction that the consulate deems to be acceptable. With that in mind, I would have a DAM HOI that fit my needs. Ask your fiancee how many members of her family her FATHER and MOTHER would like to invite!!!! This is NOT your call, consider this is also her family's chance to SHOW-OFF you and her (as 3AD mentions - social status is a big deal there). With that in mind, you will find Dam Hoi is less overwhelming than it actually is, let her family run the show, it is their show after all. Let the "elders" speak and provide the wisdoms we do not have, no matter how old you may be, this is old school cultures and traditions from the back-country, traced back many centuries, I admit, it was fascinating and interesting event for me.

Back to the question of how much how big Dam Hoi should be: Bring the basic jewelries: diamond ring, matching set of necklace, bracelets, earings, "RED ENVELOPE" (contains cash) in the RED boxes. Don't worry, her family will first "accept" your gift and who the whole families how much you give them for her (old school's tradition), THEN to be generous and showing to your family that they (her family) are also generous and "wealthy", in return, they will give you ALL your gift and MORE gift to you. But at that moment, the gifts are returned to BOTH of you and the extra gifts from her parents are the "sending" gift for their daughter. At that point, both families (yours and hers) are equally respected and fulfilled the "MISSION", nobody loses face! GREAT happy party is await! Let's eat and drink until we can't feel our legs! We had 80 people at our engagement party, plenty of foods and drinks. I can't imagine anyone would spend more than a couple grands for this type of event, any more than that is just a waste and crossing the line into "showing off" land which could cause "envy and unneccessary jealousy" among the families and guests at the party, then they will talk "craps" about your girl and stuff. That's just how we are, the vietnamese. Do it graciously and grace is returned. Humbleness should not be translated into "cheap".

Good luck and I say: do the DAM HOI.

YO! drink up

[andrew va thuy 0]

because from what I read, at the interview the decision has already been made ( 98 % ) ?

Andrew,

I'd support this conclusion. The reason being is that my fiance's 221g form, which is the infamous "blue slip," has all of her information neatly typed in (name, case number, date, etc.). The CO that interviewed her already had it in hand at the end of the interview. She just scribbled her signature on it and handed it to my fiance.

Also, with regard to your situation and the dam hoi, you are absolutely correct. Age would have an effect on to dam hoi or not to dam hoi, or at least the largess and fanfare. This is especially true if either or both have been previously married. Thanks so much for the (implied) compliment. I guess it depends on what you consider young. While my fiance is considerably younger, I'm 32 and holding. :-)

Good luck to you both.

3AD

Thanks for helping me put the pieces together. Yes ! You are both youthful. I'm 53 ( check the picture ) - trying to hold on. All the explanations regarding dam hoi have been very helpful. Although my fiance was reluctant to discuss the issue, she gave me enough information to know there is more to be done in this regard. So I am really glad for all the comments that have been made. This well help me better understand and try to address what is unsaid. Best Wishes !

[chuckandkim 0]

YO! drink up

Dzo!!!! Nhậu! Ăn Đi! Uống Đi!!!

Yeah, YO!!!! Drink Up!

[GREEN/TRAN 0]

YO! drink up

Dzo!!!! Nhậu! Ăn Đi! Uống Đi!!!

Yeah, YO!!!! Drink Up!

tell you the truth im just guessing why we didnt have one i didnt know about them she didnt mention it ,her mom and sister came down to meet me for one day and stayed five i wouldnt mind having one if she wants maybe will just have to say we was waiting for aproval from embassy thanks for everyones advice