Atheists likely to outnumber Christians in England in 20 years

[Leatherneck 693]

Why not leave early and avoid the rush?

Because in twenty years, it'll be pretty crowded.

[james&olya 1,121]

While the pic is cool the point is lacking.

Everywhere you find Communism you find Atheism at it core and often scores of dead corps as well.

The pic you posted is kinda interesting because it so rare.

In fact it was the huge parts of the Christian Church which brought forth the idea that Blacks and others had value as humans.

If you doubt that you really don't know your history.

Uh, Danno, maybe you haven't heard but communism is really on its way out! It is getting really hard to find anything that Marx would want to identify with! Of course you are right that communism did usually result in scores of dead corporations!

I think the demise of slavery was not because of but rather in spite of the influence of the church! Secular humanism denounces the basis for justifying slavery more than does the bible! The value of "Blacks and others" was recognized long before any huge parts of your church got with the program!

While Christianity has done many good things and has some rather noble principles at its core, these principles are espoused by many non-christian and non-religious people as well! It may upset you greatly to consider this, but many would say that rather than god creating man, it was man that created god! Both what is good, as well as what is bad, in the hearts of men, are manifested in the actions and positions of their churches. This would apply to both the justifications for slavery in times past, as well as in those who used their churches to fight this evil! You like to attribute this good to an entity outside of yourself but the atheist or agnostic recognizes this is a part of each one of us as humans. My personal observation has been that there is roughly the same amount of 'goodness' and 'evil' manifested by christian, non-christian, and atheist alike!

[Danno 1,228]

Hehe....where the hell did you read that? Maybe you are reading textbooks from the 19th century, because that interpretation certainly isn't part of the current historiography. In fact, you have it bass-ackwards (a habit of yours?). The second great awakening and general church activism in the early 1800s are often cited as a factor in the spread of abolitionist sentiment.

Actually, I think you just pulled that out of your azz- another (yawn) small-minded and bigoted rant against something you don't understand.

It is bigotry and I rarely use that term.

History is very clear on the various forces which set the historic precedence of ending human bondage.

[Dakine10 5,452]

While the pic is cool the point is lacking.

Everywhere you find Communism you find Atheism at it core and often scores of dead corps as well.

The pic you posted is kinda interesting because it so rare.

In fact it was the huge parts of the Christian Church which brought forth the idea that Blacks and others had value as humans.

If you doubt that you really don't know your history.

I don't see your point either. No one asserted that the UK is going to become a communist society. If you want to make the point that all communist societies are atheist, that probably merits it's own thread, because it has nothing to do with the topic at hand. Personally, I do know a some religious communists.

If you saying an atheist society would have to end up like the Soviet Union, I disagree, and I don't think there is even any merits in that discussion. The Soviet Communists were a totalitarian regime. There are many examples of both secular and non-secular totalitarian goverments. It's the totalitarian dogma thats bad, not the secularity. Hence my point about not using extreme examples.

[Danno 1,228]

I don't see your point either. No one asserted that the UK is going to become a communist society. If you want to make the point that all communist societies are atheist, that probably merits it's own thread, because it has nothing to do with the topic at hand. Personally, I do know a some religious communists.

If you saying an atheist society would have to end up like the Soviet Union, I disagree, and I don't think there is even any merits in that discussion. The Soviet Communists were a totalitarian regime. There are many examples of both secular and non-secular totalitarian goverments. It's the totalitarian dogma thats bad, not the secularity. Hence my point about not using extreme examples.

Forgive me, I should have better indicated my Stalin posting was mostly in jest.

If one were to look at the decline of Great Briton over the last two centuries and continue that sloping line, it would be apparent that by the time

Atheists did rule the place, it will be the equivalent of running Estonia yet with more debt.

Again the most intelligent among us want to proceed as if history is not our guide to the future.

Where are the Great civilizations that we would want to emulate built on Atheism?

There is a reason the plant never bloomed, and even if Atheists where to have the good fortune of being handed an already built society, it would go the way detroit has gone once in incapable hands.

There are certain things which build and unify societies and other things which actively or inactively degrade a society.

Atheism is a declining influence, one need only look at how little Atheists contribute to their community. There has been vast research on this topic and when it gets down to the local community -THe Cell if you will, the non contributing atheist takes the seat of a contributing person of faith. They volunteer less the give to charity way less, they tend to have less kids but reap the benefits Social security.

Their frivilas lawsuits bankrupt or, under threat of the legal costs cause communities to bend to their demands, stripping away traditions and culture which the vast majority want. I really could go on and on.

Now, it's not that I don't like them or think they are out to destroy ..... it's just they (on the whole) are not conducive to the community and they are more likely to be permissive of other things which Libertarians love in concept but have yet to reside under such things in real life.

FOr example compare the French Revolution to ours to get as small taste of how a people whose principles are not fixed on any certain thing can drift from mood to mood and in the end we saw the basket fill with the heads of both men and women.

How is it so easy for the Communists to slaughter millions?

They have no concept human value except as a useful member in their society, if you become a "wrecker" (one who does not build up the communist ideas) you are reeducated or eliminated.

THis is going on NOW.

[dustingthestars 9]

Every year that passes in the UK, it becomes more an more secular. I think it's a good thing. The State and Religion must definitely, in my opinion, be keep separate.

I think personal worship is great for the individual. What I object to is having it rammed down my throat by those that insist I will benefit from it.

[Danno 1,228]

Every year that passes in the UK, it becomes more an more secular. I think it's a good thing. The State and Religion must definitely, in my opinion, be keep separate.

I think personal worship is great for the individual. What I object to is having it rammed down my throat by those that insist I will benefit from it.

And yet you and all people of the UK have benefited from it.

Take a stroll through history and tell me at what point the heavy hand of religion became un acceptable in that part of the world, and then tell me which country took a better path so that we might see how wonderful things might have been?

[Trompe le Monde 1,107]

And yet you and all people of the UK have benefited from it.

Take a stroll through history and tell me at what point the heavy hand of religion became un acceptable in that part of the world, and then tell me which country took a better path so that we might see how wonderful things might have been?

I'd say you haven't studied the 16 century in British history or recent history in Northern Ireland

Edited March 11, 2012 by Trompe le Monde

[dustingthestars 9]

And yet you and all people of the UK have benefited from it.

Take a stroll through history and tell me at what point the heavy hand of religion became un acceptable in that part of the world, and then tell me which country took a better path so that we might see how wonderful things might have been?

At what point did I imply that I had received a benefit or that any of my fore-bearers did? I would, like another said, check your English and Irish history.

History isn't something I can or want to change. Many countries have blood in their hands in the name of a religion or a belief in something. All we can do is talk about now and what we want from our own personal futures.

Edited March 11, 2012 by dustingthestars

[Boiler 46,108]

I do not know the number of Atheists in the UK, it must be well less than 1% of the population.

I do not know anybody who is an Atheist. Well nobody who ever mentioned it anyway.

[dustingthestars 9]

I'm not sure that Atheist is the right term for it any longer. Where do we put the people that are undecided? or those that attend church out of obligation for the 'holidays' like Easter, Christmas, and so on?

A lot of people I know don't like the Atheist term as it has a certain cogitation, like you're an outsider from the norm.

Does any one else agree that religion, at least in the Western world is becoming less relevant in terms of work, membership of organisations and in government?

[Boiler 46,108]

I'm not sure that Atheist is the right term for it any longer. Where do we put the people that are undecided? or those that attend church out of obligation for the 'holidays' like Easter, Christmas, and so on?

C of E

[dustingthestars 9]

C of E

Oh, Boiler! That made me laugh - when somebody doesn't have a religion in the UK, people just say ' you must be C of E, then?'. It is the religion for the uncommitted!

People consider C of E 'less offensive' than the likes of Catholicism, Islam and Judaism I think?

Edited March 11, 2012 by dustingthestars

[IR5FORMUMSIE 850]

Oh, Boiler! That made me laugh - when somebody doesn't have a religion in the UK, people just say ' you must be C of E, then?'. It is the religion for the uncommitted!

People consider C of E 'less offensive' than the likes of Catholicism, Islam and Judaism I think?

And the rest should be committed? Religion is a personal dialogue with your deity or deities as the case may be, nothing more and nothing less.

And yet you and all people of the UK have benefited from it.

Take a stroll through history and tell me at what point the heavy hand of religion became un acceptable in that part of the world, and then tell me which country took a better path so that we might see how wonderful things might have been?

Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition!

[Boiler 46,108]

I am not sure you understand what Atheism is, it is a belief system.