Doubts part II

[jordanianprincess 0]

I just wanted to add another thought on this...as we all know the ideas we have in the US, that a man and woman should date for years and possibly live together so they can "test out" what its lilke to be married are unheard of in the Middle East. My fiancee's sisters knew their husbands before they got married, but I doubt any of them could say they were "in love" with their fiancees before they got married (at least in the way we think of love in this country). His one sister told me many times that "If you think you are in love now, wait til you get married, God will give you so much more love." So I think its a commonly held belief over there that love comes after the marriage. Not saying whether this is right or wrong, but just saying that maybe these men aren't exactly "pretending" to be in love, but rather expecting that the real love will come later on...

This is accurate for the most part in some parts. Love usually does come after marriage in the Middle East. However times have changed so in more modern parts people do date, fall in love, and choose who they wish to marry. What you are talking about still exists but more so in villages and not major cities.

I don't think this can be connect to the whole internet dating thing. These guys have decided to go out on a limb and do things their way and most certainly in a way that most families are not used too. The way you described is meeting the future bride and asking her family for her hand (usually after a couple of meetings) and then once they are engaged they are free to date and get to know each other. However long courtships are rare and a wedding usually follows after a few months.

The other way would be a completly arranged marriage where you meet on the same day of the wedding or engagement which is not as common nowadays.

[meauxna 15]

How does this relate to returned petitions?

It's hooked on shonics

O

M

G

!

Best post EVER!

[babybunny 2]

Ewok told me that he closed the thread without reading it in order to calm you down. He was just doing his job babysitting you

How does this relate to returned petitions?

It's hooked on shonics

O

M

G

!

Best post EVER!

dont worry I reported it.. thank you for pointing it out..

[sarah and hicham 3]

How does this relate to returned petitions?

It's hooked on shonics

O

M

G

!

Best post EVER!

priceless. Good one VP!

[AngelK96 0]

Ok, so on topic.

I'm sure that many of us know a person or two who have been used for a visa or greencard. Something I would like to propose is for these people to tell their stories, anonymously, so that for people new to the visa process, they get all sides of the story.

People who stay here are usually those excited about the visa process, or who are continuing along relatively well in their relationships. Those who get screwed will often disappear. I understand not wanting to be embarassed by telling their story attached to the regular user name. If we could collect these stories and post them anonymously, I think it would definately help to round out the view people get here on VJ.

I am not sure if you remember this poster but she married a guy from egypt? and she found out he used her for a GC and she use to post and tell about her story, but a few people didn't like what she had to say. Also JenPrincess came back and told her story of getting used for a GC. Honeyblonde shared her story about her first husband from morrocco. So it would be nice if some came back and shared their stories even if they used another name.

[meauxna 15]

dont worry I reported it.. thank you for pointing it out..

Rock on, shon. Remember the story of the boy who cried 'wolf'? Eventually the wolf got him. Or at least, the villagers ignored him.

You clearly went to the first thread, stirred s h i t and (someone) got the thread closed. Now you come in here for a repeat performance. Buzz off already. You seem to have your up days and your down days, and you're on a low with your repeated attacks. I'm not personally involved & I don't give a rip who 'wins' but I can easily see who instigates, and it is you.

If an uninvolved outsider see it that way, well...

[UmmSqueakster 54]

I do remember all those cases There are a few absolutely horrifying stories out there that haven't been posted yet. I would hope that our community here at VJ can be as supportive of people who've gotten screwed as it is (most of the time) for those of us who are doing ok.

And, if we look at the cheerleading thread, there are a ton of names on there. Most probably fade off into the sunset, happy and whatnot, but some of those people have disappeared rather abruptly Which is not to imply that there is fraud in those cases, but there might me.

dont worry I reported it.. thank you for pointing it out..

Rock on, shon. Remember the story of the boy who cried 'wolf'? Eventually the wolf got him. Or at least, the villagers ignored him.

You clearly went to the first thread, stirred s h i t and (someone) got the thread closed. Now you come in here for a repeat performance. Buzz off already. You seem to have your up days and your down days, and you're on a low with your repeated attacks. I'm not personally involved & I don't give a rip who 'wins' but I can easily see who instigates, and it is you.

If an uninvolved outsider see it that way, well...

I wish we could rep people here. I instinctively mouse around for the rep button and come up empty

Edited October 25, 2006 by rahma

[jordanianprincess 0]

I do remember all those cases There are a few absolutely horrifying stories out there that haven't been posted yet. I would hope that our community here at VJ can be as supportive of people who've gotten screwed as it is (most of the time) for those of us who are doing ok.

And, if we look at the cheerleading thread, there are a ton of names on there. Most probably fade off into the sunset, happy and whatnot, but some of those people have disappeared rather abruptly Which is not to imply that there is fraud in those cases, but there might me.

I have had the same thoughts about the cheerleading list. We should update that. Do a rollcall or something or maybe look at their activity and see if they still even come to VJ.

[sarah and hicham 3]

I do remember all those cases There are a few absolutely horrifying stories out there that haven't been posted yet. I would hope that our community here at VJ can be as supportive of people who've gotten screwed as it is (most of the time) for those of us who are doing ok.

And, if we look at the cheerleading thread, there are a ton of names on there. Most probably fade off into the sunset, happy and whatnot, but some of those people have disappeared rather abruptly Which is not to imply that there is fraud in those cases, but there might me.

I have had the same thoughts about the cheerleading list. We should update that. Do a rollcall or something or maybe look at their activity and see if they still even come to VJ.

I would be willing to help with the list. Hicham is working tonight so I'll be around... does anyone want to split it with me? I'll start at the top and maybe someone can start at the bottom.

[Bosco 1]

So what would you do if someone told you? Knowing myself I don't know if I would believe anyone. People told me my ex was a lying cheat for a long time and I never believed them. Would you even want to know?

If someone had proof I'd want to know... if no proof then I prolly wouldn't believe them anyway.... you know how it is when you're in LUV

Does anyone think interfaith marriages are a red flag?

I think it can be when for example someone is a very strict Muslim and the other half is a very strict Christian.

I don't think this should be a red flag. I think a bigger red flag would be a religious Muslim man marrying a woman who is not religious. If a Muslim is to marry a Jewish or Christian woman, she is supposed to be pious and chaste. They may be going about it differently, but they are both worshiping/respecting/honoring God.

Similarly, something that concerns me is when a religious Muslim man doesn't insist on having an Islamic marriage (there could still be a civil marriage or one that pleases his wife as well). I have heard more than one Muslim man say the reason for this is that they don't really consider themselves married without the Islamic marriage, so while they may be sinning by "fornicating", they don't feel the normal obligations they would to a "real" wife. I know a man who is married to a woman here and has said he will never have an Islamic marriage with his wife here because then he would feel bad when he leaves her. Obviously this is a solid rule, but when this is the case with other factors, I start to wonder.

[jordanianprincess 0]

So what would you do if someone told you? Knowing myself I don't know if I would believe anyone. People told me my ex was a lying cheat for a long time and I never believed them. Would you even want to know?

If someone had proof I'd want to know... if no proof then I prolly wouldn't believe them anyway.... you know how it is when you're in LUV

Does anyone think interfaith marriages are a red flag?

I think it can be when for example someone is a very strict Muslim and the other half is a very strict Christian.

I don't think this should be a red flag. I think a bigger red flag would be a religious Muslim man marrying a woman who is not religious. If a Muslim is to marry a Jewish or Christian woman, she is supposed to be pious and chaste. They may be going about it differently, but they are both worshiping/respecting/honoring God.

Similarly, something that concerns me is when a religious Muslim man doesn't insist on having an Islamic marriage (there could still be a civil marriage or one that pleases his wife as well). I have heard more than one Muslim man say the reason for this is that they don't really consider themselves married without the Islamic marriage, so while they may be sinning by "fornicating", they don't feel the normal obligations they would to a "real" wife. I know a man who is married to a woman here and has said he will never have an Islamic marriage with his wife here because then he would feel bad when he leaves her. Obviously this is a solid rule, but when this is the case with other factors, I start to wonder.

I think its the same in Christianity. Most religious Christians (practicing) don't consider civil marriage the real deal, for us it doesnt count unless its in the church. The civil marriage satisfies the legal aspect of it only. I wouldnt accept to marry my fiance if he didnt want to do it in a church, thats just me.

[sarah and hicham 3]

So what would you do if someone told you? Knowing myself I don't know if I would believe anyone. People told me my ex was a lying cheat for a long time and I never believed them. Would you even want to know?

If someone had proof I'd want to know... if no proof then I prolly wouldn't believe them anyway.... you know how it is when you're in LUV

Does anyone think interfaith marriages are a red flag?

I think it can be when for example someone is a very strict Muslim and the other half is a very strict Christian.

I don't think this should be a red flag. I think a bigger red flag would be a religious Muslim man marrying a woman who is not religious. If a Muslim is to marry a Jewish or Christian woman, she is supposed to be pious and chaste. They may be going about it differently, but they are both worshiping/respecting/honoring God.

Similarly, something that concerns me is when a religious Muslim man doesn't insist on having an Islamic marriage (there could still be a civil marriage or one that pleases his wife as well). I have heard more than one Muslim man say the reason for this is that they don't really consider themselves married without the Islamic marriage, so while they may be sinning by "fornicating", they don't feel the normal obligations they would to a "real" wife. I know a man who is married to a woman here and has said he will never have an Islamic marriage with his wife here because then he would feel bad when he leaves her. Obviously this is a solid rule, but when this is the case with other factors, I start to wonder.

I don't classify myself under any religion in particular but I do believe in God. I do not feel comfortable changing myself just because Hicham is Muslim- I would not convert to Islam to please him. He wouldn't be pleased if I converted to Islam for that reason and we both strongly believe that one should come into a faith their own way and not feel obligated to do it because of pressure from others. That to me is the wrong reason for becoming religious.

Anyways Hicham wasn't brought up in a strict Muslim environment. His family is very untraditional and open to a lot of things that most families would be opposed to. I don't think our relationship would be the same if he was strict. I respect that he is Muslim and he respects that I believe in God but don't associate myself with a specific religion. We are happy that way and it works for us. I think I would have a hard time if he was very religious such as praying 5 times a day and not being able to use vanilla extract haha. I guess it depends on the couple though.

Oh I have a question though. I know a lot of couples where the man is Muslim, not necessarily strict in Morocco but then he moves to the US and starts doing his prayers 5 times a day and stops drinking alcohol. I asked Hicham and he laughed and said that they are thanking God for getting them to America. What do you guys think about men who come to the US and become much more strict? I think I would be dissapointed if Hicham did that because that is not how I know him. I don't think I would love him less I just think it would be a transition for him and for myself.

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

Wow a lot of speculation here about the Cheerleading thread.

Some people break up, this is true. Some break up before the immigration process is complete. Some break up after.

But just because someone doesn't post a lot or doesn't post at all any more is no reason to assume anything. Some people never posted much, or maybe they are just busy with other things now.

Anyway, I appreciate any well-meaning intentions to help keep it up to date. But I want everyone to remember that it's not meant to become fodder for any gossip. It's simply meant to cheer people along as they await an interview date, to note who's approaching their interview so we can wish them good luck, and congratulate/support them as they pass beyond.

Thanks.

-MK

[sarah and hicham 3]

Wow a lot of speculation here about the Cheerleading thread.

Some people break up, this is true. Some break up before the immigration process is complete. Some break up after.

But just because someone doesn't post a lot or doesn't post at all any more is no reason to assume anything. Some people never posted much, or maybe they are just busy with other things now.

Anyway, I appreciate any well-meaning intentions to help keep it up to date. But I want everyone to remember that it's not meant to become fodder for any gossip. It's simply meant to cheer people along as they await an interview date, to note who's approaching their interview so we can wish them good luck, and congratulate/support them as they pass beyond.

Thanks.

-MK

I think you misunderstood what we said. We don't want to start gossip or anything, we just want the list to be accurate and maybe shorten it down a little. We're not going to go looking for people who no longer post to ask them if they were involved in fraud... that's not the point. The point is to remove people who maybe haven't been around in the last year. I don't think that would hurt!

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

I think you misunderstood what we said. We don't want to start gossip or anything, we just want the list to be accurate and maybe shorten it down a little. We're not going to go looking for people who no longer post to ask them if they were involved in fraud... that's not the point. The point is to remove people who maybe haven't been around in the last year. I don't think that would hurt!

There are people who have been on the list more than 1 year who are facing some difficult times. They don't post a lot, but they're definitely still around ! I get PMs from time to time from some of them.

But certainly if you know for sure that someone wants to be removed from the list, or is no longer interested in pursuing a visa process, just PM me !

-MK