"The Makings of a Police State"

[Leatherneck 693]

Most people don't even realize the Department of Education is only about 30 years old.

They dispute the fact that it's making education "better."

Can you not do simple math?

All the "help" the government gives us isn't free. And if we continue to "help" people, we're going to go so far into debt that our currency will become worthless and, as such, our country's government will no longer be able to "help."

When the government does something.... who pays for it?

When Google, Microsoft, Yahoo!, etc., do something.... who pays for it?

Correct, and if DoED disappeared at 9:00 AM Monday, nobody would miss it, except for the bureaucrats and the dead wood collecting checks.

[slim 1,533]

"Academic" is one of those jobs like "politician." It's supposed to be part-time!

[Leatherneck 693]

Indeed.

Typical.

[CarlosAndSveta 808]

Then you know that I'm for maximum liberty and freedom, and the smallest, least intrusive govt possible.

So do you have a problem with Microsoft, Google, Yahoo! making their flyover data available on the internet? Is something only intrusive when the government does it?

[Leatherneck 693]

So do you have a problem with Microsoft, Google, Yahoo! making their flyover data available on the internet? Is something only intrusive when the government does it?

Be a bit more specific -- what flyover data? The likes of Google maps for example, is that what you mean?

[CarlosAndSveta 808]

Be a bit more specific -- what flyover data? The likes of Google maps for example, is that what you mean?

Google Maps, Google Earth, Yahoo! Maps, Microsoft Virtual Earth.

Edited June 3, 2012 by CarlosAndSveta

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

Google Maps, Google Earth, Yahoo! Maps, Microsoft Virtual Earth.

I know the government doesn't publish "street views" of my property on the internet.

[Leatherneck 693]

Google Maps, Google Earth, Yahoo! Maps, Microsoft Virtual Earth.

You really don't see a difference in a commercial intent and a regulatory enforcement intent?

Speaking only in the context of the EPA doing surveillance over the feedlots of cattle farmers, you have to know they're engaged in such an activity for the purpose of harassing, leveling fines, litigation, arrest and prosecution for any of the mind numbing, byzantine layers of regulations.

Those commercial applications you mentioned have no enforcement component associated with their use, they are available for all to use and they are not in real time, whereas the EPA's surveillance flights are real time, with no congressional oversight.

[Darnell 8,479]

"Diversity don't include Facist pigs!"

I like this one - gonna pitch it into the bumper sticker franchise, see what happens.

feed lots? oh man - major methane collection point, si Man. For about 18K/lot, can install the right gear to collect the gas and use it to generate electricity.

Some farmers already do this.

[CarlosAndSveta 808]

You really don't see a difference in a commercial intent and a regulatory enforcement intent?

Speaking only in the context of the EPA doing surveillance over the feedlots of cattle farmers, you have to know they're engaged in such an activity for the purpose of harassing, leveling fines, litigation, arrest and prosecution for any of the mind numbing, byzantine layers of regulations.

Those commercial applications you mentioned have no enforcement component associated with their use, they are available for all to use and they are not in real time, whereas the EPA's surveillance flights are real time, with no congressional oversight.

I don't see what intent has to do with it. In both cases aerial photographs are being taken without your permission. Why should a commercial enterprise be allowed to make money by invading my privacy?

What is wrong with the EPA doing their job? You might consider it harassment, I consider it doing their duty. But then I work for the Federal Government myself and I guess I might be biased.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

I like this one - gonna pitch it into the bumper sticker franchise, see what happens.

There are bumper stickers all around here that say, "Stop the hate!" and city limit signs that say, "Hate Free Zone", but if you have any Religious, Conservative, Republican, or Tea Party bumper stickers, they will shun you, at a minimum, or try and run you off the road, if they find you on a back country road somewhere.

[웃 910]

I would like to live in a society where the police are not so aggressive. They are like predators hunting their prey....And the prey actually pay them through the tax code to do this. It is very bizarre.

Hiding out in secret locations clocking people for possible arrest, issuing $100s of dollars in fines for disobeying the speed limit by a few mph over, riding around in unmarked vehicles to better catch their prey. It is absurd.

The War on Traffic Citations and the War on Drugs should have ended yesteryear.

If you get caught with weed you are not a criminal. If you get caught with a few pills or even heroin I do not think you should be treated like a criminal, handcuffed, removed from society, thrown into a jail!

You might have a problem if you are into the more harder core drugs, you might need help, but punishment by long jail sentencing is not the answer.

Also, in 2012 you need a license. Period. Your life is done if you cannot drive. A person can serve time for murder, armed robbery, rape, whatever, and they get out and still have their license (as far as I know). But you are going to take away someones driving privileges for not being able to pay a speeding ticket? And then slap more fines on top. This is very screwed up! I have to admit, some people drive a little too reckless, but that is the risk we take when we get on the road.

I know a few people that got DUIs early in their lives and it's been going on a decade and they still do not have a license! It has screwed their lives up severely for a mistake they made when they were in their early 20s. Yet a child molester can serve 10 years and come out of prison with a perfect driving record, license in hand, ready to strike again.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

I wished there were more cops writing more tickets, and Governor Jerry Brown made it happen. People are either completely ignorant, or don't care to follow the speed limits. The highway patrol sits on the side of the freeway, speed guns pointing at oncoming traffic, three or four pursuit cars lined up, all in plain sight, flashing lights and everything, in the middle of the day, on a straight section of highway, and they catch one speeder after another. Power to them! Half the people driving a vehicle out there shouldn't be, as they refuse to follow the rules of the road. We still get people texting or talking on a cellphone with one hand, and trying to negotiate traffic with the other, or stuffing their faces with both hands, while driving with a knee or an elbow.

[Karee 4,191]

I would like to live in a society where the police are not so aggressive. They are like predators hunting their prey....And the prey actually pay them through the tax code to do this. It is very bizarre.

Hiding out in secret locations clocking people for possible arrest, issuing $100s of dollars in fines for disobeying the speed limit by a few mph over, riding around in unmarked vehicles to better catch their prey. It is absurd.

The War on Traffic Citations and the War on Drugs should have ended yesteryear.

If you get caught with weed you are not a criminal. If you get caught with a few pills or even heroin I do not think you should be treated like a criminal, handcuffed, removed from society, thrown into a jail!

You might have a problem if you are into the more harder core drugs, you might need help, but punishment by long jail sentencing is not the answer.

Also, in 2012 you need a license. Period. Your life is done if you cannot drive. A person can serve time for murder, armed robbery, rape, whatever, and they get out and still have their license (as far as I know). But you are going to take away someones driving privileges for not being able to pay a speeding ticket? And then slap more fines on top. This is very screwed up! I have to admit, some people drive a little too reckless, but that is the risk we take when we get on the road.

I know a few people that got DUIs early in their lives and it's been going on a decade and they still do not have a license! It has screwed their lives up severely for a mistake they made when they were in their early 20s. Yet a child molester can serve 10 years and come out of prison with a perfect driving record, license in hand, ready to strike again.

In the good ol state of Texaa you can deferred adjucication for murder. Not DWI.

[Leatherneck 693]

I don't see what intent has to do with it. In both cases aerial photographs are being taken without your permission. Why should a commercial enterprise be allowed to make money by invading my privacy?

What is wrong with the EPA doing their job? You might consider it harassment, I consider it doing their duty. But then I work for the Federal Government myself and I guess I might be biased.

The purposes served by Google Maps and the likes won't lead to fines, litigation, arrest, prosecution and a lose of liberty. You still don't see a difference? However, your bias is duly noted.

If the EPA was doing their duty they could've actually contacted property owners like they had in the past if they wanted to have a look around, rather than engage in surveillance they kept from the public. Nothing wrong with the EPA doing their job -- let them get a warrant if they want to search private property or get congressional approval.

EPA was not merely taking pretty pics of cattle feeding, they were searching specific targets via the stealth surveillance.