FRE requesting Marriage Certificate for me and my fiance

[tcTTct 37]

The problem for the OP is that he did indeed have a wedding ceremony for his fiancée's family's sake but it was not an official one with paperwork. He then sent these "wedding" photos to USCIS. The HCM consulate usually requires an Engagement ceremony. It's very hard to explain that wedding pictures are not wedding pictures.

[JimVaPhuong 4,863]

While what you did may be expected at the consulate it is not expected at USCIS. Your only option is to explain it is NOT a wedding but a traditional Vietnamese engagement ceremony. (If that is what it was) Attach some references of what this is and re-state you have never been married (IF you have never been married)

If what you had WAS a wedding then it is accepted by the US and you will have to repeat the wedding, get a marriage certificate and file for a CR-1

This is more serious than just a traditional engagement ceremony. They did have the engagement ceremony in October, and THEN had the wedding ceremony in February. USCIS adjudicators have some familiarity with the customs in different countries. I'm sure they've seen pictures of the engagement ceremony in Vietnam many times. I included several photos from my own engagement ceremony with the petition package. Only someone who knew absolutely nothing about Vietnamese culture, and couldn't be bothered to spend a few minutes finding out, would have thought it was a wedding ceremony. There were signs all over the venue that said "The Engagement" (in Vietnamese).

The OP's problem stems from the fact that there were two ceremonies months apart. NOBODY in Vietnam has two engagement ceremonies. Apparently, he even indicated that the photos from the February visit were for a wedding. USCIS is correct to send an RFE in this case. Even if USCIS ultimately approves the petition, I can see this being a dead stop at the consulate. What Tim has done is walked half way between the K1 and CR1, and I doubt the consulate will let him get away with it. I strongly suspect they'll tell him to finish the marriage in Vietnam by having it registered and refile for a CR1.

[tthomas 0]

The picture that I sent was a picture of my fiance in a wedding dress with my father that we took a few day before the engagement ceremony. I chose very poorly when I labeled it, "Sister Jackie, Hiep, me and father before wedding photos".

We were dressed like that because we hired a photographer to take photos so that we could have a wedding album and also a big picture outside the wedding party in the future. We took the pictures on that trip because we were in a very beautiful setting and also we would have had to rush them for the future occasion. We did indeed have a wedding party on our next trip but that was after we had already sent the packet in so the packet did not have any picture of the wedding party that had not happened yet.

I had no idea that having a wedding party would be a problem. Once we had an engagement party my fiance's family was very insistent that we have the wedding party as soon as possible. There were two dates that the astrologers (I'm not sure if that is the proper word) that were consulted by her aunt said would be good for the wedding. Her father asked asked to do it sooner than later because his health is failing. So we had a wedding party in February. Trouble aside it was a wonderful experience. It brought me much closer to her family.

I met with an immigration attorney. Here is the plan that was decided on:

-- We will each provide documentation from our governments that we are single.

-- To the request for a marriage certificate we will each reply to the specific request saying that we cannot provide the requested documentation because we are not married.

-- To the request for divorce or death certificates showing termination of prior marriage, we will each reply that we cannot provide this because we have never been married.

-- I will send an explanation along with the picture explaining that this picture is taken for a wedding photo shoot and are not of a wedding. And that the other pictures that look like a wedding are the engagement ceremony.

I think I am going to have to mention that we have had a wedding party and hope that they will let us continue. I do not want to risk any kind of deception by lack of disclosure and risk getting flagged as fraud.

I was thinking that if we got to the consulate in HCMC that that wedding party would not be a problem but from the latest comments I am suspecting that I am wrong about that. If we need to start over and file for a CR1 it would be better to start now than get all the way to the interview and then start over.

[confusedasheck 21]

I was thinking that if we got to the consulate in HCMC that that wedding party would not be a problem but from the latest comments I am suspecting that I am wrong about that. If we need to start over and file for a CR1 it would be better to start now than get all the way to the interview and then start over.

I'm not sure if you can file a K1 and a IR1/CR1 at the same time. I think you'd have to withdraw the K1, get the marriage cert, and then file for the IR1/CR1.

[tcTTct 37]

@tthomas - I think you need to stop using the word wedding. If you yourself believe this was a wedding how could you convince USCIS and the consulate it wasn't a wedding? You need to convince yourself and your girl that this was just an engagement party that had certain photos in a wedding like dress because it was part of the rental ans photo package. Otherwise I see a long wait for a denial and a long process of actually getting married and filing for IR1/CR1 in the future.

This is what happens when uninformed parents/aunts etc assert pressure on the couple without realizing that they ate doing more harm than good.

[Ronnie&Hang 12]

I was thinking that if we got to the consulate in HCMC that that wedding party would not be a problem but from the latest comments I am suspecting that I am wrong about that. If we need to start over and file for a CR1 it would be better to start now than get all the way to the interview and then start over.

Hey Tim..for now go with Plan A like you proposed and provide all the docs to satisfy the RFE for USCIS. IMO..hopefully it should be fine.

At the Consulate stage, the 'wedding' photos should not be a significant issue. You will have an opportunity to address it at the interview if it ever comes up. I submitted a stack of wedding banquet photos to show both families participation. The CO went through it in front of me and included it in the file. We have no problem with that issue for our K1 case.

Don't stress out too much..One thing at the time, don't talk about jumping to CR1 just yet...even if it will work..good lucks!!!

[tthomas 0]

Hey Tim..for now go with Plan A like you proposed and provide all the docs to satisfy the RFE for USCIS. IMO..hopefully it should be fine.

At the Consulate stage, the 'wedding' photos should not be a significant issue. You will have an opportunity to address it at the interview if it ever comes up. I submitted a stack of wedding banquet photos to show both families participation. The CO went through it in front of me and included it in the file. We have no problem with that issue for our K1 case.

Don't stress out too much..One thing at the time, don't talk about jumping to CR1 just yet...even if it will work..good lucks!!!

Thanks for the encouragement. This is the plan that my fiance has suggested as well. She has seen many on the Vietnamese forums that have had wedding parties and submitted photos to the consulate. If we can get past the USCIS then she thinks it will not be a problem based on others' experiences. She also encouraged me to just respond to what they asked for and not mention any more.

Here is the current plan:

Respond to RFE with

-- letter explaining that the photo was of us in rented outfit for a hired photographer prior to the dam hoi, including the photo that caused the confusion

-- letter explaining why we cannot provide certificate of marriage and termination of marriage, along with certificates of single status from both our governments.

With the first letter I may also include a photo from the engagement party that she is wearing a white dress and explain that it is only a dam hoi ceremony.

Hopefully I will update the post in the future with good new or whatever the results are.

Tim T

[tthomas 0]

Hi All,

I just want to let everyone know that it all worked out. The suggestion by Gary And Alla and others that agreed was what worked. We sent in a clear explanation letting them know what we did and why and they did not give us any more trouble about it. We were nervous that it might come up at the interview but it did not and the interview was very easy. I think part of that was becuause we were very well prepared and did not have any other red flags.

I would suggest people avoid doing what I did here but in the end it was alright.

Thanks everyone for the useful advise. Especially the calming advise.

Best Wishes,

Tim and Hiep