Pro Choice?????

[ace13 0]

You can make statistics say whatever you want them to say.... and to say that america is a totally christian country is total #######.... or if they are then why do they let people beg on the streets in mid winter and only ever think of themselves... good christian people that they are....

Also the world may belive in a god but it does not mean they practice religion....

Kezzie

oh, ok Find me one person that is denied anything in this country. There are so many options for those that are down and out and loads of people that volunteer and do social work everyday to help them. Your statement is a slap in the face to all those that work so hard to run those programs. You have a very negative attitude about the world. I am sorry about that. Open your eyes. There are many good things happening around the world. There is still much work to be done and we need more hands-if you are interesting in helping, search out an organization in your community. I am sure they could use more hands, funds, food, gloves, diapers...

And how many social workers have you talked to lately? The world isn't as perfect as you may think. I suggest you walk a day in the life of a social worker.

I do

[Carol&Marc 0]

You can make statistics say whatever you want them to say.... and to say that america is a totally christian country is total #######.... or if they are then why do they let people beg on the streets in mid winter and only ever think of themselves... good christian people that they are....

Also the world may belive in a god but it does not mean they practice religion....

Kezzie

oh, ok Find me one person that is denied anything in this country. There are so many options for those that are down and out and loads of people that volunteer and do social work everyday to help them. Your statement is a slap in the face to all those that work so hard to run those programs. You have a very negative attitude about the world. I am sorry about that. Open your eyes. There are many good things happening around the world. There is still much work to be done and we need more hands-if you are interesting in helping, search out an organization in your community. I am sure they could use more hands, funds, food, gloves, diapers...

Ace, very nice statement!

[Nizzy 1]

You can make statistics say whatever you want them to say.... and to say that america is a totally christian country is total #######.... or if they are then why do they let people beg on the streets in mid winter and only ever think of themselves... good christian people that they are....

Also the world may belive in a god but it does not mean they practice religion....

Kezzie

oh, ok Find me one person that is denied anything in this country. There are so many options for those that are down and out and loads of people that volunteer and do social work everyday to help them. Your statement is a slap in the face to all those that work so hard to run those programs. You have a very negative attitude about the world. I am sorry about that. Open your eyes. There are many good things happening around the world. There is still much work to be done and we need more hands-if you are interesting in helping, search out an organization in your community. I am sure they could use more hands, funds, food, gloves, diapers...

And how many social workers have you talked to lately? The world isn't as perfect as you may think. I suggest you walk a day in the life of a social worker.

I do

wow then i guess we just have totally diff points of view.

[ace13 0]

You can make statistics say whatever you want them to say.... and to say that america is a totally christian country is total #######.... or if they are then why do they let people beg on the streets in mid winter and only ever think of themselves... good christian people that they are....

Also the world may belive in a god but it does not mean they practice religion....

Kezzie

oh, ok Find me one person that is denied anything in this country. There are so many options for those that are down and out and loads of people that volunteer and do social work everyday to help them. Your statement is a slap in the face to all those that work so hard to run those programs. You have a very negative attitude about the world. I am sorry about that. Open your eyes. There are many good things happening around the world. There is still much work to be done and we need more hands-if you are interesting in helping, search out an organization in your community. I am sure they could use more hands, funds, food, gloves, diapers...

And how many social workers have you talked to lately? The world isn't as perfect as you may think. I suggest you walk a day in the life of a social worker.

I do

wow then i guess we just have totally diff points of view.

I guess so. I love what I do. There are many people that just have the worst situations at home and truely bad bad luck and I am happy that we can help them. I would never ever think that their children would be better off dead.

[Kez/JWolf 6]

I have led a very wide and varried life in my 45 + years and if you think that there is so much good in this world then you need to take off your rose tinted glasses and go check out a few places...

You think everyone has oppertunities here in the US... I dont think so it is a fight of the fittest and if things happen to you that are beyond your control there is very little you can do to get back on the American Dream...

And yes I already do all that I can for people who need that little boast... after I have worked at my main job I go 3 nights aweek and help man a food kitchen in south boston where we feed the men woman and children that are abused and forgotten by the good christian country they were born in.... so dont tell me how wonderful life is.... tell them...

Kezzie

[Nizzy 1]

You can make statistics say whatever you want them to say.... and to say that america is a totally christian country is total #######.... or if they are then why do they let people beg on the streets in mid winter and only ever think of themselves... good christian people that they are....

Also the world may belive in a god but it does not mean they practice religion....

Kezzie

oh, ok Find me one person that is denied anything in this country. There are so many options for those that are down and out and loads of people that volunteer and do social work everyday to help them. Your statement is a slap in the face to all those that work so hard to run those programs. You have a very negative attitude about the world. I am sorry about that. Open your eyes. There are many good things happening around the world. There is still much work to be done and we need more hands-if you are interesting in helping, search out an organization in your community. I am sure they could use more hands, funds, food, gloves, diapers...

And how many social workers have you talked to lately? The world isn't as perfect as you may think. I suggest you walk a day in the life of a social worker.

I do

wow then i guess we just have totally diff points of view.

I guess so. I love what I do. There are many people that just have the worst situations at home and truely bad bad luck and I am happy that we can help them. I would never ever think that their children would be better off dead.

I love/am going to love what I do as well but I have seen and heard cases in the system that just makes me wonder what's going on in the world. Despite all the help and support you give someone, it is up to them to take control of their loves and many don't.

[ace13 0]

I have led a very wide and varried life in my 45 + years and if you think that there is so much good in this world then you need to take off your rose tinted glasses and go check out a few places...

You think everyone has oppertunities here in the US... I dont think so it is a fight of the fittest and if things happen to you that are beyond your control there is very little you can do to get back on the American Dream...

And yes I already do all that I can for people who need that little boast... after I have worked at my main job I go 3 nights aweek and help man a food kitchen in south boston where we feed the men woman and children that are abused and forgotten by the good christian country they were born in.... so dont tell me how wonderful life is.... tell them...

Kezzie

You contradict yourself...if they were truely forgotten, there wouldn't be a soup kitchen.

[Miranda&James 8]

I don't see how people can get so mad at someone saying someone will be condemned to hell and the next second say they think they have the right to decide if a child should die because theres a chance their life might not be good? Sorry, seems a bit hypocritical to me. People can say all the way that you're going to hell but those are simply words, I think saying that a child should die because you think (but don't know) their life won't be good is a lot worse! You can't condemn someone for judging you and then say you have the right to judge life or death.....

I'm NOT saying I think anyone can decide whether or not you're going to hell (of course they can't, but they can say it to you but that doesn't mean they're right, just ignore them ) but I wanted to point out the hypocrisy I've seen going on in this thread

[garya505 2]

I've seen children so badly abused by parents that didnt really want them but kept them because they felt they had to "take responsibilty for their actions" and that equated to keeping a child they didn't want as a penance for having sex.

I agree with everything you said, esp. this part. I think it's a bad idea for the government to treat pregnancy and childbirth as a woman's punishment for being a hussy and having sex.

The government isn't restricting abortion as punishment for anything. It's about the right to life of the fetus vs. the woman's right to terminate that life.

I said that as a reaction to many sentiments expressed here, which have amounted to "Well, she made her bed (with ruffled, sweaty sex-sheets), and now she has to lie in it!" My argument was that, among many other reasons abortion should remain legal mentioned elsewhere, a government shouldn't also adopt that sort of position.

As I said before, I think it's impractical and absurd to expect the supreme court to seriously limit women's access to and decisions regarding their own bodies, especially after the right to do so has stood for more than 30 years now. It's a slippery and scary slope and it would open the door to further government control over an individual's person. Next it might be enforced birth control if a woman is deemed to have too many children, then it might be illegal to do certain things that put a pregnancy at risk, like smoke or drink coffee. Once you say that a fetus has rights equal to the right of a born person then it sets the stage for policies that go beyond merely the right to gestate and be born, but also the right to gestate under certain controlled conditions, which would further limit the mother's rights to... well... herself.

It's not about controlling people's behavior or limiting decisions, it's about human rights, and defining exactly who (and what) is human and has those rights. Of course once you define that, limits on behavior and decisions follow.

My personal opposition to abortion is from a human rights point of view, not religious.

Refuse to choose. Women deserve better than abortion.

http://www.feministsforlife.org/

IMO, abortion is wrong. I can see where some cases people want to make it legal such as rape, or in this chicks case (maybe). But still, it is wrong. A child is a gift from God. There are many people that can't have children that would give anything for a baby. I don't care the case, I think adoption is STILL the best option. Someone in my area did that as well, same scenario, she got off scott-free.

You need to do some research on the adoption/foster care system in the US. Giving a child up for adoption does't neccessarily equal giving them a better life. There are some really horrid cases out there and I have had friends who have seen it up close. I think that abortion at an early stage should be allowed as long as the adoption and foster care system remains the way that it is. Children don't get adopted as easily as we would like to think and once they pass a certain age the chances of being adopted decrease. There are sickos out there who take in foster children just for the money that comes with it and the children end up living miserable lives full of abuse and neglect. While there are people out there who "would give anything for a baby" many would rather spend loads of money getting fertility treatments then turn to adoption. Or they just resort to adopting overseas, as is the latest trend.

Killing babies will not solve the foster parent issue, welfare, homelessness, single-parent families, or neglect. Historically, I think it would be fair to say that since abortion has been legal, those things have gotten worse in this country.

If you study slavery, people said that getting rid of slavery would be bad for blacks and even torture because they said that blacks could not take care of themselves and were better off as slaves. They were wrong on that one, too.

Every life is precious from natural conception to natural death and deserves protection. Those that are most fragile-the young and old-who can not defend themselves, need the most protection.

Exactly. A civilized and compassionate society protects it's weakest and most vulnerable from those who would do them harm.

[Saddle Bronc 124]

It's not about controlling people's behavior or limiting decisions, it's about human rights, and defining exactly who (and what) is human and has those rights. Of course once you define that, limits on behavior and decisions follow.

My personal opposition to abortion is from a human rights point of view, not religious.

Good point--this is exactly why I specifically noted the CONSPICUOUS ABSENCE of "pro-choice" protestors near Indian and Chinese embassy/consulates!

[ace13 0]

I have led a very wide and varried life in my 45 + years and if you think that there is so much good in this world then you need to take off your rose tinted glasses and go check out a few places...

You think everyone has oppertunities here in the US... I dont think so it is a fight of the fittest and if things happen to you that are beyond your control there is very little you can do to get back on the American Dream...

And yes I already do all that I can for people who need that little boast... after I have worked at my main job I go 3 nights aweek and help man a food kitchen in south boston where we feed the men woman and children that are abused and forgotten by the good christian country they were born in.... so dont tell me how wonderful life is.... tell them...

Kezzie

The only thing my glasses are tinted with is HOPE. If I didn't have that, there would be no reason for me to go to work in the morning. I hope that #1, the people I work with find hope in their lives. If they have that, everything falls together. And if I can take any stress out of their lives-whether it is paying their heating bill or giving them diapers-I jump at the opportunity. Thanks for what you do, too

[garya505 2]

Killing babies will not solve the foster parent issue, welfare, homelessness, single-parent families, or neglect. Historically, I think it would be fair to say that since abortion has been legal, those things have gotten worse in this country.

A little piece of trivia:

• Q: what right was first granted specifically by NAZI GERMANY?
  
• A: Abortion
  

I'm also going to add my Re. 1 worth: I have NEVER seen "pro-choice" protestors in front of Chinese Embassy (and I HAVE driven by it lately--Red China is a country which FORCES abortions to enforce "one-child" policy; certainly the only one here who has a "choice" is the government) or Indian (country known for rampant sex-selection abortions--from societal ideology; though laws exist against this, very poorly enforced. Tell me how the woman has a "choice" here?). Till I do, I'll consider the term "pro-abortion" more accurate than "pro-choice"!

Pro-choice does not mean pro-abortion.

Of course it does, you just don't like it sounds. How many Pro-choice people are not pro-abortion? Pro-choice sounds a lot nicer.

[Miranda&James 8]

It's not about controlling people's behavior or limiting decisions, it's about human rights, and defining exactly who (and what) is human and has those rights. Of course once you define that, limits on behavior and decisions follow.

My personal opposition to abortion is from a human rights point of view, not religious.

Refuse to choose. Women deserve better than abortion.

http://www.feministsforlife.org/

I've never heard of that group before but it looks really interesting! Their article on Women's rights and wrongs was really good (I dunno if I'm allowed to link in here or not but it's under the topics part of the website under after an abortion).

[garya505 2]

It's not about controlling people's behavior or limiting decisions, it's about human rights, and defining exactly who (and what) is human and has those rights. Of course once you define that, limits on behavior and decisions follow.

My personal opposition to abortion is from a human rights point of view, not religious.

Refuse to choose. Women deserve better than abortion.

http://www.feministsforlife.org/

I've never heard of that group before but it looks really interesting! Their article on Women's rights and wrongs was really good (I dunno if I'm allowed to link in here or not but it's under the topics part of the website under after an abortion).

Yes they are great.

If you believe in the strength of women and the potential for every human life

If you refuse to choose between women and children

Join us is challenging the status quo

Because women deserve better choices

http://www.feministsforlife.org

[no name 1]

thats funny. you seem to think you have a more impartial group in your source

google-americans believe in God and article after article you will see that America is truely one nation under GOD. We are believers, our country is founded on the belief in God and we were proud to proclaim it wherever we could-in our anthem, on our money, in our declaration of independance on our buildings in our presidential speeches, in inaugurations everywhere. You are greatly greatly mistaken if you think we are not belivers in God in this country.

Probably our greatest strength and greatest weakness for this proclaimation is that we are tolerant and welcoming in this country to those of all religions and beliefs based on the simple belief that that is how God would want it. He has blessed this country.

OH PUHLEASE. Take your preaching to your home. This is the land of the free. That means agnostics & atheists too. Separation of church & state, remember that?

welcoming in this country to those of all religions and beliefs

I suppose 'we' welcome Islamics in America? I'm not sure we are so 'welcoming' . Afghanistan and Iraq - good old American Christians were so quick to judge them by their religions...

Once again, why is this thread still open?

Edited October 26, 2006 by devilette