Question about graduate school in Canada

[DeadPoolX 9]

Okay, let me lay out some framework for my question:

I'm a U.S. citizen, and my fiancee is a Canadian citizen. Because we'd like to be together for as long as possible (before getting married), we were thinking about me getting my PhD in Canada. After I've been there for a number of years, attending classes and whatnot, we'd get married and eventually apply for DCF. I know for DCF to work in Canada, the USC needs to be living in Canada for a period of time, and I think it's okay (but I'm not sure; if anyone knows for sure, please tell me!) to be living in Canada on a student permit, and have that count, and then apply for DCF.

Anyway, my main question (in addition to the question about whether or not we can DCF on a student permit) is, if I received my PhD in Canada, and then my fiancee and I moved back down to the United States, would my degree be viewed as something less than appreciable?

I ask because I've read various threads about people from different countries with different degrees having difficultly finding work here in the United States. So I was wondering if I'd be shooting myself in the foot by getting a PhD in Canada and looking to work in the U.S. later on.

Help would be appreciated. Thanks a lot.

[thermophile 0]

I really doubt it, it seems that most of the people that have problems with getting degrees acknowledgd are from non-English speaking countries. bullshit I agree, I'm pretty sure US diploma mills churn out more unqualified advanced degrees than foreign universities do but...

I'm planning on taking my US PhD to Canada as quickly as possible and I know a number of Canadian professors working at US schools. I guess it depends on your area. It seems in the sciences that a quarter to a third of the professors are foreign-but some/many of them could have gotten their PhDs in the US. Why don't you contact professional organizations in both the US and Canada and ask them?

[ceriserose 1]

I'm Canadian and working on a Bachelor still, so I'm not sure how a Graduate degree would be viewed cross-border.

I can tell you that I was just accepted to a University program here in the US and they transferred all of my credits at pretty much 'par'. I have over 20 years of employment history so my schooling plays only a small part in employment (assuming that's why you're concerned about how it looks).

I would think at the graduate level, the type of degree would make a bit of difference as well...many universities in Canada are 'industry-leaders' in various fields.

[thermophile 0]

yeah actually that was something else that you should check, is there someone where you are in Canada that you want to work with? I guess that also depends on your field. I'm in the US because there was only a short list of people that I wanted to have as advisors and they were here. friendly advise: grad school is really hard and can be the best time of your life, it can also really suck if you aren't working on what you're interested in and with people who you like and respect

[DeadPoolX 9]

Well, I'd be getting my PhD in psychology. I'm not sure what emphasis (possibly clinical, forensic, or neuro), but I'm definitely getting my PhD, and I figure it'll be worthwhile to do it in Canada since I'd probably get a great education and be with my fiancee at the same time.

I know the APA (American Psychological Association) accredits many Canadian universities, including the ones I am looking at applying to in the future. So I figure so long as the APA accredits these universities, I should be able to practice as a psychologist, performing psychotherapy and applying tests (in addition to perhaps doing a little bit of research, although that's not my favorite thing--I'd much rather treat patients than be a researcher) in either Canada or the United States.

What worried me though, were the many stories I've read about Canadians with degrees coming down to the U.S. and having great difficulty finding work in their field. Granted, I'll be a USC returning from Canada, but my degree will have been gained in a foreign country.

[larrysgirl 0]

Deadpool,

It will probably depend directly on the job that you will be applying for. I am in the teaching field, and when I applied for a teaching job in the state that I will be moving to, they required all my credits to be evaluated by a company called "ECE (Educational Credential Evaluators)". This can be done on-line, however you are required to submit ALL transcripts (incl. high school). This is regardless of the fact that you have been educated in Canada, because unfortunately there are differences in whether or not they see you fit trained in that particular field. I am not experienced in the Psychology field so I can't really give you advice on that, but as an educator in Canada, you are required to have at least a B.Ed, whereas you can teach in the states without a degree so some places do not recognize the degree. This may affect the pay scale you should be recognized for.

Perhaps you can do some job searching in the state you will living in (if you haven't already) and check out what they need to see from you. It can't hurt!

[DeadPoolX 9]

Okay, thanks.

I most likely won't be a professor. I really don't have a whole lot of interest in teaching or performing research. What I'd like to do is treat patients who are psychologically ill. Of course, with a PhD, all of those venues would be open to me, but I know what I want to do and what I'd be best at, regardless of what I possibly could do.

The two states we're looking at living in are either California or Oregon. This doesn't mean we'd necessarily exclude other states, but when we move down here, my fiancee wants to be relatively close to her family back in Canada, and so being on the west coast is of some importance to us. Visiting my family back in Texas would be fairly easy, as it doesn't cost a whole lot to fly within the country--unlike flying to and from Canada when based in the United States.

[Cassie 8]

I don't have much to offer re: graduate school, but I do believe you need permanent residency status in Canada in order to apply for the DCF process. I'd check with the Montreal Consulate to see for sure.

[DeadPoolX 9]

So being in Canada on a student permit (aka student visa) wouldn't fit the criteria for "residency within Canada for a certain period of time?"

I can't imagine you'd actually have to be a full-blown PR in order to achieve DCF. That seems really sillly. That's telling a USC to jump through several hoops just so s/he and his/her partner can leave the country entirely and move back to the United States. Makes getting PR status sort of a formality, doesn't it? I mean, aren't people who get PR status supposed to want to stay within Canada and live there? Instead, the Canadian government is telling USC's that they have to become a PR for a period of time and then they can completely forsake Canada and move elsewhere. It doesn't seem to make a whole lot of sense, if you really think about it.

I guess I need to check...to make sure and all, like you said.

[Caladan 19]

I'll part with tradition and offer the graduate school end of advice rather than the immigration end of it. (Working on my Ph.D. here in the U.S.)

Some things you'll want to consider:

1) Do you want to be an academic? (You seem to say 'no.') If you do, given that the job market always sucks, it's probably best to check where the Canadian university ranks in comparison to the U.S. schools. (Sometimes they're stronger, sometimes weaker. Depends on the field.)

2) What do you want to do after you finish the Ph.D., and what sort of further certification will you need? Will you need a state license? An APA certified degree? Ensure with the laws of where you hope to end up that either a) a Canadian certification would suffice or B) your Canadian degree would enable you to qualify to test for the state certifications.

My gut says, given that Canadian and American academics move back and forth all the time, that you'll have no problems. But definitely check with the California and Oregon boards.

[Cassie 8]

So being in Canada on a student permit (aka student visa) wouldn't fit the criteria for "residency within Canada for a certain period of time?"

I can't imagine you'd actually have to be a full-blown PR in order to achieve DCF. That seems really sillly. That's telling a USC to jump through several hoops just so s/he and his/her partner can leave the country entirely and move back to the United States. Makes getting PR status sort of a formality, doesn't it? I mean, aren't people who get PR status supposed to want to stay within Canada and live there? Instead, the Canadian government is telling USC's that they have to become a PR for a period of time and then they can completely forsake Canada and move elsewhere. It doesn't seem to make a whole lot of sense, if you really think about it.

I guess I need to check...to make sure and all, like you said.

If you aren't a Canadian permanent resident already, that's what the CR-1/IR-1 option is for, right?

more research is needed, yes

perhaps this thread directly relating to Canadian DCF may help you

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.ph...ic=621&st=0

Edited October 22, 2006 by Cassie

[thermophile 0]

ok totally not immigration, but grad school related. just turned in question 2/3 of my written comps. I'm very happy and really tired, 24hour questions may not have been the brightest idea I've ever had. Anyway, wanted to tell someone but my husband is out in the field and my friends would not share in my joy if I woke them up on a lovely Sunday morning.

[Reba 2]

So being in Canada on a student permit (aka student visa) wouldn't fit the criteria for "residency within Canada for a certain period of time?"

I can't imagine you'd actually have to be a full-blown PR in order to achieve DCF. That seems really sillly. That's telling a USC to jump through several hoops just so s/he and his/her partner can leave the country entirely and move back to the United States. Makes getting PR status sort of a formality, doesn't it? I mean, aren't people who get PR status supposed to want to stay within Canada and live there? Instead, the Canadian government is telling USC's that they have to become a PR for a period of time and then they can completely forsake Canada and move elsewhere. It doesn't seem to make a whole lot of sense, if you really think about it.

I guess I need to check...to make sure and all, like you said.

I believe it is the US government that makes the rules about who is eligible for DCF, not the Canadian government. Afterall, it is US immigration that you'd be applying DCF to, NOT Canada.

An option would be to get married in Canada now, and apply from within for PR as spouse, then once you're finished with university and whatnot, it'll be very quick to apply for DCF. I believe you can do that from a student visa, and keep your student status until your PR status is finalized. Which may take up to a year.

[DeadPoolX 9]

Ah...okay.

Thanks. We might go that way then.

So let me get something straight: We CAN apply for DCF while I'm on a student permit in Canada; in addition, once PR status goes through, my student status is revoked....or I can still attend my university? I ask, because I'm unsure.

I'm pretty sure that in the U.S., if you become a permanent resident while a student, your student visa is cancelled. I seem to recall reading somewhere that this isn't the case in Canada, but I'd like to be sure. I'd really rather not be taken by surprise.

[thermophile 0]

you are combining US and Canadian immigration terms. Which PR are you talking about? If Canadian, then it isn't DCF, you would either get married or wait till you live together for a year then file for common-law. Both of those can be filed for within country. Yes your student visa would go away once you got PR, but the university wouldn't kick you out. the student visa would just be your way to temporarly live in Canada legally, it doesn't have anything to do with your status as a student within the university.

Also, I thought I posted this before but guess not. If you are a Canadian PR married to a Canadian citizen, you can keep your PR status even if you leave the country as long as you are living with your citizen spouse. I'm not sure how/if that applies if you are common-law.