Returning Petitions to the United States via 221g

[Ban Hammer 13,445]

ok my name is erika my fiancee was denied yesterday for our k1 pettition the reason was the daughter that we thought was his and mine came neg ,they made us do a dna test on our first interview and i did and the test came neg know they gave a second interview which my boyfriend went yeterday they didnt give him a chance to say anything and they just told him te denied the pettion know i want to fight this cus regarless of the test our relationship is true and in our hearts and to all my family and his that is his daughter ,know ive been reading i already send a letter to nvc inquiry what else can i do it still in bogota colombia i need much i will appreciate

how does your boyfriend feel about this?

[bquillera30 0]

not to be rude or anything what he felt about the result of testing is our buisness the question and my urgency is what should i do for the not to leave colombian grounds help will be appriciated

[PlatyPius 5]

not to be rude or anything what he felt about the result of testing is our buisness the question and my urgency is what should i do for the not to leave colombian grounds help will be appriciated

No one can give you advice if they don't know what the hell is going on.

Is the kid his or not? If not, then you certainly can't use the child as proof of a relationship. If it IS his child, then why are the tests coming back negative? If it ISN'T his child, then why does he think that it is? It isn't "personal"; not if you want accurate answers, at least.

[bquillera30 0]

look i said if u read what i said the reason why it was denied was becuase of the negative result know the prior question was not something if it was gonna help ,it was a personal question who does he feel? that is not of help if i answer that

[bquillera30 0]

and im not here to get chewed im here for advise ,what should i do since it just happened yesterday what do i have to do if it not to leave colombia and i gave them alot of evidence we have 4 yrs together the dna test came neg which i in my heart and my family all thought it was my fiancee so now the consuls think its fraude

[Ladylethal 12]

My question is, aren't people with kids that are not from the USC allowed to bring their kid to US on a K2 anyway? Why were they testing you?

[bquillera30 0]

my daughter is here in usa with me they tested her as a proof of relationship

[Minya's wife 25]

my daughter is here in usa with me they tested her as a proof of relationship

If the child is not his, you then cannot use it as proof of relationship...regardless of how you feel "in your hearts". Theoretically, the child not being his goes against proving the bona-fides of your relationship.

During your first interview, were you present, with the child at the consulate? Is that why you were asked to do a DNA test to demonstrate the child's paternity? Normally, the existence of the USC's child does not come into play for the foreign beneficiary's visa application...that is why I'm wondering why the consulate asked for a DNA test at all? I would definitely consult a lawyer as to your options.

Because the DNA results prove that your fiancee is not the child's father, I'm not sure that there is anything you can do to fight the denial of this visa. You may have to wait the process out...have the consulate return your petition stateside(meaning USCIS denies your original I-129F)....and ultimately you may have to start all over....with a new K-1 or get married and file a spousal immigrant visa petition.

Go see a lawyer, preferably one that is versed in family visa petition denials.

-P

[Staashi 371]

my daughter is here in usa with me they tested her as a proof of relationship

If the child is not his, you then cannot use it as proof of relationship...regardless of how you feel "in your hearts". Theoretically, the child not being his goes against proving the bona-fides of your relationship.

During your first interview, were you present, with the child at the consulate? Is that why you were asked to do a DNA test to demonstrate the child's paternity? Normally, the existence of the USC's child does not come into play for the foreign beneficiary's visa application...that is why I'm wondering why the consulate asked for a DNA test at all? I would definitely consult a lawyer as to your options.

Because the DNA results prove that your fiancee is not the child's father, I'm not sure that there is anything you can do to fight the denial of this visa. You may have to wait the process out...have the consulate return your petition stateside(meaning USCIS denies your original I-129F)....and ultimately you may have to start all over....with a new K-1 or get married and file a spousal immigrant visa petition.

Go see a lawyer, preferably one that is versed in family visa petition denials.

-P

This is exactly what I was thinking.

Furthermore, BQ, USCIS/DOS is looking at this as a fraudulent presentation of evidence on your part. You stated to them that you have had a 4-year relationship, whereas your daughter's DNA shows that you actually were unfaithful during these 4 years. Thus, they are looking at your relationship as not passing some type of "smell test". If it smells bad, must be bad. You could just present your relationship as evidence, with pictures, travel documents, emails, phone logs, etc....but the moment you tried to bring your daughter into this, who just so happens to be from another man, you gave prima facie evidence that at one point in your relationship you were unfaithful. This is very disconcerting to the USCIS/DOS...especially if you were trying to claim that your daughter was a result from a visit to your fiance, when you had recently been with someone else. Not a good move on your part. I'm not judging you, I'm just trying to let you know how DOS is seeing this.

Good luck, you're gonna need it.

[U.S. Wendy 0]

For those of you who remember me, you all told me not to refile until USCIS ruled on our first case; I ignored that advise and followed my attorney into unknown territory. I filed a new K-1 and my husband is here now!!!!!

Desperate times call for desperate measures.

I'm still waiting for USCIS to respond to my rebuttal of our first K-1 denial from April 2007.

I sent them everything in January 2008. My case is STILL pending.

Morocco is probably hip to this, so refiling there with a pending petition won't work, but it may work at other embassies where the fraud isn't as much of a problem....and I would advise ANYONE working with another consulate that is not a high fraud post to REFILE!!!

It will be interesting to see how long USCIS finally takes to rule on our first petition.....we originally filed October 2006. If I had waited, I probably would have jumped off a roof somewhere by now. We got married in September of last year and I coudn't be happier.

Hi, congratulations first off. What was your first K1 sent back for? What steps did you do to resolve? We were considering re-filing for a K1, but now are leaning towards getting married in September and filing for CR1. Your input is greatly appreciated, as you are the first K1 I have heard that refiled a K1 and received a visa. Very intriguing.

Our visa was send back for not being a bonafide relationship. We had a lot of red flags and I had only made one trip there to see him after we became engaged. Getting married is a good idea and re-file, but we wanted a ceremony over here and when USCIS had the terrible slow down in visa processing, I just didn't want to wait another 12 months for an approved K-3 petition.

Now, again, we got lucky, this is not the norm for those embassies with high fraud such as morrocco and hochimihn (sp?) but if I were in any other country where there is a small to moderate amount of K-1 and K-3 petitions, I would absolutely refile.....of course when we did it only cost us $175.00, it's considerably more to refile now.

I followed all of the advise here:

1-I contacted the embassy to determine the 'real' reason for the refusal and begged them not to send our petition back, I offered to send more proofs or whatever they wanted.

2-When the embassy refused to keep our petition, I contacted my congressional reps for help. They told me the real reason for the refusal (not bonafide relationship) but they couldn't get the embassy to keep our petition

3-I asked for the number of the diplomatic pouch, the embassy refused

4-I made and FOIA request

5-I contacted and hired an attorney

6-I moved to Albania for (4) four months, went into debt and nearly lost my job

7-I stayed in contact with the embassy when I was over there, continued to beg for help

8-I contacted newspapers, radio and totally exposed myself to the world in an effort to get some justice

9-Four months after the initial refusal, I refiled another K-1

10-I prepared and submitted the rebuttal for the first denied visa petition

11-Finally, I attended the second interview and the visa was granted. I basically told them that I did not intend to leave that country until we got it and I would go to any lengths to get it.

12-We won.

Best of luck to you all.......dont give up. These returned petitions are the best chance these embassies have to ensure that these relationships fail, legitimate or not.

[~kiyah~ 14]

For those of you who remember me, you all told me not to refile until USCIS ruled on our first case; I ignored that advise and followed my attorney into unknown territory. I filed a new K-1 and my husband is here now!!!!!

Desperate times call for desperate measures.

I'm still waiting for USCIS to respond to my rebuttal of our first K-1 denial from April 2007.

I sent them everything in January 2008. My case is STILL pending.

Morocco is probably hip to this, so refiling there with a pending petition won't work, but it may work at other embassies where the fraud isn't as much of a problem....and I would advise ANYONE working with another consulate that is not a high fraud post to REFILE!!!

It will be interesting to see how long USCIS finally takes to rule on our first petition.....we originally filed October 2006. If I had waited, I probably would have jumped off a roof somewhere by now. We got married in September of last year and I coudn't be happier.

Hi, congratulations first off. What was your first K1 sent back for? What steps did you do to resolve? We were considering re-filing for a K1, but now are leaning towards getting married in September and filing for CR1. Your input is greatly appreciated, as you are the first K1 I have heard that refiled a K1 and received a visa. Very intriguing.

Our visa was send back for not being a bonafide relationship. We had a lot of red flags and I had only made one trip there to see him after we became engaged. Getting married is a good idea and re-file, but we wanted a ceremony over here and when USCIS had the terrible slow down in visa processing, I just didn't want to wait another 12 months for an approved K-3 petition.

Now, again, we got lucky, this is not the norm for those embassies with high fraud such as morrocco and hochimihn (sp?) but if I were in any other country where there is a small to moderate amount of K-1 and K-3 petitions, I would absolutely refile.....of course when we did it only cost us $175.00, it's considerably more to refile now.

I followed all of the advise here:

1-I contacted the embassy to determine the 'real' reason for the refusal and begged them not to send our petition back, I offered to send more proofs or whatever they wanted.

2-When the embassy refused to keep our petition, I contacted my congressional reps for help. They told me the real reason for the refusal (not bonafide relationship) but they couldn't get the embassy to keep our petition

3-I asked for the number of the diplomatic pouch, the embassy refused

4-I made and FOIA request

5-I contacted and hired an attorney

6-I moved to Albania for (4) four months, went into debt and nearly lost my job

7-I stayed in contact with the embassy when I was over there, continued to beg for help

8-I contacted newspapers, radio and totally exposed myself to the world in an effort to get some justice

9-Four months after the initial refusal, I refiled another K-1

10-I prepared and submitted the rebuttal for the first denied visa petition

11-Finally, I attended the second interview and the visa was granted. I basically told them that I did not intend to leave that country until we got it and I would go to any lengths to get it.

12-We won.

Best of luck to you all.......dont give up. These returned petitions are the best chance these embassies have to ensure that these relationships fail, legitimate or not.

Wendy?? I haven't heard from you in AGES girl! I was really happy to read your post, I remember all the problems you went through, and moving to Albania. Really I am so happy for you, I am smiling HUGE right now!

You are absolutely correct: "These returned petitions are the best chance these embassies have to ensure that these relationships fail, legitimate or not." ...or this is their attempt to see which ones make it.

I remember speaking to the consulate general, he said this same thing albeit in a different manner. Basically his words were: "I will be honest with you, we get a lot of these cases in our consulate, and I do not question the consular officer's decision to return a file. Many of these files never come back to us, however some do. We may very well see your file again, that is up to you and ultimately the service center."

What this told me is that they return many of these files, quite often they are doing this to see who actually makes it through the return process. Those relationships which really are valid are the ones who have a better chance to stand the test of time and the scrutiny of the process.

...really I am so happy to see your post, still smiling big

Take care,

~kiyah~

[~kiyah~ 14]

For those of you who remember me, you all told me not to refile until USCIS ruled on our first case; I ignored that advise and followed my attorney into unknown territory. I filed a new K-1 and my husband is here now!!!!!

Desperate times call for desperate measures.

I'm still waiting for USCIS to respond to my rebuttal of our first K-1 denial from April 2007.

I sent them everything in January 2008. My case is STILL pending.

Morocco is probably hip to this, so refiling there with a pending petition won't work, but it may work at other embassies where the fraud isn't as much of a problem....and I would advise ANYONE working with another consulate that is not a high fraud post to REFILE!!!

It will be interesting to see how long USCIS finally takes to rule on our first petition.....we originally filed October 2006. If I had waited, I probably would have jumped off a roof somewhere by now. We got married in September of last year and I coudn't be happier.

Hi, congratulations first off. What was your first K1 sent back for? What steps did you do to resolve? We were considering re-filing for a K1, but now are leaning towards getting married in September and filing for CR1. Your input is greatly appreciated, as you are the first K1 I have heard that refiled a K1 and received a visa. Very intriguing.

Honestly, I would not recommend just refiling the K1. If you can swing the CR1, you should do it, this is exactly what we did. However, key to our filing for the CR1 was that the returned K1 was officially CLOSED due to expiration by the USCIS. This gave us the green light to refile the K1, or get married and file a CR1. We chose to take the extra time to get married and file a CR1, not a K3. We wanted them to know we were serious, and we also didn't want the hassle of AOS once he got here, we had been through enough with our returned K1.

If you are wanting to get married and file the CR1, key to this is going to be the K1 closure. Even if you just refile either petition type, the USCIS will most likely approve it. It is the cosulate that will be the problem. They are going to want an answer to the file they returned previously, regardless. They would interview the beneficiary for the new file, BUT they can place it on hold until they get word on the returned file which is why it is important to have closure on that K1 before moving forward. Otherwise you do run the risk of wasting time, money, and causing further delays on the consulate end.

Our K1 was closed due to expiration, and we had the letter stating such as well as a letter from our lawyer addressing that returned file included in our CR1 petition so there was no room for questions regarding the returned petition. I do have a few questions:

How long ago was your K1 returned?

What type of notice have you received since it was returned?

Which service center is handling this returned file?

~kiyah~

[~kiyah~ 14]

and im not here to get chewed im here for advise ,what should i do since it just happened yesterday what do i have to do if it not to leave colombia and i gave them alot of evidence we have 4 yrs together the dna test came neg which i in my heart and my family all thought it was my fiancee so now the consuls think its fraude

First let me say I am so sorry this has happened to you, and I certainly will not judge you in any way. I will only try to give you information you can use to decide what is best for you to do going forward.

It sounds to me like you both thought this child was yours...meaning you and your fiance. The consulate for some reason was led to believe the same. Whether that was included in your original petition, or it came up during the interview doesn't really matter. What really matters is how the consulate has preceived this situation because this seems to be the reason for the return. The consulate obviously perceives this situation as fraud, so they have returned the file along with a recommendation for review and/or revocation.

Second, let me tell you that there aren't a lot of choices regarding a situation like this, the consulate has real evidence (factual DNA test results) they are going to try and use as a reason for a hard denial which can only come from the USCIS...hence the return to USCIS. There is going to be no point in between to stop this return as far as I can see, and the DOS cannot do anything once a file is returned.

I know for a fact that it is the first thing we all think of...REFILE IMMEDIATELY due to the emotional stress this process places on us all, not to mention the lack of information provided when this happens! However, I would wait out this return process for the K1, the USCIS will have to do 1 of 2 things:

1. Let the expiration date pass and expire the original petition. In this event they will notify you of such action in writing. You will then have the option to refile either K1, CR1, etc. If this is what happens, I would treat the new file as if it were a rebuttal of the returned file, the reason for return will come up during a new interview, don't think for a second it won't, it is best to address everything up front in the original petition so it is in front of the CO before the interview is even scheduled, and there is no room for doubt.

2. Review the returned file and send you (the petitioner) an NOID (Notice of Intent to Deny). In this event you will be given a certain timeframe to rebut the consular findings. Due to your specific situation I absolutely recommend hiring a good immigration attorney who is very familiar with the return and denial process for family petitions/applications. You will need to address this situation directly in the rebuttal, and I do have to tell you that this is going to get very personal. You are going to have to explain how this could have happened...meaning how you both really thought this child was yours, and why he or she is not. A really experienced lawyer like I mentioned above can assist you with this, but you will need to be open and honest with him from day 1 about everything so they are able to help you.

I really wish you luck, please PM me if you need more information, I can recommend an attorney you can speak to. Take care.

~kiyah~

[Twisted K 2]

For those of you who remember me, you all told me not to refile until USCIS ruled on our first case; I ignored that advise and followed my attorney into unknown territory. I filed a new K-1 and my husband is here now!!!!!

Desperate times call for desperate measures.

I'm still waiting for USCIS to respond to my rebuttal of our first K-1 denial from April 2007.

I sent them everything in January 2008. My case is STILL pending.

Morocco is probably hip to this, so refiling there with a pending petition won't work, but it may work at other embassies where the fraud isn't as much of a problem....and I would advise ANYONE working with another consulate that is not a high fraud post to REFILE!!!

It will be interesting to see how long USCIS finally takes to rule on our first petition.....we originally filed October 2006. If I had waited, I probably would have jumped off a roof somewhere by now. We got married in September of last year and I coudn't be happier.

Hi, congratulations first off. What was your first K1 sent back for? What steps did you do to resolve? We were considering re-filing for a K1, but now are leaning towards getting married in September and filing for CR1. Your input is greatly appreciated, as you are the first K1 I have heard that refiled a K1 and received a visa. Very intriguing.

Honestly, I would not recommend just refiling the K1. If you can swing the CR1, you should do it, this is exactly what we did. However, key to our filing for the CR1 was that the returned K1 was officially CLOSED due to expiration by the USCIS. This gave us the green light to refile the K1, or get married and file a CR1. We chose to take the extra time to get married and file a CR1, not a K3. We wanted them to know we were serious, and we also didn't want the hassle of AOS once he got here, we had been through enough with our returned K1.

If you are wanting to get married and file the CR1, key to this is going to be the K1 closure. Even if you just refile either petition type, the USCIS will most likely approve it. It is the cosulate that will be the problem. They are going to want an answer to the file they returned previously, regardless. They would interview the beneficiary for the new file, BUT they can place it on hold until they get word on the returned file which is why it is important to have closure on that K1 before moving forward. Otherwise you do run the risk of wasting time, money, and causing further delays on the consulate end.

Our K1 was closed due to expiration, and we had the letter stating such as well as a letter from our lawyer addressing that returned file included in our CR1 petition so there was no room for questions regarding the returned petition. I do have a few questions:

How long ago was your K1 returned?

What type of notice have you received since it was returned?

Which service center is handling this returned file?

~kiyah~

Hi, Wendy, thanks for the update. Again, amazing. Hi, Kiyah, long time Well, India said they returned our petition on December 29. I tried with the senators, and myself making numerous phone calls, faxes, and emails trying to get it kept there. All the way until I received notice on or around January 24th from NVC that they have received our case. It was returned to California USCIS on February 4 when I received an email from CRIS that they have my petition with a request to review, http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=176749 . I now have the hard copy I-797C as of Feb 9. I have since, emailed Marc Ellis who told me to either refile the K1, or get married and file the CR1. Said at this moment, USCIS is no longer reviewing returned petitions after the expiration date. He also stated to never, ever withdraw the petition, which is what my current attorney (who admitted to me recently that he has never dealt with returned K1s only has with spouse and step-children) advised. This can also be found, thanks to Milo, fellow VJer going through the same thing on the Dept of State website. Here is the direct link to the memo: http://www.dhs.gov/xlibrary/assets/cisomb_..._2008-05-23.pdf , see page 2. I am currently in contact with my senators (in queue once again, of course) to see if they can get the "official" expiration notice.

Just another side note, our case was to expire on December 4. He had his interview on November 12, given 221g, we responded by November 14. They reviewed our information, or not, on December 17. Didn't believe we had a valid engagement/relationship, and would not extend the expiration.

Again, Kiyah, thanks for your unlimited wisdom, I would not wish this heartache on my worst enemy.

kaushalia

[Twisted K 2]

edited to add, I have just returned on February 23 from spending 10 glorious days with my baby. loved every minute i think the hardest part is the long distance. i wish there was a way i could spend another 6 months with my company there, but alas, they no longer need our assistance...maybe later? anyways, i do have a lot more evidence if they give us a 2nd chance before September.