Multiculturalism: When Will the Sleeper Wake?

[Danno 1,228]

Scramjet made a reference to Buchanan and seems to agree with Buchanan on issues like multiculturalism. He's not the first one here to say so either. In fact, there are a lot of members here who are concerned or fearful of this country losing its cultural identity. An identity that to them is Christian and White.

Buchanan is always right, let history be your guide as well.

[luckytxn 2,265]

Scramjet made a reference to Buchanan and seems to agree with Buchanan on issues like multiculturalism. He's not the first one here to say so either. In fact, there are a lot of members here who are concerned or fearful of this country losing its cultural identity. An identity that to them is Christian and White.

I don't agree and I am Christian and white. The people on here are a minuscule part of all whites. The racists voices are heard loudest. Let them be the way they are. They were raised differently than us. There is no great white conspiracy. Just paranoia. Buchanan has about 20-30 percent of the GOP voters. Small amount. They have a right to say what they want. Let it go.

[Dakine10 5,452]

Buchanan is always right, let history be your guide as well.

The only place he's right is on a Nolan chart.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

I don't agree and I am Christian and white. The people on here are a minuscule part of all whites. The racists voices are heard loudest. Let them be the way they are. They were raised differently than us. There is no great white conspiracy. Just paranoia. Buchanan has about 20-30 percent of the GOP voters. Small amount. They have a right to say what they want. Let it go.

Let go of what? You mean when people express such views here, we shouldn't scrutinize, challenge, or bring them forward? I don't think every GOP voter agrees with Buchanan, but there's quite a few that post here who agree with Buchanan's extremist views on nationalism and culture. And the relevance to Stormfront is that such ideas as expressed by Scramjet seem more palatable but not that far off from the views expressed on Stormfront. When people come on to an immigration website like this and say multiculturalism has unequivocally failed, they should be scrutinized and asked just what that means to them in concrete terms. Does envision a restriction on non-white immigrants? What does he think should be done if he really believes this country is going to the toilet because of all the different immigrants coming to this country and changing our cultural identity?

[luckytxn 2,265]

Let go of what? You mean when people express such views here, we shouldn't scrutinize, challenge, or bring them forward? I don't think every GOP voter agrees with Buchanan, but there's quite a few that post here who agree with Buchanan's extremist views on nationalism and culture. And the relevance to Stormfront is that such ideas as expressed by Scramjet seem more palatable but not that far off from the views expressed on Stormfront. When people come on to an immigration website like this and say multiculturalism has unequivocally failed, they should be scrutinized and asked just what that means to them in concrete terms. Does envision a restriction on non-white immigrants? What does he think should be done if he really believes this country is going to the toilet because of all the different immigrants coming to this country and changing our cultural identity?

Never said you can't call them on it. Just like you never said I couldn't critic you. You made it seem that most whites are that way and I am saying that they do not. Don't paint such a broad brush yourself. I personally think that if one is prejudice that it is OK and their right. I myself like to know where others stand.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

No reason why multiethnic nations can't survive together. We have done it here in the U.S. In my area one does not have to be white European to lead. Many Hispanics have thrived and become leaders. Also I see many Asians that have not only thrive but become leaders. They also instill values that were once cherished by all Americans like hard work, thriftiness, good morals, etc. The lone difference if anything is the ideas. It has nothing to do with race.

Saying that though I must insist that we shouldn't try to force our ideas on the rest of the world by the point of a gun. I am comfortable with the U.S. withdrawing to our borders here and start engaging our neighbors in dialogue and friendship. Eventually as their wealth grows and we become more entwined in economies we can relax our borders and become as one in a multiethnic powerhouse. We need to stop looking at the race aspect. What is it we are looking for in others? Do they have the same ideas? Can we mesh? What can be done to further our futures together? These are the questions we as a nation should be looking at.

Let the world on the other side of the oceans from us alone and figure out their own problems. Hopefully they will use diplomacy and not war. Our only part with them should be as business and friendship.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Exactly. It has failed everywhere and it will, eventually fail, in the United States.

Will it fail as badly as your punctuation? Then we're in deep shite.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

When people come on to an immigration website like this and say multiculturalism has unequivocally failed, they should be scrutinized and asked just what that means to them in concrete terms.

Funny thing to me is that those with what appears to be racist tendencies like to treat multi-cultural and multi-racial as one and the same. It clearly isn't. You can have a culturally cohesive yet racially diverse society and it will do just fine. Guess that's how our racist members show their true colors.

I agree with the leaders in Europe that the multi-cultural experiment there has failed. Bottom line is that immigration requires integration. It requires some degree of assimilation. Otherwise, you end up with what you see in London and Amsterdam and Paris - growing cells of isolated immigrants and their descendants and all the trouble that comes with it. Integration and assimilation does not mean that people have to convert to the dominant religion, it does not mean that they have to shed their value systems and ideas. It does mean that they'll have make an effort to fit into their chosen society - speak the language, respect the law and get involved with their new neighbors. You can't move to another country, continue to live as you did in your country of origin, expect those that allowed you to enter and reside in their country to cater to you and then grow angry when you're met with resentment. It's all common sense. When in Rome do as the Romans do.

[Danno 1,228]

Funny thing to me is that those with what appears to be racist tendencies like to treat multi-cultural and multi-racial as one and the same. It clearly isn't. You can have a culturally cohesive yet racially diverse society and it will do just fine. Guess that's how our racist members show their true colors.

I agree with the leaders in Europe that the multi-cultural experiment there has failed. Bottom line is that immigration requires integration. It requires some degree of assimilation. Otherwise, you end up with what you see in London and Amsterdam and Paris - growing cells of isolated immigrants and their descendants and all the trouble that comes with it. Integration and assimilation does not mean that people have to convert to the dominant religion, it does not mean that they have to shed their value systems and ideas. It does mean that they'll have make an effort to fit into their chosen society - speak the language, respect the law and get involved with their new neighbors. You can't move to another country, continue to live as you did in your country of origin, expect those that allowed you to enter and reside in their country to cater to you and then grow angry when you're met with resentment. It's all common sense. When in Rome do as the Romans do.

I agree with much but let me challenge your last part.

When a secondary culture in any given area gains enough population, why would then not assert their cultural values, their customs and their language?

Why school a city and their schools which are 90% muslim immigrants not speak what ever language the vast majority want to speak?

If the State of TX. were 85% hispanic, is it reasonable that they conduct Government business in English when due to the loss of ES people no one hardly does anymore?

Why should their Holidays revolve around our historic holidays?

Interestingly assimilation is not the Magic Bullet, as we have seen in many cases across Europe, 2nd and 3rd generation people whose families are from the MIddle east and North Africa, begin to gravitate and embrace the customs, ideas and faith that new Immigrants have brought..... even to the point of becoming enemies of the british people.

[luckytxn 2,265]

Whoa.

[Danno 1,228]

[elmcitymaven 9,712]

Whoa.

I'll blow your mind again with a from me too.

[luckytxn 2,265]

I'll blow your mind again with a from me too.

OMG.

I need to think.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

I agree with much but let me challenge your last part.

When a secondary culture in any given area gains enough population, why would then not assert their cultural values, their customs and their language?

Why school a city and their schools which are 90% muslim immigrants not speak what ever language the vast majority want to speak?

I think that these clusters are a pretty good sign that integration and assimilation doesn't happen. I see this a lot with my wife's fellow country(wo)men - there are areas in DC, Dallas, Seattle, Atlanta, LA where Ethiopians basically live like they never left home. There's no scoializing outside the Ethiopian community, no English spoken aside from the bare minimum required for work, etc. It's not a good situation. I hear a lot of complaints because all many of them end up doing is menial work and they are often frustrated with what they see as a lack of economic opportunity in this country. What they fail to recognize is that that lack of opportunity is mostly home-made, a direct result of their choice not to integrate and assimilate.

What's encouraging, however, is that for the most part the next generation is trying as best they can to fit in. The kids by and large rather speak English, socialize with kids they have come to befriend in school without regard of their national origin. If you were to go down the path you suggest, setting up schools where the next generation is taught whatever the immediate community around them decides, then you'd take away that next generation integration and assimilation that still happens in this country. We ought to hold on to that or the nation will fall apart.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

The problem is that Buchanan (and others as demonstrated here) see cultural identity as inseparable from the people who immigrate to this country, just as they see being White and Christian as an American tradition of identity. This goes beyond any underlying racial bigotry. It's believing that this country was founded by White Christians and our current immigration policies have eroded that foundation. While such views are similar to those from Stormfront, many Americans identify with the sense that our country is being taken over by non-white immigrants who want to make this country look like back home, no matter how much integration or assimilation they willingly go through. You can see some of that sentiment expressed when people insist on referring to Obama as a Kenyan Muslim. They imagine that one's cultural/ethnic identity is a stronger force than whatever America has to offer them. Labeling the President a non-christian foreigner is a way to galvanize such fears over multiculturism - that it's gotten so out of hand, that even the highest office in the land has been stained.

Edited April 10, 2012 by Mister Fancypants